DUST Search - Revamp Dropsuit Role Bonuses

Aeon Amadi wrote:

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

I think a better effort is to try to theme every race up and select a bunch of bonuses that best suits them.

Right, but you also have to bear in mind that each race has it's own combat philosophy. Gallente specializing in close up combat with high damage (I won't bring up drones as they need a drastic upgrade) and armor modules that don't reduce their speed.

The reduction to CPU/PG on Hybrid weapons is great, I can fit Prototype gear on an Advanced level suit and still have room to fit other Advanced gear.

Albeit, the Shield recharge bonus is absolutely useless on a 120 HP suit with only a few high slots.

Going with a theme is cool and all but you have to remember that Assault suits are a theme in and of themselves - they're combat specialists. Logistics are a theme, and that's (supposed to be) support. Heavy's are -supposed- to be the grand master of Point Defense but they always wind up being something different.

Themes are Suit Type.
Specialization is the combination of both Theme and Combat Philosophy.

We need -more- specialization, imo.

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Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 810	Posted - 2013.05.16 16:38:00 - [1] - Quote So lets talk about Dropsuit Racial bonuses. Right now there is a big problem with Logistics and Assault suits. Logistics are considerably stronger than Frame suits due to their high durability bonuses. Assault suits on the other hand are rarely used at all because theyGÇÖre too similar to Frame suits and their bonuses are simply not worth the train time in most cases. As such there is little incentive to move beyond Frame suits unless youGÇÖre going Logistics. As such the suits really need to be revamped. So. There is a lot of good stuff and a lot of messed up stuff in here. -Assault suits are all encouraged to shield tank, despite both Gallente and Amarr traditionally not being shield tanked -Caldari Assault suits get reload speed which is sorta useful but not much of an incentive -Minmatar Assault magazine size on sidearms is...interesting I guess, but again not all that useful in most cases -Gallente resource cost is actually not bad, but could be better -Amarr basically gets the best deal because its race specific skills essentially boosts the direct lethality of laser weapons, while the other races have a pretty underwhelming bonus. -Logistics suits get the bonus to repair tool rate which is great but I'd like to see this fleshed out and diversified for all support equipment -I actually like all of the race specific bonuses for logistics suits, I think it fits the races well. -Scout Suits get reduced scan profile which is good, though i think it could be changed a bit to fit the races better -Scout racial bonuses are pretty good, Gallente is more of a scanner while Minmatar is more of an assassin. Basically I don't like the blanket bonuses that are applied to all suits of the same class, despite the race. I think it flatlines the different suits too much and makes them too similar to one another. The last thing we want is for certain suits to be unused because they're simply inferior due to another suit being similar enough but better to be a clear replacement. I like the two skill system, I think that's interested, but even the general Assault Suit skill should offer a difference bonus to each suit as to make it more in line with traditional racial bonuses. General Suit Skill should offer a more base bonus, tailored more towards survivability in most cases. Race Specific Suit Skills should offer a more specific bonus, more in line with traditional race bonuses and more of a utility bonus to that race and suit. Here are my suggested bonuses, I've purposefully neglected putting in actual values since that's more of a balance issue than I want to tackle at this time. ASSAULT SUITS: Amarr -Increased Armor Plate Efficacy / Lvl Amarr Medium Suits -Increased Cooldown Rate of Laser Weapons / Lvl Amarr Assault Caldari -Increased Shield Extender Efficacy / Lvl Caldari Medium Suits -Increased Effective Range of Hybrid Weapons / Lvl Caldari Assault Gallente -Increased Armor Repair module Efficacy / Lvl Gallente Medium Suits -Increased Damage of Hybrid Weapons / Lvl Gallente Assault Minmatar -Increased Shield Recharge Rate / Lvl Minmatar Medium Suits -Increased Stamina and Recovery / Lvl Minmatar Assault LOGISTICS: Amarr -Increased Armor Repair module Efficacy / Lvl Amarr Medium Suits -Increased Armor-on-Revive for Injectors / Lvl of Amarr Logistics Caldari -Increased Shield Extender Efficacy / Lvl Caldari Medium Suits -Increased Nanite Cluster Capacity for Nanohives / Lvl of Caldari Logistics Gallente -Decreased CPU/PG cost of Equipment / Lvl Gallente Medium Suits -Decreased Spawn time for Drop Uplinks / Lvl Gallente Logistics Minmatar -Increased hacking speed / Lvl Minmatar Medium Suits -Increased repair rate of repair tools / Lvl Minmatar Logistics SCOUT: Gallente -Decreased Scan Profile / Lvl Gallente Light Suits -Increased Scan Radius / Lvl Gallente Scouts Minmatar -Increased Sprint Speed / Lvl Minmatar Light Suits -Increased Melee and Nova Knife damage / Lvl Minmatar Scouts SENTINAL: Amarr -Increased Heavy Weapon Reload Speed / Lvl Amarr Heavy Suits -Increased Efficacy of Armor Plates / Lvl Amarr Sentinals Also on a semi unrelated note, can we get the Armor Honeycombing Skill in Dust? Pretty please?
Zero Avis D3ath D3alers RISE of LEGION 6	Posted - 2013.05.16 17:58:00 - [2] - Quote Would be nice but the Amarr/Gallente Logi is kind of backwards Amarr get DU bouns while Gallente get the Injector bouns. DU is Amarr tech after all. Also the range thing for Cal is a bit uneasy
David Spd Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 61	Posted - 2013.05.16 18:29:00 - [3] - Quote Range and damage are stats tied to weapons, not dropsuits. Reload speed is based on the suit's dexterity and speed (accuracy of body movements and the quickness of the movement). Giving damage to a dropsuit only makes sense for nova knives which all ready is in the game.
BursegSardaukar Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 153	Posted - 2013.05.16 19:09:00 - [4] - Quote While I'm not 100% behind every bonus listed, you are headed in a great direction. +1
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 810	Posted - 2013.05.16 19:13:00 - [5] - Quote David Spd wrote: Range and damage are stats tied to weapons, not dropsuits. Reload speed is based on the suit's dexterity and speed (accuracy of body movements and the quickness of the movement). Giving damage to a dropsuit only makes sense for nova knives which all ready is in the game. By that logic the current Amarr Assault suit bonus doesn't make much sense either. Not saying these bonuses are the best, but there needs to be a better incentives for Assault suits at the very least.
David Spd Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 61	Posted - 2013.05.16 19:21:00 - [6] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: David Spd wrote: Range and damage are stats tied to weapons, not dropsuits. Reload speed is based on the suit's dexterity and speed (accuracy of body movements and the quickness of the movement). Giving damage to a dropsuit only makes sense for nova knives which all ready is in the game. By that logic the current Amarr Assault suit bonus doesn't make much sense either. Not saying these bonuses are the best, but there needs to be a better incentives for Assault suits at the very least. You mean the overheating thing? I agree, but at the same time aren't all itrms that benefit from that bonus also Amarr design? May not make perfect sense but at least there's some synergy between the suit and weapon.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 4732	Posted - 2013.05.16 19:33:00 - [7] - Quote I think a better effort is to try to theme every race up and select a bunch of bonuses that best suits them.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 810	Posted - 2013.05.16 20:28:00 - [8] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I think a better effort is to try to theme every race up and select a bunch of bonuses that best suits them. Well that was the general idea. Amarr has armor and lasers, Gallente have Armor and Hybrid, Caldari have Shields and Hybrid, Minmatar have Shields usually and Projectile (Though the lack of light projective weapons is lacking, hence the endurance/speed in order to reflect the Minmatar speed tanking.)
Aeon Amadi Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 1404	Posted - 2013.05.16 21:58:00 - [9] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I think a better effort is to try to theme every race up and select a bunch of bonuses that best suits them. Right, but you also have to bear in mind that each race has it's own combat philosophy. Gallente specializing in close up combat with high damage (I won't bring up drones as they need a drastic upgrade) and armor modules that don't reduce their speed. The reduction to CPU/PG on Hybrid weapons is great, I can fit Prototype gear on an Advanced level suit and still have room to fit other Advanced gear. Albeit, the Shield recharge bonus is absolutely useless on a 120 HP suit with only a few high slots. Going with a theme is cool and all but you have to remember that Assault suits are a theme in and of themselves - they're combat specialists. Logistics are a theme, and that's (supposed to be) support. Heavy's are -supposed- to be the grand master of Point Defense but they always wind up being something different. Themes are Suit Type. Specialization is the combination of both Theme and Combat Philosophy. We need -more- specialization, imo.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 810	Posted - 2013.05.16 23:39:00 - [10] - Quote That's an excellent way to put it Aeon. So lets go over the "theme" of each Specialty Assault: General attacking, the balance of damage output and mobility. Light Weapon Damage / Lvl Logistics: Support Specialists, medics and engineers. Reduced PG/CPU Cost of Equipment / Level Sentinels: Point Guards, defensive role Damage Reduction / Lvl Scouts: Intel and scouting Increased Scanning / Lvl Now the Racial themes: Caldari: Shield Tanking, Long Range + Low Damage, Hybrid Weapons + Missiles Gallente: Armor Tanking, Short Range + High Damage, Hybrid Weapons + Drones Minmatar: Shield/Speed Tanking, Low Defense + High Damage, Projectile Weapons Amarr: Armor Tanking, High Defense + Low Damage (I might be wrong on that), Laser Weapons So now the tricky part is pairing each racial theme with each suit theme, and making unique bonuses that make sense for that suit.

crazy space 1 Unkn0wn Killers 1291	Posted - 2013.05.16 23:41:00 - [11] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I think a better effort is to try to theme every race up and select a bunch of bonuses that best suits them. How can we do that with only half of the current races suits in the game?
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 4732	Posted - 2013.05.17 00:00:00 - [12] - Quote crazy space 1 wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I think a better effort is to try to theme every race up and select a bunch of bonuses that best suits them. How can we do that with only half of the current races suits in the game? Not suits. The races are in.
The Robot Devil BetaMax. CRONOS. 312	Posted - 2013.05.17 00:07:00 - [13] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I think a better effort is to try to theme every race up and select a bunch of bonuses that best suits them. Right, but you also have to bear in mind that each race has it's own combat philosophy. Gallente specializing in close up combat with high damage (I won't bring up drones as they need a drastic upgrade) and armor modules that don't reduce their speed. The reduction to CPU/PG on Hybrid weapons is great, I can fit Prototype gear on an Advanced level suit and still have room to fit other Advanced gear. Albeit, the Shield recharge bonus is absolutely useless on a 120 HP suit with only a few high slots. Going with a theme is cool and all but you have to remember that Assault suits are a theme in and of themselves - they're combat specialists. Logistics are a theme, and that's (supposed to be) support. Heavy's are -supposed- to be the grand master of Point Defense but they always wind up being something different. Themes are Suit Type. Specialization is the combination of both Theme and Combat Philosophy. We need -more- specialization, imo. +1
The Robot Devil BetaMax. CRONOS. 312	Posted - 2013.05.17 01:14:00 - [14] - Quote Militia suits get a static racial bonus 3 standard suits per race with one bonus that is level dependent. 4 advanced suits with 2 bonuses dependent on skill level 5 proto suits with 2 level bonuses and one static role bonus Each of the races militia suit would have a race specific static bonus that make the suit viable for testing suits and ideas in battle and give a "preview" of what the next tier suit will be like and it would also help people with understanding which race used what type of gear and tactics. The standard suits would continue to lead the merc towards specialized roles and specific damage or defense types with one level based bonus that complements the racial tactics of the suit role and player style. Advanced would give two bonuses, one for racial tactics and one for racial DPS or EHP to further specialized roles and game play. These two level based skills would let the advanced suit be a good stepping stone that let's players test different ideas for fits and have variety at lower levels thus allowing lower SP mercs to be better equipped and feel more useful. Proto suits would finish the specializing trend with a static racial role bonus and two bonuses dictated by level. These three bonuses would promote racial tactics, tank types and battlefield roles. All levels of suits should get some type of bonus that encourages players to play in that race's style or compliments the style of the player. The race and type of suit should dictate - up to a certain point - how the suit is used and what it achieves when "maxed" out. Suit roles should overlap somewhat but they should not ever outshine there counterparts in their designated role.


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