DUST Search - Why does the entire Logistics class have to be nerfed?

Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote:

Den-tredje Baron wrote:

mmmm back to the "don't nerf all logis" thread or is it only me who feels we have gotten a bit off track and are harting a bit ot much at IWS Question

IF !! all logis have to give something up this is how i would imagine it happening:

LOGIS: overall bonus make equipment take 5% or 10% less CPU/PG per level.
Then also nerf CPU and PG by like 10%-20% and make logis go 0.2-0.3 slower than they do right now. The CPU/PG nerf but equipment bonus is meant to even out the difference so that putting on equipment as logis are meat to have won't be the problem. But if the logi tries to go all out complex shield this will now take up a bigger percentage of the overall CPU/PG than it would before therefore restricting a logi to go fx 5 complex shields or complex plates (LOL to last Lol

). Logis are meant to be more squishy than assaults that's why we have lower base EHP and are slower than assaults. Instead logis are forced to use a big deal of their slots to try and even this out. Or at least this is what i do !!!
Assaults already have this this higher base EHP and speed so they can focus on stuff like putting damage mods or more stamina.
Hopefully something like this will make logi fits get a bit more "squishy" but make them retain the ability to equip a lot of equipments and help their team. Just my idea IF !! IF logis need to get a nerf i'll rather have something liek this than having logi slot layout bumped to assault level Ugh

AMARR: 10% bonus to armor repair module and equipment effectiveness per level
MINMATAR: 5% bonus to hacking speed and DISTANCE.
CALDARI: 10% bonus to shield regen per level. <----( Caldari logis won't get a major EHP buff but will be able to attend downed players and get back into cover and heal up)
GALLENTE: 1 HP/s passive armor repair. (galls pretty much stay as they are good now bonuswise )

ASSAULT: overall bonus 2% bonus to weapon damage.
AMARR: 10% bonus to weapon ammo capacity per level / or something better
MINMATAR: 5% bonus stamina regain and maximum amount.
CALDARI: 3% bonus to reload speed.
GALLENTE: 5% reduction to armor plate drawbacks / or something different

When assaults whine about the extra slots logis get this is where i'll point at the bonus to weapon damage. (everybody has said that assaults should get this and it is a very very good idea Attention

)
At level 3 assaults will run around with a extra high slot. In this high slot there has just already been put a enhanced damage for them. FREE OF CHARGE !! No CPU/PG used or anything now that. That's also why you loose your second equipment slot because if you had that you could step into the logis area.
Logi Bro also got some fantastic ideas out so IF !! IF the logis need a nerf look into buffing assaults FIRST and then look at logis again.
PS: heavies and scouts ??? did theey get thrown out or do they also have ****** bonuses

No. Not to discount your idea but im tired of conceding the premise that all the Logi's need a nerf or rework. Its so utterly annoying that ppl come up with a bs premise and ppl tell them they are full of BS and then someone trying to appease the whole community comes in with a "compromise"

Well NO im just tired of it. This is an utter bs premise the entire logi class is not in need of nerf and we have given more than enough arguments for why that is. If the Devs want to come in here and discuss it further thats one thing. But there isnt one scraping bit of rationale, proof or data that suggests that the any of the Logis outside of the Caldari needs any work.


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Den-tredje Baron The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 44	Posted - 2013.05.13 02:55:00 - [1] - Quote mmmm back to the "don't nerf all logis" thread or is it only me who feels we have gotten a bit off track and are harting a bit ot much at IWS IF !! all logis have to give something up this is how i would imagine it happening: LOGIS: overall bonus make equipment take 5% or 10% less CPU/PG per level. Then also nerf CPU and PG by like 10%-20% and make logis go 0.2-0.3 slower than they do right now. The CPU/PG nerf but equipment bonus is meant to even out the difference so that putting on equipment as logis are meat to have won't be the problem. But if the logi tries to go all out complex shield this will now take up a bigger percentage of the overall CPU/PG than it would before therefore restricting a logi to go fx 5 complex shields or complex plates (LOL to last ). Logis are meant to be more squishy than assaults that's why we have lower base EHP and are slower than assaults. Instead logis are forced to use a big deal of their slots to try and even this out. Or at least this is what i do !!! Assaults already have this this higher base EHP and speed so they can focus on stuff like putting damage mods or more stamina. Hopefully something like this will make logi fits get a bit more "squishy" but make them retain the ability to equip a lot of equipments and help their team. Just my idea IF !! IF logis need to get a nerf i'll rather have something liek this than having logi slot layout bumped to assault level AMARR: 10% bonus to armor repair module and equipment effectiveness per level MINMATAR: 5% bonus to hacking speed and DISTANCE. CALDARI: 10% bonus to shield regen per level. <----( Caldari logis won't get a major EHP buff but will be able to attend downed players and get back into cover and heal up) GALLENTE: 1 HP/s passive armor repair. (galls pretty much stay as they are good now bonuswise ) ASSAULT: overall bonus 2% bonus to weapon damage. AMARR: 10% bonus to weapon ammo capacity per level / or something better MINMATAR: 5% bonus stamina regain and maximum amount. CALDARI: 3% bonus to reload speed. GALLENTE: 5% reduction to armor plate drawbacks / or something different When assaults whine about the extra slots logis get this is where i'll point at the bonus to weapon damage. (everybody has said that assaults should get this and it is a very very good idea ) At level 3 assaults will run around with a extra high slot. In this high slot there has just already been put a enhanced damage for them. FREE OF CHARGE !! No CPU/PG used or anything now that. That's also why you loose your second equipment slot because if you had that you could step into the logis area. Logi Bro also got some fantastic ideas out so IF !! IF the logis need a nerf look into buffing assaults FIRST and then look at logis again. PS: heavies and scouts ??? did theey get thrown out or do they also have ****** bonuses ??
Den-tredje Baron The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 44	Posted - 2013.05.13 03:38:00 - [2] - Quote Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote: Den-tredje Baron wrote: mmmm back to the "don't nerf all logis" thread or is it only me who feels we have gotten a bit off track and are harting a bit ot much at IWS IF !! all logis have to give something up this is how i would imagine it happening: LOGIS: overall bonus make equipment take 5% or 10% less CPU/PG per level. Then also nerf CPU and PG by like 10%-20% and make logis go 0.2-0.3 slower than they do right now. The CPU/PG nerf but equipment bonus is meant to even out the difference so that putting on equipment as logis are meat to have won't be the problem. But if the logi tries to go all out complex shield this will now take up a bigger percentage of the overall CPU/PG than it would before therefore restricting a logi to go fx 5 complex shields or complex plates (LOL to last ). Logis are meant to be more squishy than assaults that's why we have lower base EHP and are slower than assaults. Instead logis are forced to use a big deal of their slots to try and even this out. Or at least this is what i do !!! Assaults already have this this higher base EHP and speed so they can focus on stuff like putting damage mods or more stamina. Hopefully something like this will make logi fits get a bit more "squishy" but make them retain the ability to equip a lot of equipments and help their team. Just my idea IF !! IF logis need to get a nerf i'll rather have something liek this than having logi slot layout bumped to assault level AMARR: 10% bonus to armor repair module and equipment effectiveness per level MINMATAR: 5% bonus to hacking speed and DISTANCE. CALDARI: 10% bonus to shield regen per level. <----( Caldari logis won't get a major EHP buff but will be able to attend downed players and get back into cover and heal up) GALLENTE: 1 HP/s passive armor repair. (galls pretty much stay as they are good now bonuswise ) ASSAULT: overall bonus 2% bonus to weapon damage. AMARR: 10% bonus to weapon ammo capacity per level / or something better MINMATAR: 5% bonus stamina regain and maximum amount. CALDARI: 3% bonus to reload speed. GALLENTE: 5% reduction to armor plate drawbacks / or something different When assaults whine about the extra slots logis get this is where i'll point at the bonus to weapon damage. (everybody has said that assaults should get this and it is a very very good idea ) At level 3 assaults will run around with a extra high slot. In this high slot there has just already been put a enhanced damage for them. FREE OF CHARGE !! No CPU/PG used or anything now that. That's also why you loose your second equipment slot because if you had that you could step into the logis area. Logi Bro also got some fantastic ideas out so IF !! IF the logis need a nerf look into buffing assaults FIRST and then look at logis again. PS: heavies and scouts ??? did theey get thrown out or do they also have ****** bonuses ?? No. Not to discount your idea but im tired of conceding the premise that all the Logi's need a nerf or rework. Its so utterly annoying that ppl come up with a bs premise and ppl tell them they are full of BS and then someone trying to appease the whole community comes in with a "compromise" Well NO im just tired of it. This is an utter bs premise the entire logi class is not in need of nerf and we have given more than enough arguments for why that is. If the Devs want to come in here and discuss it further thats one thing. But there isnt one scraping bit of rationale, proof or data that suggests that the any of the Logis outside of the Caldari needs any work. I totally know what you mean that's also why i used the IF's all the time I also think the only suit being the rotten apple among the other fine fruits are the caldari logi. But it just sounds like the logi suits are gonna get wacked so hard in the head that we're gonna be send back to the stoneage with weapons having the same range as rocks can be thrown and tanks as big as well yeah "wet paper bags". Might as well say onga bonga already now. Above is just my try to give at least a much better way of dealing with it than wacking the entire class so hard. Logis already got quite a few problems. Nanite injector reviving 50% of the times. Wanting to quickly shift to an equipment ?? nope gotta hover over the little icon before you actually choose it.
Den-tredje Baron The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 50	Posted - 2013.05.17 23:58:00 - [3] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I will say the number of complaints over the logis have died down quite a bit and seeing more of the other classes now. Not sure if influx of new players and weapons is the cause. Still it may be better to adjust the TAR instead see how it works from there. Maybe it is the weapon itself that is making them seemingly over powered. If done right it may still be the logi goto long range support weapon but assault minded players will likely stray from it As for boxed roles the thing is about dust 514 none of the roles are boxed so to say, you cannot stop one class from doing another classes job entirely and there is nothing any one class in dust 514 can have exclusivtivly to itself in overall terms. Heavy is the closest thing with Heavy Weapon slot. However the heavy weapons have rivals in light weapon classes. It is certainly not like many other class based shooters where one class can do something NOBODY else can most heavy machine gunners can't revive people. Most Snipers cannot repair tanks. Most medics are horrible at demolition and anti-tank roles. Also for those who didn't read the idea I approached the suit restructring with re-designing the whole progression in mind. Design =/= Balance never has, never will. Just poor design will begat silly questions as to why certain things are just plain wrong such as why are flux grenades responsible for more kills than the sleek av grenade. In the case of why does the sleek AV grenade has so much fewer kills over a weapon that is accidentally via semi-rare bug killing people. Ypu are definitely right haven't seen a lot of complaints about logistics lately. I major overhaul on the tac AR would really make the logi statement almost dead. Only thing really needed to be looked at is the caldari logi bonus and DONE !! nothing more to do about the logis. WHAT NEEDS DOING !! is buffing the other classes bonuses to something useful. Gallente assault doesn't need a 10% recharge to shields per level and as far as i've heard the caldari assault isn't totally glad about the reload speed bonus it gets either. sooo 2% bonus to light weapon damage for assaults and 10% shield recharge to caldari assault maybe ?? The sentinels class bonus is a joke as it only actually matters if you use a gun that can overheatr. And we all know that if you are so low on health that you might die by overheating your gun well if you survive the overheat you acan't shoot fire a while so the enemy will most likely kill you. Soooo CCP 2% light weapon damage reduction maybe ?? (or maybe just 2% damage reduction in general as this would also include tank turret damage so heavies can actually do their intended anti tank role more efficiently ??. Has to be followed by a major redo of tanking capabilities of tank of course ) But other than that i now laugh when i meet a caldari assault and i'm with my lovely assault SCR