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Denak Kalamari
BurgezzE.T.F Orion Empire
148
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Posted - 2013.05.12 12:59:00 -
[1] - Quote
I am glad that the Midular assassin's identity was finally revealed and this situation is reaching a conclusion. I hope that he gets put into a fair trial and gets punished accordingly. Although to note on the reason why his identity was hidden, it was probably for the reason to make sure that any of his possible co-conspirators would not suddenly disappear. It is not a good reason, but it is a reason in the first place.
Natu Nobilis wrote: Our Ray of Matat lies dead, shot due to bigotry and ignorance fed by a group of Gallente CURRENTLY IN POWER with a mentality that immigrants are less deserving just because they-¦re from outside?
And this individual, that i have no idea if it -¦s the right one, after inumerous requests for extradition, that are backed by minmatar LAW, will be broadcasted and made a star by Gallente Media, gloryfing the person to get audience, while we still mourn for our Ray, having recieved NO CONSOLATION from our "allies", and yet, from our supposed "enemy" Tibus Heth, we get offers of medical treatment and condolences.
Immigrants are being molested on the strreets and at their homes by ignorant civilians, and ignorant authorities, working in the name of the federation.
Those are not attributes of a place where i would feel safe, or respected.
The Gallente are rotting from the inside, and the smell is coming out. I do hope they treat this cancer and become once again a place of diversity and prosperity, and not this interventionist hypocritical imperialist ignorant place of hatred against all that disagree with them.
First of all, the crime happened in Gallente territory, thus it goes under Gallente jurisdiction. The Matari law is irrelevant, because it did not happen in Matari territory. Secondly, the acts of one man or one group do not reflect the entire Federation, so concluding that the Gallente government is rotten from the inside is a very broad generalization and very ignorant. Thirdly, the attacks on Matari citizens happened after the Minmatar navy made an unprovoked attack into Federation territory, killing thousands of Navymen both Minmatar and Gallente. I am not saying that they are correct when they are assaulting Minmatar citizens, you started the whole thing.
Thirdly, I do not like the idea that they completely disregarded Minmatar law and requests to have the assassin turned over to them, and find the reason keeping the assassin's identity a secret flimsy at best, it still does not warrant this kind of behavior from you, and because of pointless arguments like these our alliance is going to break, which will be bad for both sides.
So what do you want to do? Continue downplaying the Federation and only blame us for all the bad things on this whole farse, or accept that both sides are at fault and focus on rebuilding our relationship?
((Note, it's probably the best if you just ignore Smooth Head, he's a blatant troll)) |
Denak Kalamari
BurgezzE.T.F Orion Empire
150
|
Posted - 2013.05.13 12:05:00 -
[2] - Quote
And completely disregard the 300 hundred other people he killed or wounded? You can't completely disregard the Gallente law just as much we can't disregard Matari law, that was my point. I may have worded it a bit wrong, I admit, but in the end we can't solely act on one nation's law in this case. And I did not claim that you were biased, everyone is biased more or less, and the fact that you are willing to attack Federation territory, killing your own people in the process(not all the navymen were Gallente) just so you can gain a single man from them brings up a few alarm signs.
Natu Nobilis wrote:2 - In case you don-¦t watch the news, several immigrants were already beign mistreated, and it only increase recently. It-¦s not "one" man, it-¦s your bigot population, your armed and judicial authorities. Your government is doing this, and the only words of care that we had so far came from Tibus Heth, not from your authorities. These conspiracy theories again? Yet again, you are generalizing every single Gallente citizen and the government itself to a racist bigot, which in itself is being racist. And as far as I see, the only "proof" that the government are discriminating Matari immigrants is a few eyewitness accounts saying they were searched. Hardly a racist act in my opinion.
Natu Nobilis wrote:3 - Now the fault is OURS? Do you forget that the agressive feeling coming from Gallente population came way before the military standoff? That we are treated as outsiders, inferiors and something to get rid of? Insult, after insult, after insult, and yet, you try to portrait yourself as a righteous shinny white knight in armour. I don-¦t know if the arrogance is so deep in your veins that you can-¦t see what you are doing, or if this is a deliberate attack on my people. Either way, i think the MInmatar are in perfect conditions to live our lives without your interference and prejudice. Did you even read my post? I wasn't blaming the Minmatar nor glorifying the Federation, I was saying that both the Republic and the Federation could have done better in the handling of this entire farse. If you stopped downplaying the Federation into a bunch of xenophobic racists you are going to find yourself quite lonely real fast. I am not saying this to threaten you, I am saying this to warn you, broad generalizations and exchange of insults help no one and if we even want this alliance to last, we need to stop it.
And if you really demand proof that not every single Gallente is an idiot, look here. |
Denak Kalamari
BurgezzE.T.F Orion Empire
151
|
Posted - 2013.05.13 16:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote: 1 - There is a conflict of juristictions, for we have different laws. And i-¦m not saying you said it was biased, i-¦m reporting that your SUPREME COURT said it. The highest judicial instance of your federation could have used a little diplomacy, but they didn-¦t. That is a very good reason to set some people off and for harsher measures to be taken.
2 - Part of your population and part of the authorities. Do you even check the references from the news? They are reporting it, i-¦m not taking things out of my head. There is population and police violence / profiling going on, there is a supposed shooter with a mindset that is shared with the current leader of the Black Eagles. If you can-¦t see this, i don-¦t know what to say.
3 - Of course the situation could be different. But first there is prejudice against immigrants from part of your poulation, second there is government officials preching this intolerance, then there-¦s a supposed individual that shared this tought and put it into action, kiling not only MInmatar civilians, but our Ray of Matar, then there-¦s your highest judicial instance calling our court system biased.
If your population isn-¦t doing something about the stupidity of your government, of your judicial system, of your diplomatic relations, then the population is omiting themselves from what is going on, and agreeing with what is going on, Of course it-¦s not everyone that thinks like that, but they are not doing anything about it.
And if you think that the Minmatar are going to take these insults lightly and passively, you gravely mistaken. We have not freed ourselves from one whip to be hit by a softer, but equaly damaging one.
1. True, but does that warrant an attack on Gallente territory just so you can take the criminal in question for your trials? Since I recide the Intergalactic Summit often, let me quote you this:
Brandi Wiseman wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Don't you find it ironic that you, who call for not calling a person guilty before trial, cannot differentiate between going to war in order to bring someone to court, and a lynch mob?`
Not that either is necessary right. But surely they are different wrongs?
I can't differentiate between it, no. The Gallente Federation were already investigating the incident, had a suspect and were initiating trial proceedings to bring that individual to court. There was absolutely no reason for the Minmatar to attempt to escalate matters by bringing a fleet into Gallente space in order to take the prisoner into their custody. Hence why I refer to the actions of a lynch mob.
2. What I'm reading here and throughout the archives is violence against Matari immigrants by Gallente citizens which are racially charged, not police violence nor profiling. And are you implying that the Black Eagle director is a xenophobic Gallente extremist who wants to purposefully damage the relations between Gallente and Minmatar by shooting a bunch of people and an ex-Minmatar Prime Minister? That sounds fairly far fetched to me, especially considering that the shooter in question might not have even had Midular as his prime target.
3. And there is no prejudice at all against any other Matari citizens in the other nations, especially Amarr? News flash, racism has been present everywhere regardless of location, culture or nation. And if you didn't know it already, The Caille court has agreed to let Sebiestor Tribe delegates to observe the trial. While it isn't much, it proves that not all, or perhaps not even most of the Gallente judicial system is prejudistic, and we are doing something to improve our relations.
Now it's your turn to do something for us, while some of your accusations may be and are correct, all the Tribal Council has done to try and correct the situation by now is throw insults at us and attack our territory. |
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