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Phoenix Arakyd
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
Taking away the ability to use a light weapon would be a huge mistake, no one would run logi. They already sacrifice speed and a sidearm slot to carry extra gear, they just need to be brought in line to be less durable. The current Caldari logi is ridic OP due to its slot layout and bonuses. Requiring this suits only change to force sidearms only wouldnt stop super tankers, infact, they'd have even more cpu and pg to fit higher end mods.
You're only going to balance this by toning down the bonuses and removing some low slots, otherwise you risk damaging the Logi class all together.
Too many kneejerk nerf requests going around broke the HMG, tanks, and other crap for the beginning of this build. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
Blamejudg3s KEQ wrote:Don't know why your complaining, SMG has better hit detection right now anyways
Not complaining, just see a bunch of fools calling for nerfs when they dont understand balance. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:15:00 -
[3] - Quote
Polish Hammer wrote:Phoenix Arakyd wrote:Blamejudg3s KEQ wrote:Don't know why your complaining, SMG has better hit detection right now anyways Not complaining, just see a bunch of fools calling for nerfs when they dont understand balance. Its the same as me saying scouts with shotguns are op, they can only use scanning tools. It's just peoples' first reaction to something. If X needs tweaking (read: balancing), then they demand swift, drastic nerfing be done. I still want my logi caretakers around
TBH, the best thing would be to look at the bonuses of each suit. The Winmatar suit may be fine with its bonus, as its only for hacking speed, and the suit is pretty damn fragile. The Caldari on the other hand, its bonus will need to be dropped, and possibly the Gallentes as well. 255 @ lvl 5 is quite a bit. 2% per level is probably much more balanced, and still gives enough ofa boost to warrant training to 5. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:23:00 -
[4] - Quote
Cosgar wrote:Blamejudg3s KEQ wrote:Don't know why your complaining, SMG has better hit detection right now anyways This is the problem, if they take away our light slot, the killer bees are just going to use SMGs and scramblers and nothing gets accomplished. We need another damn respec, the HMG needs a buff, scout, templar and assault suits need better bonuses to be desirable and everyone can go back to their respective class and logi can stop being the FotM. But since CCP is on a nerf spree logis are going to be ****ed and the "OMG nerf X" bull **** will continue on until everyone quits because they're tired of their stuff being nerfed. It's not Dust 514, or AR 514, it's turned into Nerf 514.
This will be the first free to play AAA pillow fight party game. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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68
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
Telcontar Dunedain wrote:Phoenix Arakyd wrote:Taking away the ability to use a light weapon would be a huge mistake, no one would run logi. They already sacrifice speed and a sidearm slot to carry extra gear, they just need to be brought in line to be less durable. The current Caldari logi is ridic OP due to its slot layout and bonuses. Requiring this suits only change to force sidearms only wouldnt stop super tankers, infact, they'd have even more cpu and pg to fit higher end mods.
You're only going to balance this by toning down the bonuses and removing some low slots, otherwise you risk damaging the Logi class all together.
Too many kneejerk nerf requests going around broke the HMG, tanks, and other crap for the beginning of this build. Hmm The problem at the moment is logi are way too tanky. Willing to become much less tanky and keep the light weapon?
Yea, thats the only thing thats gonna fix it. Requiring them to goto SMG's or something would just make them OP CQC brawlers. Take away some of that tanking ability, and they will be fine. Minmatar is already the most balanced of the 4, so it can pretty much be left alone. Caldari will need a drop to 2% per leve l for shields, or a new skill bonus altogether. Cant say much about Amarr or gallente yet but I'm sure they will need a look over too. Bascially, they shouldnt get any kind of HP bonus, thats more of an assault or heavy thing. Logi's should get bonuses to support (armor rep, hacks, nanite cluster level in hive etc..
Also, because they focus so much on equipment, you cant really run a light weapon without giving up some tank. Atlest in Chromosome I pretty much had to run with an SMG to be able to fit all of my equipment. I could still tank, but it was only with maxed out shield armor and fitting skills. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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68
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:37:00 -
[6] - Quote
Telcontar Dunedain wrote:Phoenix Arakyd wrote:Telcontar Dunedain wrote:Phoenix Arakyd wrote:Taking away the ability to use a light weapon would be a huge mistake, no one would run logi. They already sacrifice speed and a sidearm slot to carry extra gear, they just need to be brought in line to be less durable. The current Caldari logi is ridic OP due to its slot layout and bonuses. Requiring this suits only change to force sidearms only wouldnt stop super tankers, infact, they'd have even more cpu and pg to fit higher end mods.
You're only going to balance this by toning down the bonuses and removing some low slots, otherwise you risk damaging the Logi class all together.
Too many kneejerk nerf requests going around broke the HMG, tanks, and other crap for the beginning of this build. Hmm The problem at the moment is logi are way too tanky. Willing to become much less tanky and keep the light weapon? Yea, thats the only thing thats gonna fix it. Requiring them to goto SMG's or something would just make them OP CQC brawlers. Take away some of that tanking ability, and they will be fine. Minmatar is already the most balanced of the 4, so it can pretty much be left alone. Caldari will need a drop to 2% per leve l for shields, or a new skill bonus altogether. Cant say much about Amarr or gallente yet but I'm sure they will need a look over too. Bascially, they shouldnt get any kind of HP bonus, thats more of an assault or heavy thing. Logi's should get bonuses to support (armor rep, hacks, nanite cluster level in hive etc..) I edited my OP Basically maybe some of the suits specializations should lose light weapon and keep the tank?
TBH that would be more of a sidegrade of the Assault for CQC. Allows better tanking for upclose and personal, but limits you to closer range weapons and maybe gives a special bonus to sidearms. The logi bonuses should be based around support skills, not tanking skills. Remove the tank bonuses and the problem will most likely solve itself. The logi keeps itself alive by keeping its squad members alive with ammo in their mags, not by being able to tank against a heavy.
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Phoenix Arakyd
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
Thor Odinson42 wrote:I guess my question would be, why didn't everybody choose a logi suit if they think they are OP? I mean this isn't a weapon that's out of whack. It's an entire class of suits.
The idea is to have survivability in order to provide support.
You can still fit a ton of HP on a logi without the tank bonuses, just not as much as an assault. Thats how it should be. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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69
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
DigiOps wrote:Logistics shouldn't be able to take over the assault role in my opinion. You want to be tanky? Give up your light weapon and go back to support.
Did you not read the thread? Giving up a light weapon wont fix the class. It wont even make it a support class. They need to remove the tank bonuses for logi suits and give them support bonuses. Period. Anything else wont fix it. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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Posted - 2013.05.11 01:45:00 -
[9] - Quote
Harkon Vysarii wrote: Consider taking High and Low Slots away from Logis and adding a special slot type Medium (like in EVE yes) however medium slot types are like subsystems that improve how the logi's equipment works, how its scanners work, etc. Use the Medium suit slots to edit how the logi is designed to function in combat rather than allow it to tank extreme damage (remember that is what heavies were for)
No, too much to code and would have to make new equipment. Just remove the tank bonuses. Caldari logi may need to lose a lowslot. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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Posted - 2013.05.11 02:04:00 -
[10] - Quote
NeoWraith Acedia wrote:DigiOps wrote:Logistics shouldn't be able to take over the assault role in my opinion. You want to be tanky? Give up your light weapon and go back to support. I invite you to my thread so you can point out how all logi's are OP, let alone taking over the assault class https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=75780&find=unread
I beleive I did post on there. |
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Phoenix Arakyd
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Posted - 2013.05.11 02:23:00 -
[11] - Quote
gmann50 wrote:Is that all you girls can do is complain this is op this is op.Stop complaining and play the game bunch of 80year old women.
Logi has to have tank if everyone is going to run tac ar
No. Logis need support bonuses. |
Phoenix Arakyd
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70
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Posted - 2013.05.11 02:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
DigiOps wrote:Phoenix Arakyd wrote:DigiOps wrote:Logistics shouldn't be able to take over the assault role in my opinion. You want to be tanky? Give up your light weapon and go back to support. Did you not read the thread? Giving up a light weapon wont fix the class. It wont even make it a support class. They need to remove the tank bonuses for logi suits and give them support bonuses. Period. Anything else wont fix it. What does the light weapon have to do with making it a viable support class? Riddle me that.
In order to fit a light weapon you already have to give up tank, especially with the mass drive which is/or was the best logi support combo. The problem isnt they can carry light weapons, its that they can tank alot better than assault. Remove the tanking bonus (5% per level) and replace with with a support bonus. Keep the 1/hp passive rep. |
Phoenix Arakyd
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
74
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Posted - 2013.05.12 04:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
Heathen Bastard wrote:this plea falls on deaf ears. CCP is shown only to make HUGE pendulum like swings in balance. everything is either totally UP or so freakishly OP that it basically invalidates the game.(tanks, lasers, dropships, now caldari logis and tac rifles being massively OP)
lasers used to wing you and put a heavy in the grave. now I can simply rush them while tanking minimal damage in my scout suit from about 40 meters out.(poor bastard lost a viziam to some chump with standard knives.)
tanks used to be whoever calls their tank first has already won the game, now they get laughed at by scouts with hacked exo av nades.
dropships, 'nuff said.
Caldari Logi is a better assault than the rest of the assault class put together.
proto tac rifles can instantly drill through a target with little effort, has a better fire rate, range, and a scope. only thing the standard and breach have over it is ammo in clip.
all of those will eventually get a fix. How soon is the question. |
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