Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Aighun
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
835
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 13:54:00 -
[1] - Quote
In all of the uproar over the new skill progression system, seems that most people have lost sight of the true core of this game. Or they never really knew what it was or cared much about it to begin with.
The heart of Dust 514 is not spread sheets on the ground.
The true core of this game or any other shooter is moment to moment gameplay.
Aiming and shooting weapons.
Moving over terrain and through the environment.
Stable and consistent frame rate and draw distances.
I am not a hardcore FPS player or fan. I like me some Dark Souls. That game has a character and weapon leveling system that is arguably deeper, more complicated, and more opaque than what you get with DUst 514. But hardly anyone plays Dark Souls for hours on end just for the stats. We play that game because it is rewarding to explore the world and fight all of the various enemies no matter what our level. Moment to moment gameplay and combat is probably the best of its kind for this generations dungeon crawler or dark fantasy games. Dark Souls has amazing combat no matter what your level.
Moment to moment gameplay has never been spectacular in Dust 514. It has gotten close. But with uprising it has seen some set backs.
All of that spread sheet wanking is just window dressing. Yes, ok, it is very important when it comes to the "balance" of combat. But I am not going to keep playing a game for weapon stats if my character gets glued to a wall every time I try to run through cover or turn a tight corner. Or if aiming and shooting at an opponent feels lifeless and dead.
Moment to moment game play is the most important thing that needs improvement. It is the core and foundation of this game. Uprising did not bring the progress that many of us were hoping for. |
Beast Beastlington
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
256
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:04:00 -
[2] - Quote
Unless the game moves to more powerful hardware or has a complete change of engine, it will never have top tier gun-play.
CCP should have thrown a money-hat at DICE and asked them to make the game for them.
It's amateurish and second tier compared to everything else out there.
|
Natu Nobilis
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
226
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:13:00 -
[3] - Quote
For people with a sight are narrow: -After 3 days of update, the game is doomed to fail
For people with long term persepctive. - Kitten yeah, the groundwork for al lthe cool thingsid getting better and better! A little tweak here, some revision there, a proper balance on this and that, like always and forever, but the groundwork is awesome.
If people came here looking for a shooter, well, not much to do for now.
If people came here looking for an immersive universe that will grow slow and steady, they know how to respect time.
I just want this game to be a year old and everyone get the core skills and 2-3 weapon specializations so the ones that came looking for top gear will leave or change their minds, and the ones that want the rest of the game will stay.
Only then the forums will be a little more productive. |
Tony Calif
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
2084
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:27:00 -
[4] - Quote
The game is boring and lifeless. The actual core of the game appears to be gear>skill Nothing has REALLY changed since e3/precursor. |
Kleanur Guy
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
208
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:28:00 -
[5] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote: I just want this game to be a year old
Game has been in development for more than a year bro. I've been here since the first closed beta build, it has progressed a bit but not enough, old vets like me know how CCP works, I could see the Heavy nerf being too much a mile away. |
grreen mctree
Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:31:00 -
[6] - Quote
Poo |
The-Last-Ninja
FIND CARL CORP
50
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
+1, OP. I've become apathetic towards my stats in shooters, mainly because nowadays most of them don't require much skill. As such, I play more for any thrill of combat. Unfortunately, combat in DUST isn't very thrilling.
It's very annoying to be stuck sprinting in place because some 1mm spec of moon dust is obstructing my path. It kills the momentum. The game doesn't even have great flow to begin with. Then there's the issue with the DualShock 3 sensitivity and deadzone. People teleport strafing like they're Goku. Bad collision detection. The weird jitters that come out of nowhere, not even sure if it's just lag or if it's an issue with the hardware/framerate.
Right now, combat feels as flat as CoD, BF3, Crysis 3, Resistance 3, Killzone 3, etc. There are a lot of core things to fix if they want this game to flow well.
Until then, back to the great Dark Souls.
Beast Beastlington wrote:Unless the game moves to more powerful hardware or has a complete change of engine, it will never have top tier gun-play.
CCP should have thrown a money-hat at DICE and asked them to make the game for them.
It's amateurish and second tier compared to everything else out there.
DUST 514 already has enough problems. DICE would make the game even worse. |
Natu Nobilis
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
227
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:45:00 -
[8] - Quote
Kleanur Guy wrote:Natu Nobilis wrote: I just want this game to be a year old
Game has been in development for more than a year bro. I've been here since the first closed beta build, it has progressed a bit but not enough, old vets like me know how CCP works, I could see the Heavy nerf being too much a mile away.
I-¦ve been playing in my friends PS3 since the furst build of ther closed beta, i bough a PS3 to play at home when the Merc Pack got out, i used to be a good pilot before the baloon mechanics, i sniped from above the MCC, i got on top of buildings to give everyone a shower of huge splash damage missiles, i-¦ve had everything that i was good at changed in a way that i had to relearn or didn-¦t bother to.
If looking back at what it was, you can-¦t see the HUGE progress it had (with a lot more needed, of course), then it-¦s hard to talk about the issue.
Now, about the year old.
You got reset on the move to tranquility. I got reset on the move to tranquility.
People right now are complaining about the "lack" of skills points, and since from now on there-¦ll be no more resets, a years worth of SP should give people the hability to max out on 2-3 weapons, the core skills and a suit.
After the people complaining about the "grinding" reach a level of SP, they-¦ll reach a point where either they-¦ll leave the game because they got what they wanted and didn-¦t liked it, or they-¦ll stay because of the game and its features (PC, FW, Corp Battles, Sov warfare, PI bonus).
I want that point to be reached soon, so everyone that finally gets to the holy graal of lvl 5 in a lot of stuff, decide if that-¦s the game for them or not, and leave the rest of us playing the game and giving proper feedback, instead of ranting in 300 topics that look like a rely instead of a post, making the forums a pain to the eyes of those loking for information. |
ZDub 303
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group
42
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:49:00 -
[9] - Quote
But thats just the thing OP. Frame rates are inconsistent, im constantly being hung up on textures while trying to move or strafe. Climbing hills in this game is lol, and its even worse trying to walk down them.
The range on guns is downright horrible... I mean seriously, its awful. Its so bad, its killed any semblance of 'gun play' in this game.
In a 8v8 or 12v12 secnario, you dont have enough players to warrent true logistics, dropships, heavies, or anything really. This game would be most fun and balanced atm if all we had was the assault class with 2 equipment slots.
In the end, CCP made a poor choice of platform, does this game have potential? Yes it clearly does. But I don't think you'll truly see this game shine without another 2 years of developement, another major graphical overhaul (including the ability to hit >25 fps), and 32v32 - 64v64 gameplay. Which.. I don't believe will be possible on the PS3.
I enjoy this game, mostly because I play with my friends. I can see the potential this game could have, I just wish they hadn't developed it on a 10 year old console. They have refined the kb/m controls far more than any other console game. They've inplemented a neocom UI that feels like it was meant for a cursor.
In the end, imho, they developed an amazing PC game, stripped it down to practically nothing, and slapped on a console. Strictly because 'consoles are the bigger market'.
Even if they bring this game to the PS4, its still just going to be a PC shooter they didnt put on the PC. |
total masshole
Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic
4
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 14:55:00 -
[10] - Quote
dust might fail but the forums will always prevail, in my heart at least |
|
Beast Beastlington
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
257
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 15:36:00 -
[11] - Quote
The-Last-Ninja wrote:+1, OP. I've become apathetic towards my stats in shooters, mainly because nowadays most of them don't require much skill. As such, I play more for any thrill of combat. Unfortunately, combat in DUST isn't very thrilling. It's very annoying to be stuck sprinting in place because some 1mm spec of moon dust is obstructing my path. It kills the momentum. The game doesn't even have great flow to begin with. Then there's the issue with the DualShock 3 sensitivity and deadzone. People teleport strafing like they're Goku. Bad collision detection. The weird jitters that come out of nowhere, not even sure if it's just lag or if it's an issue with the hardware/framerate. Right now, combat feels as flat as CoD, BF3, Crysis 3, Resistance 3, Killzone 3, etc. There are a lot of core things to fix if they want this game to flow well. Until then, back to the great Dark Souls. Beast Beastlington wrote:Unless the game moves to more powerful hardware or has a complete change of engine, it will never have top tier gun-play.
CCP should have thrown a money-hat at DICE and asked them to make the game for them.
It's amateurish and second tier compared to everything else out there.
DUST 514 already has enough problems. DICE would make the game even worse.
Don't kid yourself. From a technical, graphical, sound and design perspective Battlefield ***** all over Dust from a massive height. |
Aighun
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
839
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 15:58:00 -
[12] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:But thats just the thing OP. Frame rates are inconsistent, im constantly being hung up on textures while trying to move or strafe. Climbing hills in this game is lol, and its even worse trying to walk down them.
The range on guns is downright horrible... I mean seriously, its awful. Its so bad, its killed any semblance of 'gun play' in this game.
In a 8v8 or 12v12 secnario, you dont have enough players to warrent true logistics, dropships, heavies, or anything really. This game would be most fun and balanced atm if all we had was the assault class with 2 equipment slots.
In the end, CCP made a poor choice of platform, does this game have potential? Yes it clearly does. But I don't think you'll truly see this game shine without another 2 years of developement, another major graphical overhaul (including the ability to hit >25 fps), and 32v32 - 64v64 gameplay. Which.. I don't believe will be possible on the PS3.
I enjoy this game, mostly because I play with my friends. I can see the potential this game could have, I just wish they hadn't developed it on a 10 year old console. They have refined the kb/m controls far more than any other console game. They've inplemented a neocom UI that feels like it was meant for a cursor.
In the end, imho, they developed an amazing PC game, stripped it down to practically nothing, and slapped on a console. Strictly because 'consoles are the bigger market'.
Even if they bring this game to the PS4, its still just going to be a PC shooter they didnt put on the PC.
That was my point. Well, the first part.
But I completely disagree with your claim that platform makes a damn difference. The things that make up core of a game will make the game great no matter what the platform. So go ahead take your PC and go jump in the Hudson.
Dark Souls port to PC was subject to some of the most pathetic whining and privileged tantrum throwing I have seen on the internet. But there were really no technical flaws to speak of. The game ran very solidly was extremely stable. The resolution and frame rate mods did help with a major blemish, terrible frame rate in Blight town. But the PC version did not touch the core of the game. Platform does not make the game. Game makes the platform.
One of the best things about the whole Dark Souls port to PC was that, even if the backlash against Prepare to Die edition was undeserved, From decided to man up, admitted the port was "half assed" and is working to make the next game even better on PC.
But this thread is not really about other games. That was just one example of a masterpiece of gaming that has a very solid core of moment to moment combat. On the other hand the moment to moment combat in Mass Effect 3 is poor enough that I am not sure I will be able to finish it. At least Dust is not that badGǪ
However, your claim that this is a could have been great PC game says a lot more about the designers than the game itself. A great game designer should be able to make a great game. Full stop. Even it that game runs on two toothpicks taped together.
I believe CCP can pull it off and give us great moment to moment game play of PS 3. I do not believe they are a one platform Pony. I really do believe that at heart they are great game makers. But it seems like they've sort of pulled a George R. R. Martin and sort of lost track of what could make this game a better than average, if not a stand out FPS.
And for all their faults, I do think most big name FPS games on console are just basically fun to load up so you can run around and shoot guns. If Dust does not get this, no platform, no amount of spread sheets or game modes or lush environments and new maps or weapons are going make the game any better or worth playing. |
ZDub 303
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group
42
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 16:21:00 -
[13] - Quote
Aighun wrote:ZDub 303 wrote:But thats just the thing OP. Frame rates are inconsistent, im constantly being hung up on textures while trying to move or strafe. Climbing hills in this game is lol, and its even worse trying to walk down them.
The range on guns is downright horrible... I mean seriously, its awful. Its so bad, its killed any semblance of 'gun play' in this game.
In a 8v8 or 12v12 secnario, you dont have enough players to warrent true logistics, dropships, heavies, or anything really. This game would be most fun and balanced atm if all we had was the assault class with 2 equipment slots.
In the end, CCP made a poor choice of platform, does this game have potential? Yes it clearly does. But I don't think you'll truly see this game shine without another 2 years of developement, another major graphical overhaul (including the ability to hit >25 fps), and 32v32 - 64v64 gameplay. Which.. I don't believe will be possible on the PS3.
I enjoy this game, mostly because I play with my friends. I can see the potential this game could have, I just wish they hadn't developed it on a 10 year old console. They have refined the kb/m controls far more than any other console game. They've inplemented a neocom UI that feels like it was meant for a cursor.
In the end, imho, they developed an amazing PC game, stripped it down to practically nothing, and slapped on a console. Strictly because 'consoles are the bigger market'.
Even if they bring this game to the PS4, its still just going to be a PC shooter they didnt put on the PC. That was my point. Well, the first part. But I completely disagree with your claim that platform makes a damn difference. The things that make up core of a game will make the game great no matter what the platform. So go ahead take your PC and go jump in the Hudson. Dark Souls port to PC was subject to some of the most pathetic whining and privileged tantrum throwing I have seen on the internet. But there were really no technical flaws to speak of. The game ran very solidly was extremely stable. The resolution and frame rate mods did help with a major blemish, terrible frame rate in Blight town. But the PC version did not touch the core of the game. Platform does not make the game. Game makes the platform. One of the best things about the whole Dark Souls port to PC was that, even if the backlash against Prepare to Die edition was undeserved, From decided to man up, admitted the port was "half assed" and is working to make the next game even better on PC. But this thread is not really about other games. That was just one example of a masterpiece of gaming that has a very solid core of moment to moment combat. On the other hand the moment to moment combat in Mass Effect 3 is poor enough that I am not sure I will be able to finish it. At least Dust is not that badGǪ However, your claim that this is a could have been great PC game says a lot more about the designers than the game itself. A great game designer should be able to make a great game. Full stop. Even it that game runs on two toothpicks taped together. I believe CCP can pull it off and give us great moment to moment game play of PS 3. I do not believe they are a one platform Pony. I really do believe that at heart they are great game makers. But it seems like they've sort of pulled a George R. R. Martin and sort of lost track of what could make this game a better than average, if not a stand out FPS. And for all their faults, I do think most big name FPS games on console are just basically fun to load up so you can run around and shoot guns. If Dust does not get this, no platform, no amount of spread sheets or game modes or lush environments and new maps or weapons are going make the game any better or worth playing.
Dark souls stuff aside, which has nothing to do with my post.
That was exactly my point, the 'moment to moment' combat in this game is terrible now with uprising. That is why people are so mad. You can't do anything with the ranges in this build, bullets just disappear well before they should be able to hit their target. This game has a lot of aspects to it that just dont fit well in true 12v12, even 16v16 settings. In the end, the more powerful corp will be the one with more assaults. Logis and Heavies dont have a place in this game, Dropships are good for about 30s to get your FGs and Snipers onto buildings with no ladders. Tanks are pretty much redline rail snipers anymore. You may not have played a chromosome corp match but it becomes really clear in true organized play, that the winning team will always be the one with more assaults.
That gets diluted as player count increases in matches though. As you get more players vs more players, specialization becomes incredibly powerful. However the PS3 could never handle more than 16v16, cause its an archaic POS with 256 MB of ram. Also, the inability for this game to get reach more than 25-30 fps, and horrible input issues given the way the console works. All of these issues could be solved if the game was brought to a more capable platform.
So I disagree, the experience is dictated entirely by the platform its played on. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
2867
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 16:57:00 -
[14] - Quote
Aighun wrote:Moment to moment game play is the most important thing that needs improvement. It is the core and foundation of this game. Uprising did not bring the progress that many of us were hoping for. Well... it hasn't YET, anyway.
I'm not going to say anything for sure, but with the nature of the problems holding the game back, I believe that CCP have the potential to - within the current build - make the game handle a LOT better than it does right now. I'm doubtful they can do it before the 14th now, and have openly stated that I think delaying the release is a good idea with all the issues still on the table, but that doesn't mean I expect us to be waiting 6 months before the game is playable and fun again. |
Natu Nobilis
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
229
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 17:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
OP wants to talk about the spirit of the game, and a lot of people are talking about the mechanics.
Mechanics you can change at any time after effort, the "soul" of the game, no. |
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |