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Keyser Soze VerbalKint
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Posted - 2013.04.28 13:34:00 -
[1] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Himiko Kuronaga wrote:The game was born from Eve, and is attached to Eve. It is supposed to appeal to people who, at the very least, have some kind of interest in Eve.
So why expect something radically different? You are saying that this game is supposed to appeal to eve players? That is auto fail right there. This game is supposed to appeal to those who wish for more than meaningless and conventional shooters. I understand that this game is connected to eve and that there should be similarities but dust is an fps, unlike eve.....so the approach to the game has to be different. For example, passive skill point accrual works well in eve but would not work for the success of dust as an fps. Regarding passive SP, why do you feel that way?
edit-deleted misread |
Keyser Soze VerbalKint
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Posted - 2013.04.28 13:41:00 -
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For all the EVE players saying dust is supposed to appeal to eve player primarily, why wasn't it put on PC?
Cause only EVE players would play it.
The goal was to gain a new audience to join the New Eden Universe and experience the New Eden Universe through a different lens. That doesnt mean that every aspect of the game has to follow the mantra of the New Eden Universe. Just the core elements do on how the games interact and interconnect.
Beyond that they can be 2 radically different games doesn't matter.
The steadfast addiction to trying to make Dust like EVE in every facet by the failed EVE carebears is strikingly alarming in this forum. You are destroying your own game. Please stop.
Kbai. |
Keyser Soze VerbalKint
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Posted - 2013.04.28 14:06:00 -
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DeeJay One wrote:Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote:
The steadfast addiction to trying to make Dust like EVE in every facet by the failed EVE carebears is strikingly alarming in this forum. You are destroying your own game. Please stop.
Problem is that the same can be said about people wanting it to be exactly like MAG or COD/BF
Don't want the game to be MAG of COD/BF.
I enjoy the interconnectedness of EVE and the persistance aspect. But when every move in regards to core gameplay issue that primarily deal with the FPS experience of the game is blocked by EVE hardcore in an effort to create a EVE FPS it destroys any chance this game has of being great to the playerbase that will most vitalize the game and the universe.
Have i blocked or attempted to block
2* market
direct player transfer
EVE capsuleer support
The need for eve in manufacturing
The Risk/reward mechanic of gear usage in pubs based on ISK(though it will eventually fail unless a gear restriction is created for pubs cause the uber wealthy will pubstomp as all veteran of FPS and MMO tend to do)
Alliance standings
Bounty systems
The SP progression(rate of progression is irrelevant and personally should be uninhibited by capping if there are going to be gaps lets their be gaps its an MMO right?)
Have i screwed with FW or PC in its ability to connect with EVE, in fact i have pushed for more connections. That bunker system they used during the dust tourney is exactly a mechanic this game needs to truly push the Dust-EVE link
But when you try to make the game too much sandbox it breaksdown because in the end this is a lobby shooter. And for new players its a lobby shooter with only 2 game modes. Variants do not work the same as different and distinct game modes.
There needs to be a Dust equivalent of
Capture the flag
Demolition
Both of which could have translated into FW and PC as different types of battle scenarios. Not every game should be about destroying an MCC or establishing control of a district. First you need to weaken it by having its resources or its supply lines cut. This is how you factor in a demolition type game mode, a capture the flag(not a literal flag) is a the basis for raiding and pillaging and how you create a very desired EVE element in a FPS manner.
These are the things the EVE players need to understand or you doom your own game.
The Market, Space elevator, eve side manufacturing, supply/demand economy, risk reward elements have to be interwoven in time but you have to create the gameplay first and interweave those things around it not the other way around.
Think about eves progression and you know im right, well sorta gameplay in eve was never that amazing. But for console and FPS gamers of which this game is the intended market (i again say if it wasn't they would have put this on PC as a EVE expansion and made the FPS just a minigame kinda like that dogfighting simulator) you need to have the gameplay rock solid first and thats is the foundation if it is strong enough then all those EVE elements will flourish and the connection will be spectacular.
What the final presentations of FF showed is what i want to see too but you will never get it there if you continually put the cart before the horse.
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Keyser Soze VerbalKint
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Posted - 2013.04.28 14:31:00 -
[4] - Quote
Rorschach Mustang wrote:Dalton Smithe wrote:BlG MAMA wrote:Primarch2 wrote:I play DUST because it is within EVE, supported by it, crafted in the same style, the same lore, the same universe. Without the EvE connection its just another shooter, and I wouldn't give it a second look Same here , too bad i wont stay for long , P2W model is repulsing. This character and the others and Dust514 will most likely be deleted after 6 May. Aurum will still rule over ISK so there is no hope to have a chance in this game without $$$. It's not pay to win and never has been. You can be competitive with anyone out there with practice and the proper allocation of SP. In a firefight with two people of equal skill, the one with the more expensive equipment will always win. How is that not pay to win? It's pure numbers. If your weapon does more damage and you have higher armor. It doesn't matter if the opponent is evenly matched. You'll always win because your stuff IS better.
You mean like in BF me as a level 1 noob gets waxed by a level 100 Colonel? Is that P2W. I think you need to rethink that argument a lil more. |
Keyser Soze VerbalKint
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Posted - 2013.04.28 14:48:00 -
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Vrain Matari wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Himiko Kuronaga wrote:The game was born from Eve, and is attached to Eve. It is supposed to appeal to people who, at the very least, have some kind of interest in Eve.
So why expect something radically different? You are saying that this game is supposed to appeal to eve players? That is auto fail right there. This game is supposed to appeal to those who wish for more than meaningless and conventional shooters. I understand that this game is connected to eve and that there should be similarities but dust is an fps, unlike eve.....so the approach to the game has to be different. For example, passive skill point accrual works well in eve but would not work for the success of dust as an fps. Focusing on EVE is a little off-base. It's really that EVE and DUST are both windows into New Eden. The devs and some of the EVE vets have come to this realization over time - that the thing that really counts here is the universe our clones live in. And to be honest, when Forbes, Businessweek, The Economist, the Guardian or The New York times write articles about us, they really couldn't give a **** about EVE/DUST game mechanics. It's New Eden and the stories that come out of it that catch the attention of the world. Stories generated by people who absolutely love that universe and it's dynamics - EVE players. I will tell you this. Put all the shooters ever made together and the number of amazing human stories that have come out of them is exactly sweet f*** all. After trillions of player hours invested. In the end DUST must serve New Eden, and multiply the scope and the drama of the human stories that emerge from our virtual universe. Otherwise, in my eyes, Dust is useless.
How many EVE players you know that actually care about Dust, The enthusiasm for it was through the roof at FF 
You want to bring in new people into the universe. The window that they peer through need not be identical in every aspect otherwise why even have a seperate lens when a simple filter on the same lens would suffice? |
Keyser Soze VerbalKint
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Posted - 2013.04.29 02:22:00 -
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Mithridates VI wrote:This thread doesn't make any sense.
Is anyone posting comments related to the comments that came before them or are y'all just facemashing your keyboards?
The OP was a criticism of balanced, instanced combat which is what DUST is favouring at present, even though "6v6 instanced combat isnGÇÖt what Eve -with the whole single shard thing- is about" according to CCP Unifex.
All of the stuff about passive SP, etc, is off topic.
Yea but it evolved into a larger scale topic about what is and isnt EVE. When we refer to EVE do we refer to the game or the universe as the Universe is New Eden.
Extrapolating from this the next question is what is DUST. Is DUST an expansion of EVE, well no its as CCP puts it a second lens to the New Eden Universe.
So if EVE is one lens and Dust is another then the next question becomes is what is EVE as a game and does that mean Dust has to have the exact same priniciples or does is it have to be truer to the grander idea that is New Eden.
This philosphy and mindset is what guides development and gameplay. Its with this in mind the divides and arguments in this topic evolve from. Mainly what works for EVE as a method for experiencing New Eden doesnt have to be what drives Dust to participate or experience or influence the universe.
An analogy would be if EVE is an apple then DUST is apple pie, the pie is made up of apples but also has other elements to it. Too much apple in an apple pie and it can become tart. This is the driving force of the topic just because Dust is a part of the New Eden Universe doesnt mean it has to be a carbon copy of the game that preceded it.
And comes back full cirlce to the title of the topic even if it digresses from the main body. Dust is not EVE |
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