DUST Search - The Fate Of This Game For The Next Couple Years Will Be Determined in Just 2 Weeks

low genius wrote:

Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote:

undeadsoldier90 wrote:

Icy Tiger wrote:

Beast. I said 3 months ago, that Dust would fail if an update didn't come out in the next week. I said the same thing last year. Apparently, people care enough about a Beta to play it for about a year, more or less.

I'm not saying that you're wrong. But something must've been done right.

http://dustboard.com/global

About 2 million accounts made. Lets say 75% is gone, and 50% of the remainder are alts. Still about 250 000. Not bad.

Their you go again using logic..... stop it. Your going to make peoples brains hurt icy.

How many are still active?

You really think 250,000 are still online and playing regularly thats cute.

A FPS that has a regular base of active in the thousands doesnt last. sImply cause matchimaking will fail to find players and create full matches in the same region.

People stick around because the new build was announced and people decided to eat the grind to have SP for it.

Once this goes commercial on 5/14 the its a beta excuse goes out the window. Withi it any protections it might have, if content isn't added a quicker pace over the next 6 months much of the base falls. If the game doesnt find a way to get new players in and having fun without a burdensome grind or at least make the grind fun by reducing the severity of veteran pubstomp.

Fact is the majority of players who have this undying faith in CCP and their vision happen to be people who play EVE or are simply so thirst travesing the desert that is the modern gaming industry they will drink the sand they believe to be water.

However that is a small number at best and not entirely the type of player that CCP will want to sustain this game.

Again if thats the mindset and type of player they wanted why isn't this game on PC?

ccp doesn't give two kittens if a bunch of softcore console gamers quit dust. this game will be geared towards people who don't QQ their little asses off on the forums. people who see the grand design behind what they do. people who do not want another pos shooter like cod or battlefield, or whatever else you want to throw in there.

in fact, ccp INTENDS to make this game too hard for the people who cry when they don't get exactly what they want in the 'next build'.

because those people are uneducated in the ways of the eve gods. the eve gods are firm, but fair. and if you have to deal with your favorite weapon being trash for 3 or six months, then deal with it or get a new weapon.

when life gives you lemons, you shut up and eat your damn lemons.

the more beta grinders that quit, the better the opportunity for the next class.


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Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 129	Posted - 2013.04.28 13:28:00 - [1] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Crash Monster wrote: Thinking about the title of the thread... Maybe all the whiners will go away as they realize this is not going to be a simple clone of other FPS games? Then, after a few weeks, those of us who aren't looking for an FPS clone will play in peace... well, maybe not peace. ;) I'd be so grateful if they all went away. Would give CCP a chance to see how their game affects the community without all the petty non-sense from extroverts who's only concern is their extroverted ideals. Yes enjoy your game with noone playing it. Cite member count as if thats something to be impressed by. How many are actually aactive and continue to log back in. Its hard enough finding matches as it is, Try OMS on a late night see how many 8-10 persn matches you wind up in. The variants split already a small and isolated player base. FW will hopefully pull in vets and maybe you get a influx of new blood on 5/14 but for how long. You forget one thing b/w EVE and Dust is that dust is a lobby system while EVE is open world So even with a small number online its got 38,947 online currently you can pretty much run into any of them in that game. With DUst having say 6,000 people online at a given time(generous number i think) and region locking and varaints that split the pool the matchmaking breaks down. Now when there aren't enough player online in your region it finds players in other regions for you. With server side hit detection we all and latency we know how fun those game can be (going to enjoy seeing what happens in PC as a result) the game cease to be fun as the stability of it simply suffers. So yes maintain the attitude that all that is needed for this game to survive is the MMO neckbeard fanbois, the FPS players go and this game is done. Or you really think there are enough MMO enthusiasts on consoles that will want to play Dust 514 over other MMO experiences down the pipe. Really its players like you that damage the game and have stifled it from becoming a great experience with needless comparison to the growth of EVE and how Dust will mimic it because CCP is amazing and they deliver on every promise they have ever made and have never screwed anything up and because console players are patient, nurturing and willing to give developers 2,3 heck even 5 years of their time to a company or are the type to say hey you know what this game has passive SP maybe ill check back on it in 6 months. Yea not if another game has captured their attention. Most importantly consolers don't do second chances. They have been patient with CCP because they do great hype and they've allowed the its a beta mantra to cushion the blow. Launch means no more its a beta excuse to hide behind. Its put up or shut up. There are currently no games on PS3 to preoccupy time with other than Dust for most of the FPS enthusiasts. The last of US Destiny GTA V Killzone Shadowfall BF4 Along with just a host of amazing and great non FPS titles in the pipe will suck out the regular base of players that logon to this game because there is nothing else to play. That will not last much longer, so perhaps you need to get off the CCP is doing everything right bandwagon and wake up.
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 129	Posted - 2013.04.28 13:48:00 - [2] - Quote Aighun wrote: And to all of you higher sp beta tester tuff guys strutting in this thread, are you kidding me? Tell me you're kidding me. Are you seriously going to continue to squad up and fight instant battles just so you can stomp new players? Are you really that pathetic? Did you really just spend the last three months grinding the beta just so you could win agains someone who may have never played the game before? Just sad. Really sad. Maybe if the player count is so low in FW i cant find a decent game because of player count/connection issues then yea ill be pubstomping it up if i continue to play at all. Sorry playing FW or PC matters little if its still the same version of Skirmish i can get in pubs but with a less stable connection or player count. I can care less about my actions effecting story arc and my owning of territory if the basic gameplay integrity simply isnt enjoyable in pursuit of those venues. personally i would love to spend my days in FW when not in PC. I have zero desire to go into pubs not even to train new players in our 6 person squads, they will come to FW with us. But if you cant find full matches regularly or if the mathces that are full wind up being with players from all over the world and the connection issues that follow with it is all i see in FW and PC then yea ill pub until Last of US comes out and just wait for destiny. Go ahead and tell yourself im the minority in this mindset.
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 134	Posted - 2013.04.28 16:42:00 - [3] - Quote Beast Beastlington wrote: Excellent OP. Really sums it up in such a succinct manner. Still can't believe how many people can't understand the simple fact that having any kind of statistical advantage in an FPS is extremely bad for the balance of the game. The only deciding factor should be player skill/aim. Of course, you gotta have something to entice people to pony up for that Aurum eh? Yea, no. The mmo elements shouldn't be removed their just needs to be an area for veterans to take their higher level characters to, which are coming. And their should be security status in pubs that limits use of gear using a restriction or meta level. The meta level allows for variety but still maintain a relative balance b/w players in pub matches. Of course you get the sandbox purists who flip and say thats not sandbox mmo and doesnt belong in EVE, result you drive away noobies who simply arent going to grind through. Sorry PVE isn't a logical answer, ppl dont want to grind their way in PVE to play PVP, there has to be an entry point where new players can PVP without the veteran smash. I further find it hypocritical and ironic that while imps get accused of wanting to engage in noob pubsmash we advocate a restriction that would prevent it and its the sandbox MMO purists that fight against it. If you are dead set against pub smashing then whats the problem? Arent the passive skill advantages you have enough of an MMO edge for you? Passive skills btw still give a MMO style edge in a gear restricted environment so its not a purely level playing field either. Do this and balancing gear tiers is not something that should ever be considered. In fact we can start expanding the gaps between gear tiers again since players wont be using them in highsec pub matches if they are restricted or they are basically impossible to fit given meta level restrictions. This saves them for higher stakes arenas like FW, PC and eventually nullsec where their use is warranted and justified. Oh and statistical advantages exist in FPS as well by way of access to higher end guns at higher experience character levels. Its just that health is so low in arena FPS games like COD/BF3 that any gun can statistically do well and they are far from strafe shooters.
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 137	Posted - 2013.04.28 20:59:00 - [4] - Quote Sleepy Zan wrote: Clearly CCP is doing something write since so many including the OP actually care about the fate of the game still. Me on the other hand has stopped caring awhile ago Yea but we'll suck you back in sooner or later. Omni just came back yesterday and others are starting to come outta the woodwork. You will never escape us Sleepy, NEVER!!
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 139	Posted - 2013.04.28 22:51:00 - [5] - Quote undeadsoldier90 wrote: Icy Tiger wrote: Beast. I said 3 months ago, that Dust would fail if an update didn't come out in the next week. I said the same thing last year. Apparently, people care enough about a Beta to play it for about a year, more or less. I'm not saying that you're wrong. But something must've been done right. http://dustboard.com/global About 2 million accounts made. Lets say 75% is gone, and 50% of the remainder are alts. Still about 250 000. Not bad. Their you go again using logic..... stop it. Your going to make peoples brains hurt icy. How many are still active? You really think 250,000 are still online and playing regularly thats cute. A FPS that has a regular base of active in the thousands doesnt last. sImply cause matchimaking will fail to find players and create full matches in the same region. People stick around because the new build was announced and people decided to eat the grind to have SP for it. Once this goes commercial on 5/14 the its a beta excuse goes out the window. Withi it any protections it might have, if content isn't added a quicker pace over the next 6 months much of the base falls. If the game doesnt find a way to get new players in and having fun without a burdensome grind or at least make the grind fun by reducing the severity of veteran pubstomp. Fact is the majority of players who have this undying faith in CCP and their vision happen to be people who play EVE or are simply so thirst travesing the desert that is the modern gaming industry they will drink the sand they believe to be water. However that is a small number at best and not entirely the type of player that CCP will want to sustain this game. Again if thats the mindset and type of player they wanted why isn't this game on PC?
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 140	Posted - 2013.04.29 00:21:00 - [6] - Quote low genius wrote: Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote: undeadsoldier90 wrote: Icy Tiger wrote: Beast. I said 3 months ago, that Dust would fail if an update didn't come out in the next week. I said the same thing last year. Apparently, people care enough about a Beta to play it for about a year, more or less. I'm not saying that you're wrong. But something must've been done right. http://dustboard.com/global About 2 million accounts made. Lets say 75% is gone, and 50% of the remainder are alts. Still about 250 000. Not bad. Their you go again using logic..... stop it. Your going to make peoples brains hurt icy. How many are still active? You really think 250,000 are still online and playing regularly thats cute. A FPS that has a regular base of active in the thousands doesnt last. sImply cause matchimaking will fail to find players and create full matches in the same region. People stick around because the new build was announced and people decided to eat the grind to have SP for it. Once this goes commercial on 5/14 the its a beta excuse goes out the window. Withi it any protections it might have, if content isn't added a quicker pace over the next 6 months much of the base falls. If the game doesnt find a way to get new players in and having fun without a burdensome grind or at least make the grind fun by reducing the severity of veteran pubstomp. Fact is the majority of players who have this undying faith in CCP and their vision happen to be people who play EVE or are simply so thirst travesing the desert that is the modern gaming industry they will drink the sand they believe to be water. However that is a small number at best and not entirely the type of player that CCP will want to sustain this game. Again if thats the mindset and type of player they wanted why isn't this game on PC? ccp doesn't give two kittens if a bunch of softcore console gamers quit dust. this game will be geared towards people who don't QQ their little asses off on the forums. people who see the grand design behind what they do. people who do not want another pos shooter like cod or battlefield, or whatever else you want to throw in there. in fact, ccp INTENDS to make this game too hard for the people who cry when they don't get exactly what they want in the 'next build'. because those people are uneducated in the ways of the eve gods. the eve gods are firm, but fair. and if you have to deal with your favorite weapon being trash for 3 or six months, then deal with it or get a new weapon. when life gives you lemons, you shut up and eat your damn lemons. the more beta grinders that quit, the better the opportunity for the next class. So why were dropsuits, weapons, tanks and everything else nerfed between the tiers? Why did everyone choose option 2 instead of 5 when it came time to choose a temporary SP system until rollover is implemented? Its quite pathetic how ppl talk about how this game doesnt cater to the softcore casual yet at every turn you whiny lil carebear crybabies whined and moaned to prevent these things from coming to frution. But talk about advancing FPS ideals of gameplay balance or things like and you evetards come flyiing in desperate to keep the game as you see it should be. As i said the evetards will continue to ruin this game into nothigness. But tell yourself it will do just fine on console. Still haven't answered if the market they wanted is the one you suggest why not PC? Console market is different and we know it. Hardcore console and hardcore FPS is not hardcore MMO sooner you philistines realize it the better off this game will be.
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 142	Posted - 2013.04.29 01:03:00 - [7] - Quote Crash Monster wrote: Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote: Its quite pathetic how ppl talk about how this game doesnt cater to the softcore casual yet at every turn you whiny lil carebear crybabies whined and moaned to prevent these things from coming to frution. I'm not following your logic... People didnt want option 5 which had an unlimted soft cap only restricted by 1WP=1SP. Many ppl complained it would create too large a SP gap(sounds like a casual/carebear excuse to me) with power grinders creating large gaps and that the cap is needed to prevent people reaching max characters too soon. Nevermind that the excuse is worhtless on a few levels First many of the MMO players threw back HTFU and its a MMO to all the new players that talked about the SP gap b/w vets and new players in pubs but in the same breath voiced down that option. Moreover they said that SP gaps are irrelevant since characters grow wider not taller and after 4-8M SP it really doesnt matter if you spend it right and specialize. Second it never allowed for unrestricted growth but only served as a throttle with 1wp=1sp. People argued that you could still earn the 3-4K WP mark in skirmish however to do so actually requires people to play and use tanks and other things. Answer me this if ppl could grind soft cap like that how much more skirmish matches do you think people would be playing right now instead of AFKing in an effort to power grind? The weapons/suit nerfs go against MMO but does lil to solve the issue of passives, a better solution would have been gear or meta level restriction based on security status of matches making pub matches the Dust equivalent of EVE highsec. Of course people argued that ISK payout would restrict well enough especially with the gear flattening. In this regard both the FPS and the MMO failed because the FPS players wanted gear to not be a deciding factor but they also wanted to have the ability to take basic gear and be able to jump into higher level games in eventual FW and the like this was around Nov-Jan. Moreover we know from nullsec sov and Titans what happens when you try to use ISK as a deterrant So yea carebears on both sides who have no clue what they are talking about screwed up the game and made it worse /discussion.
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 167	Posted - 2013.05.01 15:35:00 - [8] - Quote BursegSardaukar wrote: Moejoe Omnipotent wrote: Sloth9230 wrote: New players need to understand that I have spent 3 months grinding so that I can have an advantage over them. They could have done the same, all they had to do was download the Beta, didn't feel like putting up with this "crappy" game? That's too damn bad, I did put up with, now prepare to get stomped. TL:DR, "Fairness" can suck it. Have fun playing with the like 12 other people who share the same elitist mindset as you for the next 2 years. The thing I love about Dust-hate from well-established, revered/feared/hated groups is it gives a my little Alliance more credibility. We've all been playing Dust for less than a year, a lot of these Dust corps are only a couple months old, a lot of the Dust Alliances are the same age. My corp has been around since '07 and my Alliance since '09. We haven't gone anywhere and we won't be going anywhere. If/When all the CoD/Bungie fanboys jump ship, I certainly am not going anywhere.... partly because I'm a CCP fanboy, but mostly because I love Dust and EVE and keep my eyes to the future. So when all the youngster Dust Alliances failcascade and split into the established EVE ones, you can count Tso's in that number that will remain. Scanners detect neckbeard fanboi. Perhaps you should ask yourself if you were the target demo why isn't this game on PC? Did you buy a PS3 just for dust too, its okay we know many of you neckbeards did
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 168	Posted - 2013.05.01 16:17:00 - [9] - Quote BursegSardaukar wrote: CCP didn't want to cannibalize their existing fan base, or so they claim. I'm fairly convinced back room deals were made with lots of money exchanged, I'm not sure why anyone would develop a shooter for a console to be completely honest. At least they have KB/M support. And yup, PS3 just for Dust, TV as well. Didn't have much use for either before. I also keep my neckbeard tightly braided, it can pass as a necktie. That right there is why you fail to understand the larger part of this community. Many not all are shooter players who have evolved from CS 1.6 on PC to console shooters as far back as Goldeneye and have evolved and matured with the genre as they grew older. For them they love the genre and they love it on console because they like playing it on a large television on their couch laying back after a long hard day of work or school. To them shooting ppl in the face is their destress mechanism. They cam to Dust not because it was going to be another generic shooter. But becuase of the promise of the next evolution in the genre. PERSISTANCE. That the actions and decisions they make have meaningful impact, after all whats the point of playing virtual soldier if your skill and proficiency of your actions are meaningless beyond a statistic on a board? That said they still expect a fluid and ultimately enjoable shooter experience. They dont forgive poor gameplay for the promise of a persistant world. The console market is different from the PC market. You EVE players think you have the market cornered on persistance and player driven content. Im telling you don't count your chickens before they hatch. Shooter devs are catching on that persistance and acttions/consequence is the next step in the genre. Dust has the headstart on that aspect of the game but they are novices at the core of the genre which is the gameplay of the shooter itself. If the other shooter devs (Bungie being the most clear example) can create that feel of persistance and actions/consequence in a game that delivers a quality shooter experience, watch the MAG and other hardcore shooter players many of whom flocked to this game migrate and go and with it your playerbase tank. Once that happens good luck finding matches, Good luck ever getting this game past 16v16 because it will never happen. You need numbers to support it and while the model you say worked well in EVE, EVE in on PC and DUST is on console two different mindset of players. TL;DR By your own admission that you dont understand why a dev would develop a shooter on console is clear indication you don't understand the majority of this base. We didnt come here for just another shooter experience, but we damn well expect that in addition to all the unique things Dust can offer. BUt fail to meet us on the shooter experience we wil go play another one until a game can deliver that experience and the persistance. Perhaps those players can explain that a bit better but the fact you fail to understand us and assume we will just stay because CCP is awesome and you have "faith" is short sighted because again as a person who at the core seems to be a "PC master race" kind of guy dont understand the console player mind. I do and many other in here do. We dont want a bland vanilla shooter. Put it succintly we'd like some hardcore shooter with our NEW EDEN HTFU, Player driven content persistance please.
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 169	Posted - 2013.05.01 16:19:00 - [10] - Quote Pris Straton wrote: Keyser Soze VerbalKint wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: Moejoe Omnipotent wrote: Sloth9230 wrote: New players need to understand that I have spent 3 months grinding so that I can have an advantage over them. They could have done the same, all they had to do was download the Beta, didn't feel like putting up with this "crappy" game? That's too damn bad, I did put up with, now prepare to get stomped. TL:DR, "Fairness" can suck it. Have fun playing with the like 12 other people who share the same elitist mindset as you for the next 2 years. The thing I love about Dust-hate from well-established, revered/feared/hated groups is it gives a my little Alliance more credibility. We've all been playing Dust for less than a year, a lot of these Dust corps are only a couple months old, a lot of the Dust Alliances are the same age. My corp has been around since '07 and my Alliance since '09. We haven't gone anywhere and we won't be going anywhere. If/When all the CoD/Bungie fanboys jump ship, I certainly am not going anywhere.... partly because I'm a CCP fanboy, but mostly because I love Dust and EVE and keep my eyes to the future. So when all the youngster Dust Alliances failcascade and split into the established EVE ones, you can count Tso's in that number that will remain. Scanners detect neckbeard fanboi. Perhaps you should ask yourself if you were the target demo why isn't this game on PC? Did you buy a PS3 just for dust too, its okay we know many of you neckbeards did What are you going to say when Dust comes out on the PC? It will eventually. Before or after they make it a AAA shooter on PS3 and upgrade it for PS4? So 2015, 2016? Will the game still have a base to drive the instanced matchmaking?

Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 172	Posted - 2013.05.01 19:22:00 - [11] - Quote EVE-Daniel wrote: ok guys you know that if they really didn't like dust then they wouldn't be playing it, all these guys are, is 1 big troll We like the concept of Dust. A shooter experience in an evolving persistant world where there is action and consequence. The fatal mistake in fanboi thinking is that New Eden and by extension Dust is the only universe that will exist in the coming decade that will allow for this concept. With PS4 it is already becoming self evident that gameing and game development is moving more towards social gaming. That means creating communities that will travel in spheres from game to game as the bonds between players become more solidified. This already exists in gaming clans. Shooter developers are catching on to this concept and looking to hybrid the shooter genre with the persistent world model of MMO/RPG. Defiance was one iteration of this but its a PVE game so its already meh just becuase. But dont think for a second defiance didnt have cool concepts that pushed the iteration of a Shooter MMO forward. Note how i put shooter first because that is the genre that is the most popular on console and the most lucrative market to tap into. Destiny though we know nothing much of it. i can assure you will be the competitor of Dust. If it allows for all the persistance, intrigue, plotting and action/consequence that Dust provide in a more polished enjoyable shooter experience the sails will get sucked out of Dust because the shooter hardcore move in waves and pockets. The shooter vets in here are mostly MAG vets but also play BF, COD, Uncharted, KZ, Socom, R;FOM and more. They all came here because they are ready for that next evolution in shooters :PERSISTANCE and the feel that actions matter. But if DUST fails to deliver on the shooter experience then no amount of persistance will matter to them. They will leave and not come back. And there will be competitors that will fill this gap. To bury your head in the sand and blindly put faith into any corporation is simply being foolish and dismissive of a population you may not fully understand. And in a instanced lobby shooter game once player counts drop low enough the stability of matches suffer as the game has to stretch over the globe to populate the games and you get incredible lag and rubber banding. In fact thats is already happening so you may want to consider that in your analysis before saying this game is doing fine and will be just okay because EVE did it so can Dust. EVE had a niche to grow in without competition for quite some time, not many Spaceship MMOs when it dropped. Plenty of FPS and soon in the coming year(s) plenty of persistant world FPS MMOs will be developed; its simply the next evolution of the genre.