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xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
22
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Posted - 2013.04.14 11:00:00 -
[1] - Quote
Legal, Legal, Legally. I keep hearing this on this subject, but how many of you have actually sought legal advice on this subject?
None?
Thought so.
What you'll find is your blatant attempt to essentially scam CCP out of free stuff by threatening "legal action" is totally flawed. The reason that the refund would have happened was in the event of a full reset on commercial release, resulting in the loss of all AUR benefits and items.
Trying to squeeze CCP for refunds is VERY unethical and immoral. You're twisting the spirit of what was written to your own ends.
So send complaints to Sony. I'm sure they will give in to a couple of dozen people who are blatantly trying to take advantage of CCP, and threaten to shut down Dust, a game which is probably making them thousands of dollars a day.
Also, "commercial release" isn't the same as "out of beta". The game was technically commercially released when it went live on tranquillity and "no more resets or wipes" were announced (note... "no more RESETS"). An AUR reset happened then, just as promised. |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
23
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Posted - 2013.04.14 11:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:xaerael Kabiel wrote:Legal, Legal, Legally. I keep hearing this on this subject, but how many of you have actually sought legal advice on this subject? Got a friend whose mother is a lawyer, and has been through similar cases to this one more than once, all of which were resolved in the customer's favour. Asked her to look at the original wording of the Merc Pack compared with the current wording, and got her to look at multiple official sources - from both Sony and CCP - stating that the game isn't commercially released yet. She says there's a really solid case. I also had a friend who's in a law degree doing a case study specifically based around online purchases and the relevant laws, and he can't see any possible way for a lawsuit to fail if CCP don't give some form of refund of Merc Pack content to the purchasers who bought it with the original terms. Does that count? Quote:Also, "commercial release" isn't the same as "out of beta". The game was technically commercially released when it went live on tranquillity and "no more resets or wipes" were announced (note... "no more RESETS"). An AUR reset happened then, just as promised. As mentioned, both CCP and Sony have gone on record, publicly, stating that the game isn't yet commercially released. When people approach Sony about the issue, they specifically refuse to get involved until commercial release. When people have been arguing that the game is commercially released, CCP have said no, and in a thread where people were discussing the wording of the Human Endurance event's original posting, there was mention of Uprising "leading into commercial release" and CCP directly stated that Uprising WILL NOT BE THE RELEASE BUILD.
A friend who's mom's a lawyer eh? OK! go pay them to get your $$$ back!
Hope they're no win no fee... You don't want to be demanding refunds from them too... |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
23
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Posted - 2013.04.14 11:42:00 -
[3] - Quote
Rasatsu wrote:JL3Eleven wrote:When the game goes into commercial release they are legally obligated to refund it again and without any SP wipes like people are saying. Sorry if you didnt see a good deal when they were waving it in your face begging you to take advantage of it.
Edit: we have not hit commercial release yet. They are not legally obligated to not wipe your SP. If you push them they'll just pull the same move they did against the RMT buyer that threatened legal action over getting banned; they unbanned him and set his wallet to many billions in the negative. These days they do it to all RMT buyers. CCP should just make the offer explicit; option for merc pack refund in exchange for SP reset.
I'd like them to run with that actually.
Anyone who wants an AUR refund has their account fully reset also, since that's the spirit of the wording. |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
23
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Posted - 2013.04.14 11:48:00 -
[4] - Quote
JL3Eleven wrote:xaerael Kabiel wrote:Rasatsu wrote:JL3Eleven wrote:When the game goes into commercial release they are legally obligated to refund it again and without any SP wipes like people are saying. Sorry if you didnt see a good deal when they were waving it in your face begging you to take advantage of it.
Edit: we have not hit commercial release yet. They are not legally obligated to not wipe your SP. If you push them they'll just pull the same move they did against the RMT buyer that threatened legal action over getting banned; they unbanned him and set his wallet to many billions in the negative. These days they do it to all RMT buyers. CCP should just make the offer explicit; option for merc pack refund in exchange for SP reset. I'd like them to run with that actually. Anyone who wants an AUR refund has their account fully reset also, since that's the spirit of the wording. Yea that will sell tons of future items for CCP. Hey buy this so we can screw you later. Wont happen.
Actually, there's only a few dozen (if that) morons trying to play space lawyer, Probably less than 0.5% of the player base. Water off a duck's back losing them. To be honest, I'd rather they were all booted anyway, because they're the same people who keep crying about other things, and prevent intelligent conversations from developing because of their incessant self entitled cry-posts spamming the forums to death. |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
23
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Posted - 2013.04.14 12:06:00 -
[5] - Quote
JL3Eleven wrote:
And your the freeloader that want something you don't deserve. IE me getting punished for supporting CCP. But please continue.
Nice assumption, but wrong. I've bought a merc pack each month I've been playing. Will gladly take a photo of the 3 dragonfly bpos and 3 toxin bpos. |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
23
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Posted - 2013.04.14 12:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
JL3Eleven wrote:xaerael Kabiel wrote:JL3Eleven wrote:
And your the freeloader that want something you don't deserve. IE me getting punished for supporting CCP. But please continue.
Nice assumption, but wrong. I've bought a merc pack each month I've been playing. Will gladly take a photo of the 3 dragonfly bpos and 3 toxin bpos. And? Did you not agree to the same terms I did? Edit: o wait u bought them too late right?
Nope, The T&C had the refund clause, but I'm not ******** and fully understood that the spirit of the wording was because the original intention was the wipe everything when the game left beta, and when wiping the server was removed from the equation, so were refunds.
Cry more. |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
23
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Posted - 2013.04.14 12:43:00 -
[7] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Ryder Azorria wrote:1: I'm guessing your friends mom didn't read the EULA (I have. Spoiler: you're screwed.) EULA wrote: You are responsible for reviewing the Fees section of the Game for changes in the Fee or payment terms. If a change is unacceptable to you, you may, as your sole and exclusive remedy, terminate the EULA and close your Account as described in section 13 below. You are responsible for paying all applicable taxes and for all hardware, software, Internet service, and other costs you incur to access the System.
No, she didn't read the EULA. There's a good reason for that. It's not relevant to the purchase agreement, the contents of which include the product description as it stood at the time of purchase. Doesn't matter what civilised country you're applying the laws for - I'd say "even" Britain, but "especially" might fit better, since they offer better consumer protection than most US states, in which this is still not legal - but you can't retroactively use a digital product's EULA to get out of ANY detail included in a purchase agreement. Spoiler: The product description in an online store legally comprises a part of the purchase agreement. By British law as well as US, NZ, Australian and most other countries that actually have consumer laws with any possibility of application to online purchases.
Uh, The EULA overrides everything. You're wrong.
Like I said before, If you can actually find a Lawyer stupid/desperate enough to take the case, try to prosecute. Don't be sad when you fail though. |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
23
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Posted - 2013.04.14 12:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
ALM1GHTY STATIUS wrote:I am only trying to get what I agreed to purchase. This is complete and utter bullshit that they'd even attempt anything such as this, I gave them MY money as an investment in the hopes of creating a better game, and now they stab me in the back by not fullfilling their end of the agreement AND take my money. unacceptable by any company.
No, you're being dishonest. You have to be a special kind of idiot to not understand the reasoning behind the original refund offer.
So pick, dishonest or idiot. |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
23
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Posted - 2013.04.14 12:53:00 -
[9] - Quote
The refund clause was in place because the original intent was there would be a full server wipe. Keep up! |
xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
24
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Posted - 2013.04.14 12:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
JL3Eleven wrote: BUT there IS one for going into commercial release, which is yet to happen as stated by CCP.
Wrong. There's no more resets or wipes, unless something catastrophic happens.
Stop being dishonest. |
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xaerael Kabiel
Immobile Infantry
28
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Posted - 2013.04.14 15:27:00 -
[11] - Quote
How in hell is it bullying? I hate space internet lawyers and their total abuse of the English language.
The only bullying going on in this is you guys threatening legal action on CCP for not giving you free space money because you found what you think is an easy target loophole in the wording of something, and you're going against the spirit of CCP's honesty in regards to refunds on resets.
Dishonest. To the core. |
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