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Lord Sesshomarux
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
Ive been playing FPS games for a while, and depending which game, it always seems like sniping takes the most skill.
This is depending of course on the FPS.
Games like battlefield or Dust, where headshots are quite needed for OHK's,
seem to be where snipers have to hae the most skills, just to do well.
Ive also noticed alot of these maps are close quarters, which means a sniper is out of his league really.
ive also noticed assault rifles have a really good accuracy at all ranges, and that you can easily sinpe with one too.
anyways,
am I wrong to assume that as a sniper, I take the msot skill to be the best on the battlefield? |
JL3Eleven
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group
274
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
Lord Sesshomarux wrote:Ive been playing FPS games for a while, and depending which game, it always seems like sniping takes the most skill.
This is depending of course on the FPS.
Games like battlefield or Dust, where headshots are quite needed for OHK's,
seem to be where snipers have to hae the most skills, just to do well.
Ive also noticed alot of these maps are close quarters, which means a sniper is out of his league really.
ive also noticed assault rifles have a really good accuracy at all ranges, and that you can easily sinpe with one too.
anyways,
am I wrong to assume that as a sniper, I take the msot skill to be the best on the battlefield?
or perhaps, its my weapon, the basic sniper that is pretty needed for skill.
getting a kill on a moving target is always hard.
Yes, you are wrong with your assumption that sniping takes skill. |
HOMMANDO
Immobile Infantry
52
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:20:00 -
[3] - Quote
Any brain dead idiot can sit on a mountain and shoot at the occasional enemy that enters their line of sight. Sniper rifles in this game use hit scan, so no, it doesn't take skill to use one. |
Charizard Zakalwe
Immobile Infantry
33
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:22:00 -
[4] - Quote
This is some sort of awfully written troll post, right? No matter how skilled you are, you'll never be a useful sniper. Stop thinking you will be. Just man up, shoot mans with useful guns, and stop hiding in the redline. |
Lord Sesshomarux
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2013.04.13 04:23:00 -
[5] - Quote
HOMMANDO wrote:Any brain dead idiot can sit on a mountain and shoot at the occasional enemy that enters their line of sight. Sniper rifles in this game use hit scan, so no, it doesn't take skill to use one.
what is hit scan?
is this FPS actually giving snipers a better chance at the game compared to battlefield?
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Tarquin Markel
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group
100
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:26:00 -
[6] - Quote
Lord Sesshomarux wrote:am I wrong to assume that as a sniper, I take the msot skill to be the best on the battlefield?
I'd say (speaking as a frequent sniper myself) that as a dedicated sniper, you need the most skill to turn the tide of a match.
Snipers are very good at killing. They are not so good at turning the tide of battle, and a close-quarters battle with everybody dancing around everybody else is rarely going to have a different outcome because you were shooting into it. Not "never," but rarely.
As a sniper, the most vital function you typically perform for your team is taking out hostile snipers so that they can do their jobs unmolested. This does take skill (and some understanding of how the map works and why-- beware the misnamed "head glitch"), but, because snipers are typically motionless, the easiest prey for a sniper is another sniper.
What takes the most skill? Eh ... it depends on who you ask. Every role in DUST requires a goodly dose of it; this is not a forgiving game. Even heavies tend to die horribly if they get in over their heads, which they find easy to do.
I suppose the best answer to the question, "What takes the most skill?" is another question:
"At what?" |
HOMMANDO
Immobile Infantry
52
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:30:00 -
[7] - Quote
Lord Sesshomarux wrote: what is hit scan?
If your reticle is over the enemy when you fire, you will hit them.
No bullet drop, no travel time, you just hit. |
Lord Sesshomarux
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:32:00 -
[8] - Quote
Tarquin Markel wrote:Lord Sesshomarux wrote:am I wrong to assume that as a sniper, I take the msot skill to be the best on the battlefield? I'd say (speaking as a frequent sniper myself) that as a dedicated sniper, you need the most skill to turn the tide of a match. Snipers are very good at killing. They are not so good at turning the tide of battle, and a close-quarters battle with everybody dancing around everybody else is rarely going to have a different outcome because you were shooting into it. Not "never," but rarely. As a sniper, the most vital function you typically perform for your team is taking out hostile snipers so that they can do their jobs unmolested. This does take skill (and some understanding of how the map works and why-- beware the misnamed "head glitch"), but, because snipers are typically motionless, the easiest prey for a sniper is another sniper. What takes the most skill? Eh ... it depends on who you ask. Every role in DUST requires a goodly dose of it; this is not a forgiving game. Even heavies tend to die horribly if they get in over their heads, which they find easy to do. I suppose the best answer to the question, "What takes the most skill?" is another question: "At what?"
so from what im understanding, everythin takes skill right?
This game is balanced so that each class has a chance to do just as well as the others?
In Bf3, Sniping was the HARDEST thing to do esp for kills, at least it was on my ps3. PC is different probally with it, but then again, you still have people running around making it harder for headshots.
anyway, so in thsi game, sniping is actually really good to be ompared to other FPS's? |
Lord Sesshomarux
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:32:00 -
[9] - Quote
HOMMANDO wrote:Lord Sesshomarux wrote: what is hit scan? If your reticle is over the enemy when you fire, you will hit them. No bullet drop, no travel time, you just hit.
So I do not need to lead a target, if my reticule is over the target, boom auto hit? |
Tarquin Markel
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group
100
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 04:50:00 -
[10] - Quote
Lord Sesshomarux wrote:anyway, so in thsi game, sniping is actually really good to be ompared to other FPS's?
I don't know that I'd say "good."
Shells have no travel time and no drop. Scopes are very low-power. Charge sniper rifles hit like a ton of bricks and tactical sniper rifles can triple-tap with absurd precision very quickly. And don't get us started on the Thale's.
However, snipers have to be ENTIRELY MOTIONLESS AND CROUCHED to line up a long-range shot, and normally have the kind of tunnel vision you'd expect from a guy whose attention is five hundred yards away.
... So I'm not sure I'd say "bad," either. The unfortunate assault rifle specialists who suffer daily under sniper fire at Manus Peak are free to disagree.
Bare in mind that even if we count all of the above as "working as intended," there's still the infamous head glitch, actually a terrain rendering issue that results in a lot of differences of opinion between sniper and snipee as to whether the snipee is out from under cover. Distant terrain doesn't have the polygons for detailed rendering, so rough approximations are made, resulting a many a miss that the attacker has good reason to feel cheated by.
This is a free game in beta. Bear this in mind, and pray that CCP hears ... um, your prayers.
Anyhow.
Determining how well the balance is set up in a CCP game is not as easy as you'd think. The suits are customizable to an absurd degree, so the real question is whether one suit's range of options comprehensively renders it inferior to another suit's range of options. Current popular opinion seems to be that heavies are maybe too strong at the low end, assaults are maybe too strong at the high end, and scout suits are just kind of gimped (though I run scout almost exclusively and find this highly debatable-- my shields recharge like lightning and I get hit much less often).
Kill farming with a sniper is generally relatively easy; you're likely to get a few kills per death, leading to a high K/Dr ... which is all well and good, except that you will tend to lose a lot of matches. The classic "sniper stat" pattern is high K/Dr, bad win/loss ratio, implying that your presence on your team is a net negative.
This is not something that corporations much want.
If you like the sniper "lifestyle," I'd advise you to start matches in a more assault or stealth-oriented role to try and seize control of the field, then switch to sniping when (1) the battle is won, (2) the battle is irretrievably lost, or (3) the enemy is driving you crazy with snipers.
Pack remote explosives, and you can provide your team a "get out of hacking free" card. This works especially well if there's an objective a hundred yards or so from your sniper perch. |
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Rei Shepard
Spectre II
142
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Posted - 2013.04.13 05:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Unless you are using the sniper at shotgun ranges in Dust, it takes about 0 skill to sit somewhere high on a mountain and take shots at people unaware you are there. |
2100 Angels
The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION
49
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 05:18:00 -
[12] - Quote
Lord Sesshomarux wrote:Ive been playing FPS games for a while, and depending which game, it always seems like sniping takes the most skill.
This is depending of course on the FPS.
Games like battlefield or Dust, where headshots are quite needed for OHK's,
seem to be where snipers have to hae the most skills, just to do well.
Ive also noticed alot of these maps are close quarters, which means a sniper is out of his league really.
ive also noticed assault rifles have a really good accuracy at all ranges, and that you can easily sinpe with one too.
anyways,
am I wrong to assume that as a sniper, I take the msot skill to be the best on the battlefield?
or perhaps, its my weapon, the basic sniper that is pretty needed for skill.
getting a kill on a moving target is always hard.
If I have any advice to give, it is that you should not take the whining of people on these forums as an accurate representation of in-game sniping. The class is what you make it. A lot of the hate derives from "red line sniping", that is, when newberries get pushed back to their red line they all take up sniper rifles and stop trying to push for objectives OR when a sniper camps behind the red line where he/she can't be killed by another sniper. These positions often have little to no overwatch on the battlefield and so are relatively useless. Having said that though, there are a couple of red line positions that provide useful overwatch.
I personally snipe almost exclusively, and in ambush matches, which have the sole objective of getting kills.. so arguing that a high KDR is bad for this game type is a fairly untenable position.
In comparison to other games, I've personally not played BF3, but it is a lot more realistic than sniping in the COD series which allowed for quickscoping (dust doesn't). I enjoy my role and I'd say many people I've squadded with have found me useful on the battlefield, so it really is what you make it.
Lord Sesshomarux wrote:So I do not need to lead a target, if my reticule is over the target, boom auto hit? In relation to this, while technically accurate it is rarely practically accurate. I find that there is often a delay between pulling the trigger and firing causing most shots of this manner to miss. I generally lead my targets.
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Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
2452
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 06:19:00 -
[13] - Quote
In DUST, the combination of server-side hit detection and hitscan damage modeling on snipers means that, instead of leading for bullet travel time, you're leading for your latency.
If you've got consistently low ping all the time, meaning the game always puts you on your local servers AND you have top-quality internet connection (needs to be better than anything available where I live), then hitscan means you'll hit every time if you line up the shot exactly on the target.
If you have 100ms ping, you have to lead your shots by 0.1 of a second, if you have 500ms ping, and are somehow staying connected to the game, you need a half-second lead time on your target for the shot to connect. If a target is in line of sight for an enemy sniper, and not changing direction for more than half a second, either you did REALLY well or they screwed up.
As a non-sniper who lives with a sniper, I can honestly say that picking up the game and being able to say "I'm a sniper" doesn't necessarily take any skill. You can FEEL competent as a sniper without really providing benefit to your team. Playing as a Shotgunner, if you're doing badly, you will ALWAYS feel like you're failing. Often, a Shotgunner will feel like they're failing miserable and still not only come out positive, but their kills will have been on critical targets that turned the tide of several major encounters.
Of course, counter-balancing that easy sense of accomplishment is the fact that a truly useful sniper is rarely the one with the best K/D, because they put themselves into risky positions to counter-snipe, or to clear objectives, or to hit that Logi first so he doesn't get the Heavy back up when your teammates take him down, or softens up a few enemies for your team and only collects the Assists instead of kills.
Being a good sniper is more often about knowing WHEN and HOW to engage than just about lining up your shots correctly. |
Lord Sesshomarux
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 09:09:00 -
[14] - Quote
Ok Im understandign a bit more.
So this is a bit different, and the whining on the forums are to be taken with a grain of salt. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
2458
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 09:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
Lord Sesshomarux wrote:the whining on the forums are to be taken with a grain of salt. Have you ever been anywhere on the internet where this isn't the case?
Like, EVER? |
Lord Sesshomarux
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 09:25:00 -
[16] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Lord Sesshomarux wrote:the whining on the forums are to be taken with a grain of salt. Have you ever been anywhere on the internet where this isn't the case? Like, EVER?
good point. |
blue gt
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
24
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 10:46:00 -
[17] - Quote
Charizard Zakalwe wrote:This is some sort of awfully written troll post, right? No matter how skilled you are, you'll never be a useful sniper. Stop thinking you will be. Just man up, shoot mans with useful guns, and stop hiding in the redline.
this is not true. That said there is NO REASON for 2 let alone 5+ snipers on a team and if you are in the red line you are helping NO ONE you are not skilled you are a complete waste(with very rare exceptions).
heres a good metric I can regularly go 20and3 sniping on the ground supporting my team, not skilled into snipping(sniper operations 2). if you can't at least double that semi regularly(30kills regularly) with out being a kill stealing son of a *****(meaning you position your self so you can stop hacks on more then one point and are thinning out pushes between points almost in half), you are an skillless waste of space, your team would be better served if you ran around the points shooting in the air.
unfortunately I have only seen a few snipers of this caliber, and playing with them is a joy, they can single handedly break a strong teams will. |
blue gt
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
24
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 10:50:00 -
[18] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:In DUST, the combination of server-side hit detection and hitscan damage modeling on snipers means that, instead of leading for bullet travel time, you're leading for your latency.
If you've got consistently low ping all the time, meaning the game always puts you on your local servers AND you have top-quality internet connection (needs to be better than anything available where I live), then hitscan means you'll hit every time if you line up the shot exactly on the target.
If you have 100ms ping, you have to lead your shots by 0.1 of a second, if you have 500ms ping, and are somehow staying connected to the game, you need a half-second lead time on your target for the shot to connect. If a target is in line of sight for an enemy sniper, and not changing direction for more than half a second, either you did REALLY well or they screwed up.
As a non-sniper who lives with a sniper, I can honestly say that picking up the game and being able to say "I'm a sniper" doesn't necessarily take any skill. You can FEEL competent as a sniper without really providing benefit to your team. Playing as a Shotgunner, if you're doing badly, you will ALWAYS feel like you're failing. Often, a Shotgunner will feel like they're failing miserable and still not only come out positive, but their kills will have been on critical targets that turned the tide of several major encounters.
Of course, counter-balancing that easy sense of accomplishment is the fact that a truly useful sniper is rarely the one with the best K/D, because they put themselves into risky positions to counter-snipe, or to clear objectives, or to hit that Logi first so he doesn't get the Heavy back up when your teammates take him down, or softens up a few enemies for your team and only collects the Assists instead of kills.
Being a good sniper is more often about knowing WHEN and HOW to engage than just about lining up your shots correctly.
this +100google plex, although a good twitch shot is also of great use. |
blue gt
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
24
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 10:54:00 -
[19] - Quote
Rei Shepard wrote:Unless you are using the sniper at shotgun ranges in Dust, it takes about 0 skill to sit somewhere high on a mountain and take shots at people unaware you are there.
Also not true my sniping is very effective at SG ranges, its the AR ranges that are tricky.
and you should know this is not bravado any good hills sniper(which I am not ive just used a logi to snipe before) will tell you that shot gun snipping has saved them from snipper hunters more then once. |
Mobias Wyvern
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
11
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Posted - 2013.07.06 02:21:00 -
[20] - Quote
Be your own Judge. What game looks like more fun to you? Dust.........Or this.........
Planetside 2
Coming to PS4 this year
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DaleGribbles
Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation
21
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Posted - 2013.07.12 02:51:00 -
[21] - Quote
Be your own Judge. What game looks like more fun to you? Dust.........Or these other F2P games coming this year.........
Planetside 2 (19 GOTY Awards)
Coming to PS4 this year...
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