DUST Search - DUST University Press Release: Hedaleolfarber III Claimed as Academic Planet

Fist Groinpunch wrote:

I try not to post on these forums, but this topic is so appalling I just can't resist.

There's a lot to say about these two corps calling dibs on something that doesn't even exist, about the neutrality claim, about the veiled and open threats from the two schools over something that they already believe belongs to them. But I'm not going to talk about that. I want to talk about their claim to transparency and their choice of planet.

They say Hedaleolfarber III was chosen because it has low strategic//economic value. This is outright ridiculous.

Strategic value - It's location in a little cul-de-sac, away from the main action, makes it the perfect spot to post up away from the main fighting, and stockpile ISK/clones, while being in relative safety from outside attack. Then once enough ISK/clones are stockpiled, its the perfect planet to expand from, simply because your main ISK/clone-making base is protected. If the expansion goes well, great. If it goes badly, you can just retreat back to Hedaleolfarber III and start the stockpiling process all over again. So this planet has probably one of the HIGHEST strategic values for that reason. If you think about it, Hedaleolfarber III is like Australia in the classic version of the Risk board-game.

Economic value - It doesn't matter whether Hedaleolfarber III has a few moons or a million of them. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the number of moons has absolutely zero impact on what happens in DUST. And the ownership of districts does not have any impact on how EVE pilots interact with these moons. Those two systems are just not connected in the Uprising build. What is important about Hedaleolfarber III is that because of its isolation, it's less likely to be attacked. Meaning, it's much easier to stockpile ISK/clones there in relative safety. So whoever holds Hedaleolfarber III during Uprising will likely be making money hand over fist. That's at least 3 months! Therefore the economic value of Hedaleolfarber III is actually VERY HIGH.

So now that we have established that Hedaleolfarber III is actually a prime piece of real estate, lets talk about the transparency that these schools are claiming. When they say "We want Hedaleolfarber III because its the worst planet, we're just being transparent," thats not being transparent. That's called trying to deceive/manipulate people to get what you want. The only other possibility is that whoever is making decisions on this honestly believes what they are saying, but is just too stupid to understand that Hedaleolfarber III is actually an amazing base for ANY corporation.

So my question to the two schools is, which one is it? Are you straight up trying to fool everyone? Or do you just not understand the big picture?


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Fox Gaden DUST University Ivy League 262	Posted - 2013.04.23 15:59:00 - [1] - Quote Hedaleolfarber III was chosen because it is of low economic value due to having few moons, and for its isolation. Its strategic value is low, as it is at least 2 jumps from any other planet and even farther from the main population areas. A corp such as Imperfects (as an example) would have players of sufficient skill and numbers to take Districts from D-Uni and deny us a foothold on Hedaleolfarber III for some time. The question would then come down to how much time and resources will they want to commit to this backwater planet? Assuming that Imperfects have plans to build an empire, they would be splitting their forces substantially by griefing D-Uni. The clone loss in trying to transfer clones to or from Hedaleolfarber III would be substantial, making it a war for Imperfects on at least two fronts without the ability to effectively reinforce one front from the other. Meanwhile, in the main population centre the high rated Corperations that concentrated their power would have all their districts available to press Imperfects and take their districts through clone attrition. It will be interesting to see what corps choose to consolidate their power for tactical advantage and which corps chose to dilute their power in an attempt to grief others. Due to the isolation of Hedaleolfarber III the only way to attack a district there from off planet without being at a serious clone disadvantage will be to purchase clones at 80 million per attack. Taking all of D-UniGÇÖs districts will simply make D-UniGÇÖs PC training more expensive. Districts that are constantly under attack will not prove to be vary profitable, even if the defender wins every match. For a small fee of 0.5 million ISK would you be interested in trying your hand at knocking down Imperfect clones? D-Uni could offer this public service to the larger community. We buy the clones and supply the squad leaders, and anyone with an inclination and a little ISK gets to grief the Imperfects. There are only 12 districts on the planet. I am sure we could provide 36 squad leaders per day, particularly if the battles are not all at the same time. This is going to be fun! It is probably worth keeping in mind that the DUST University leadership are not new to New Eden or its ways. We announced our intentions in the interest of transparency and neutrality. By announcing this ahead of time we can safely assume that anyone taking a District on Hedaleolfarber III has agreed to enter into a combat relationship with DUST University. This frees us from the restraints that neutrality would normally impose on us, and gives us many options.
Fox Gaden DUST University Ivy League 271	Posted - 2013.04.23 19:31:00 - [2] - Quote Vaerana Myshtana wrote: Indy Strizer wrote: Anyways, I am with Sota Pop on this one, I would rather pick attacking Dust University over Bojo's School Of The Trades personally. Personally, I had hoped to see Dust Uni work a little more diplomatically on this, because in the absence of another school, I thought it made a lot of sense to try and get some other "adjunct professor" corps on the planet. Maybe that ship has sailed, but I think it would be helpful to have some of the kaiju corps (who support our shared mission) on planet as another source of skilled fighters. I mean, sure, we can fight the DU guys in our ways, but it would be nice to have some variety. To my mind, the thing that is essential is that we achieve a coalition that polices the campus vs. battle district thing, makes sure that the battle districts are constantly changing hands... and holds the colleges accountable for performing their mission. To clear up any misunderstanding, Dust University is only intent on holding 3 districts on the planet on a permanent basis. We made the announcement so that we would be free to attack any district on the planet without casing a public uproar. Any district battle on the planet that does not involve our 3 main districts will be considered training matches and would be open to our students. There are plenty of opportunities for large corps who want to train their new members, or small corps who want to see how PC works to spend some quality time with us. A small Corp might even be able to hold a District or two long enough to get their 80 million back. How many districts we attack in the course of a day will depend on how many battles we need to train our members. Considering the difference in membership numbers between BojoGÇÖs School of the Trades and DUST University we will need at least one (if not two or three) other Corporations on the planet to provide good fights, not to mention veriaty.
Fox Gaden DUST University Ivy League 272	Posted - 2013.04.23 19:40:00 - [3] - Quote 0 Try Harder wrote: Fox Gaden wrote: For a small fee of 0.5 million ISK would you be interested in trying your hand at knocking down Imperfect* clones? D-Uni could offer this public service to the larger community. We buy the clones and supply the squad leaders, and anyone with an inclination and a little ISK gets to grief the Imperfects*. You're implying that a team of scrubs can kill a well organized team? You're definitely not going to be hiring any good players for that crap amount of ISK. I'm just saying because although you might be able to corner, zerg, or kill some blue dots as you play against four man squad does not mean that you can do it against a well organized team. There have been a number of corp battles where one side loses at most one or two clones while red lining the opposing eight man team. Even a thale or proto forge cannot do anything against a wall of HAVs with logi support vehicles backing them up. Depending on prices and everything, I'd say you're not going to get a decent corp to fight the Imperfects for under 400 million ISK for a victory, and 200 million ISK for a loss. That is at current market prices for a 16v16 battle only. I believe most people do not truly understand the amount of ISK that can be lost in one match. Once you factor in additional things, like clones on top of it, you're looking at extremely expensive battles. You misunderstand me. I meant that people could pay us for the privilege of fighting the Imperfects, or whatever Corp decided to Grief us. They would basically be paying for their share of the clones. It would be a way for players to prove themselves, particularly those from small Corps that canGÇÖt do PC as a Corp. The idea is that if all of their districts are attacked every day, they will not know which battles are against randoms, and which battles are against our best players and top quality guests.
Fox Gaden DUST University Ivy League 274	Posted - 2013.04.24 11:54:00 - [4] - Quote BootStrapWill wrote: Not to throw out some crazy logic or anything but,.... why doesn't Imp just plant their D team on Bojo III as the "aggressor" third party campus that can be used as the combat force for both schools? This way the noobs get training, get to say they were face stomped by Imps, and all parties enjoy the ISK benefits of a school setting. Also, this would be a nearly constant boredom alleviation for the Imps. And they have clearly stated they suffer from extreme boredom induced insanity. Imps could even play it off as they "extorted" a presence on the planet, and are "pressuring" the schools with a "hostile" presence. Everyone's happy, and the schools can use the added assistance of the conglomerate of Imp if any other corp attempts to rout the planet. Or am I assuming too much altruism in New Eden? This is in line with our intended setup. As long as they donGÇÖt attack our 3 Campos districts all other battles will be considered training matches. We will announce which 3 districts we are laying permanent claim to. It may just be as simple as D-Uni taking districts 1, 2 & 3 and Bojo taking districts 10, 11, & 12, with everything in between a free for all. It has not been decided yet.
Fox Gaden DUST University Ivy League 274	Posted - 2013.04.24 12:28:00 - [5] - Quote Cruor Abominare wrote: Solarisjock wrote: i wonder if EVE Uni will setup a lowsec camp over this place, could be an interesting twist for everyone talking about it Eve uni set up a low sec camp in molden heath last year. At the time, molden heath actually had a functional ecosystem for small gang warfare. Uni popped up and tried to blob all the small gang pirates and destroy the good fights. A corp called the Hatchery, which is from the teamliquid.net community took great offense to them shitting over good pvp and came back to their ancestral home of molden heath to help save the locals. It led to quite a bit of hijinks which inevitably saw fleets of 30-40 eve uni pilots being camped into being permadocked by massive fleets of 2-4 guys. The killboard went so bad for eve uni that they weren't allowed to undock without permission from an fc and even then the fights were so one sided that they quickly picked up and left in complete embarrassment. The moral of the story is that eve uni doesn't make competent pilots in any sense. Its hard to expect anything more from Dust Uni. I am not certain whether EVE University will be involved in OB or PVP support around Dojo III. If they do become involved some additional training in Low Sec survival would definitely be required. I have never been affiliated with EVE University in EVE, although I have great respect for their mission, which is why I joined DUST University. My background is in Low Sec and NPC Null Sec, with a brief stint in Sov space with Unclaimed when they first started up. I have dabbled a little in PVP and according to eve-kill.net I have 138 kills and 19 losses with a Pilot Efficiency of 94.02%. Not overly impressive by NPC Null standards, but enough to get a vague idea of what I was doing. http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_ext_id=455827354 I was thinking about cancelling my account before PC was announced, but now I am thinking that this might get me motivated to play EVE again. With all the inexperienced EVE pilots flying around Molden Heath attempting to do Orbital Bombardment it is likely to attract pirates like flies to a carcass. The shame is that if I join Ivy League to help DUST University with Orbital Bombardment I will have to behave myself.
Fox Gaden DUST University Ivy League 274	Posted - 2013.04.24 12:48:00 - [6] - Quote Fist Groinpunch wrote: I try not to post on these forums, but this topic is so appalling I just can't resist. There's a lot to say about these two corps calling dibs on something that doesn't even exist, about the neutrality claim, about the veiled and open threats from the two schools over something that they already believe belongs to them. But I'm not going to talk about that. I want to talk about their claim to transparency and their choice of planet. They say Hedaleolfarber III was chosen because it has low strategic//economic value. This is outright ridiculous. Strategic value - It's location in a little cul-de-sac, away from the main action, makes it the perfect spot to post up away from the main fighting, and stockpile ISK/clones, while being in relative safety from outside attack. Then once enough ISK/clones are stockpiled, its the perfect planet to expand from, simply because your main ISK/clone-making base is protected. If the expansion goes well, great. If it goes badly, you can just retreat back to Hedaleolfarber III and start the stockpiling process all over again. So this planet has probably one of the HIGHEST strategic values for that reason. If you think about it, Hedaleolfarber III is like Australia in the classic version of the Risk board-game. Economic value - It doesn't matter whether Hedaleolfarber III has a few moons or a million of them. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the number of moons has absolutely zero impact on what happens in DUST. And the ownership of districts does not have any impact on how EVE pilots interact with these moons. Those two systems are just not connected in the Uprising build. What is important about Hedaleolfarber III is that because of its isolation, it's less likely to be attacked. Meaning, it's much easier to stockpile ISK/clones there in relative safety. So whoever holds Hedaleolfarber III during Uprising will likely be making money hand over fist. That's at least 3 months! Therefore the economic value of Hedaleolfarber III is actually VERY HIGH. So now that we have established that Hedaleolfarber III is actually a prime piece of real estate, lets talk about the transparency that these schools are claiming. When they say "We want Hedaleolfarber III because its the worst planet, we're just being transparent," thats not being transparent. That's called trying to deceive/manipulate people to get what you want. The only other possibility is that whoever is making decisions on this honestly believes what they are saying, but is just too stupid to understand that Hedaleolfarber III is actually an amazing base for ANY corporation. So my question to the two schools is, which one is it? Are you straight up trying to fool everyone? Or do you just not understand the big picture? One of the district installation types gives a bonus to EVE players of the same Alliance in their moon harvesting production. I assumed that this was common knowladge. A planet two jumps from anywhere else might be a good place to make money from clones (if you are not using those clones to fight with) but it is not a good place to make your clones at for attacking other systems. You would be suffering substantial clone losses every time you transfer clones off planet. It is not a very smart approach. Not only do you need clones to be able to fight, you need to get those clones to the battlefield.
Fox Gaden DUST University Ivy League 275	Posted - 2013.04.24 15:51:00 - [7] - Quote Even with a Surface Lab you will loose 25% of your clones when you transfer them to Sakulda, Altbrard, or Oddelulf. You will loose 35% of your clones if you transfer them to Bosena. You will loose 55% of your clones if you transfer them to Aedald, or Meildolf. I suppose you could argue that 25% clone lose would be a reasonable sacrifice for expansion into the Oddelulf/Bosena area, but I would disagree with you and then counter that that Altbrard would be a better choice as it is a dead end pocket only 2 jumps from Oddelulf, which would only be a 15% clone loss (using a Surface Lab) when you are ready to expand. If you truly like isolation, both Hrober (15 districts on 2 planets) and Sakulda (29 Districts on 3 planets) are 3 jumps from any other PC system (25% clone lose using a Surface Lab).