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Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
193
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Posted - 2013.04.10 01:57:00 -
[1] - Quote
copy left wrote:Honestly dropships should be a 4th of their price , and on top of that, there should be a weak bpo dropship so that we can get some pilots in this game.
no bpo's ever.
makes 2 million isk ds cannon fodder for one hit ko suicide air collisions.
no.
no.
no.
no.
no. |
Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
194
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 02:50:00 -
[2] - Quote
Anmol Singh wrote:Nguruthos IX wrote:copy left wrote:Honestly dropships should be a 4th of their price , and on top of that, there should be a weak bpo dropship so that we can get some pilots in this game. no bpo's ever. makes 2 million isk ds cannon fodder for one hit ko suicide air collisions. no. no. no. no. no. what is bpo?
blue print original: Free, unlimited kamikaze spam. would ruin game. |
Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
194
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Posted - 2013.04.10 02:54:00 -
[3] - Quote
copy left wrote:Nguruthos IX wrote:copy left wrote:Honestly dropships should be a 4th of their price , and on top of that, there should be a weak bpo dropship so that we can get some pilots in this game. no bpo's ever. makes 2 million isk ds cannon fodder for one hit ko suicide air collisions. no. no. no. no. no. I can take a free lav and ram a tank and blow it up, i can even divebomb a viper dropship into a friendly tank and blow it up. what is your point?
Allow me to educate you. When you crash a Lav into a tank, it does a very minimal and finite amount of damage. A good tank could shrug off an entire team of constant lav battery. BUT
A drop-ship colliding with a drop-ship is an instant 1 hit KO through all shields and armor for both parties. And not only does it bring the armor to zero but triggers the "death spiral" from which if you use a repair unit, no repair will happen. And full control is lost of the vehicle till it plummets to the earth for explosive impact.
Do you now see the difference? The problem?
Additionally a viper crashing into a tank does as much damage to the tank as a Lav. Except it cost 150k ISK and the viper will die instantly upon impact. |
Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
194
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 04:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:copy left wrote:you are wrong, I do suicide dropship bombings all the time, hell I could face you right now and your tank has no chance.
I've had significantly more credible sources tell me otherwise, video or I just don't believe you.
Copy left is talking out of his ***, Don't take my word for it. Just go spend the 300k and see for yourself.
Viper+Dropship(any type) collision = both will die.
Viper+ tank(any) collision = tank will hardly notice the cash you just threw at it. Unless it was like a militia shield tank with 200 armor and it's shield had already been ripped off or something.
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Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
195
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Posted - 2013.04.10 04:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Flux Raeder wrote:Okay, a couple points and a long story. Dropships are not overpriced. Simple as that. When used properly a dropship can provide a constant flow of friendlies into the weakest parts of enemy territory. I have been in a dozen games where this alone has turned the tides of an entire battle. If you don't see how that is possible I can detail exactly how hard it is for an enemy to hold ground in their own territory when they are having heavy machine-gunners dropping in around them from every direction and snipers suddenly sprouting from their own roofs. Yes, dropships are NOT the easiest things to fly, but with minimal practice you ought to be able to figure it out. To expand on both this and the distraction factor: occasionally for fun I will call in a simple militia dropship. I used to pilot a lot in the first builds so I enjoy taking these things to their limits, I have crashed a couple by doing stupid (but crazy cool!!) stunts but I have also caused such a huge distraction in some matches just with my presence that my team has won the game. A prime example of this is a game a couple months ago on manus peak. The enemy sniper coverage was insane. They had heavys rolling my team on the ground, I was running solo for once and as usual the blue-dots weren't doing ****. I decided I would have some fun rather than waste my isk and efforts on them so I called in a dropship. I began doing aerial manouvres for fun, getting as close to the ground as fast as possible and flying up the gentral road from a-c-b at top speed about two feet above the ground. This TERRIFIED the other team, every single player was suddenly armed with swarms and forges but nobody could hit me because I was putting everything I had into flying. I was squishing snipers on hills with the tip of my dropship, dodging an OB, tauntinglr flying by a foot in front of an armed railgun at top speed and generally just having an extremely enjoyable time. While I was doing this my bluedots finally took some initiative and hacked EVERYTHING. Suddenly the game that we were losing by about 75% swings around for a solid victory. This is with an un-edited militia dropship, solo on a bored night people, imagine if I'd had gunners and an uplink! Or had even practiced flying the new mechanics more than once before this? Overpriced? I don't think so. I have never laughed so hard while playing a videogame, maybe try Priceless. As for bpo, this was done in the earlier builds and was removed for MANY reasons, we've moved past this. And finally, OP: TaLkInG lIkE ThIs PiSsEs EvErYoNe OfF. It's not clever and if you want any kind of future in New Eden I'd suggest you cut it now.
Sorry but nobody is or ever has been terrified of a dropship. The fact that they all switched to AV is because they just wanted a free kill and to knock you out of 150k.
Furthermore if a single one of those players had a militia forge gun, and two opposable thumbs they could have knocked you right out of the air within the span of 4 seconds or less.
The only way for a cheap drop-ship to survive a map where one player has a militia FG is to hide behind a hill or building the entire game. FG are incredibly easy to aim too. Any player half trying could nail you at max range, first shot, no problem.
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Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
195
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 04:59:00 -
[6] - Quote
Flux Raeder wrote:Nguruthos IX wrote:Flux Raeder wrote:Okay, a couple points and a long story. Dropships are not overpriced. Simple as that. When used properly a dropship can provide a constant flow of friendlies into the weakest parts of enemy territory. I have been in a dozen games where this alone has turned the tides of an entire battle. If you don't see how that is possible I can detail exactly how hard it is for an enemy to hold ground in their own territory when they are having heavy machine-gunners dropping in around them from every direction and snipers suddenly sprouting from their own roofs. Yes, dropships are NOT the easiest things to fly, but with minimal practice you ought to be able to figure it out. To expand on both this and the distraction factor: occasionally for fun I will call in a simple militia dropship. I used to pilot a lot in the first builds so I enjoy taking these things to their limits, I have crashed a couple by doing stupid (but crazy cool!!) stunts but I have also caused such a huge distraction in some matches just with my presence that my team has won the game. A prime example of this is a game a couple months ago on manus peak. The enemy sniper coverage was insane. They had heavys rolling my team on the ground, I was running solo for once and as usual the blue-dots weren't doing ****. I decided I would have some fun rather than waste my isk and efforts on them so I called in a dropship. I began doing aerial manouvres for fun, getting as close to the ground as fast as possible and flying up the gentral road from a-c-b at top speed about two feet above the ground. This TERRIFIED the other team, every single player was suddenly armed with swarms and forges but nobody could hit me because I was putting everything I had into flying. I was squishing snipers on hills with the tip of my dropship, dodging an OB, tauntinglr flying by a foot in front of an armed railgun at top speed and generally just having an extremely enjoyable time. While I was doing this my bluedots finally took some initiative and hacked EVERYTHING. Suddenly the game that we were losing by about 75% swings around for a solid victory. This is with an un-edited militia dropship, solo on a bored night people, imagine if I'd had gunners and an uplink! Or had even practiced flying the new mechanics more than once before this? Overpriced? I don't think so. I have never laughed so hard while playing a videogame, maybe try Priceless. As for bpo, this was done in the earlier builds and was removed for MANY reasons, we've moved past this. And finally, OP: TaLkInG lIkE ThIs PiSsEs EvErYoNe OfF. It's not clever and if you want any kind of future in New Eden I'd suggest you cut it now. Sorry but nobody is or ever has been terrified of a dropship. The fact that they all switched to AV is because they just wanted a free kill and to knock you out of 150k. Furthermore if a single one of those players had a militia forge gun, and two opposable thumbs they could have knocked you right out of the air within the span of 4 seconds or less. The only way for a cheap drop-ship to survive a map where one player has a militia FG is to hide behind a hill or building the entire game. FG are incredibly easy to aim too. Any player half trying could nail you at max range, first shot, no problem. Then why didn't they? Like I said, just about every player on the map was firing at me, WITH forge guns and swarms, I'm pretty sure I recognized them by the massive rounds of blue plasma zipping by me. And as far as "hiding behind a building"? As I just said I was flying DIRECTLY THROUGH the burnzones. At ground level. I don't think it's possible to get any further from hiding. If I recall I went behind the tower a single time to recharge my shield from a couple lucky swarms. And as far as a terror factor? You try running a heavy or assault, shooting at the reddots to turn around to see an honest to dust dropship bearing down on you at full speed. Or maybe sniping from a mountaintop to suddenly hear the rapidly approaching engine of my ship just to be squished before you can even comprehend what is going on.From some of the messages I have recieved from the victims after these kinds of games I have gathered it can be RATHER disconcerting to say the very least.
You were playing against an inordinately stupid team of monkeys is why. That's like asking how it's possible that I managed to walk around the map killing 15 people by punching them to death. It's not because dropsuits with no ammo are overpowered or invisible
The team was oblivious, horrible, and stupid. You just said it yourself, if you were at ground level and people couldn't kill you then there's something else going on. 1-2 AV nades would have done you in just the same. Dropships can no longer out run swarms and a militia one as you say could never have the EHP to survive the inevitable hits of several players swarms. Unless they were too lazy to move around a pole and kept aiming directly into walls rather than a practical position.
There is no way even a player of average skill would miss you with a forge gun for a whole match, nor that a team of swarms would fail to knock you out of a low level dropship. Therefore we conclude that this was a team of incredibly less than average skill. Seriously teetering on the edge of basic mental functioning. I wonder if they could also feed themselves.
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Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
195
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Posted - 2013.04.10 05:33:00 -
[7] - Quote
Flux Raeder wrote:If this were an isolated incident then I might tend to agree especially considering most bluedots performance. However, as I mentioned earlier, I have done this multiple times. And there are still the other pilots I have watched that were about a hundred times better. A dropship doesn't need to OUTRUN a swarm shot, if the pilot knows the map well enough he/she has plenty of time to dodge around a tower or drop to ground level and have them explode harmlessly off hills. Dodging a forge gun is like dodging sniper fire, if you run in a predictable line or pattern for too long then yeah, you'll get shot down. Clearly you think very strongly that this is impossible while I have seen it not to be and I don't see any point in continuing this topic. The only point here is that I believe, for what it is CAPABLE of in the right hands, the dropship is not overpriced. Though now that I think of it, if you (not you specifically, just those that think it's op) can't fly it and think it is so weak then why on earth do you care about it's price? If anything you should be happy if you really believe they are all so easy to shoot down, more money for you. Really, with that logic this whole thread is rather pointless is it not?
With any amount of willpower and several or more braincells on the opposing team that simply will not happen. If and when it does, is only a testament to apathy or failhards. |
Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
195
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 06:07:00 -
[8] - Quote
Flux Raeder wrote:Nguruthos IX wrote:Flux Raeder wrote:If this were an isolated incident then I might tend to agree especially considering most bluedots performance. However, as I mentioned earlier, I have done this multiple times. And there are still the other pilots I have watched that were about a hundred times better. A dropship doesn't need to OUTRUN a swarm shot, if the pilot knows the map well enough he/she has plenty of time to dodge around a tower or drop to ground level and have them explode harmlessly off hills. Dodging a forge gun is like dodging sniper fire, if you run in a predictable line or pattern for too long then yeah, you'll get shot down. Clearly you think very strongly that this is impossible while I have seen it not to be and I don't see any point in continuing this topic. The only point here is that I believe, for what it is CAPABLE of in the right hands, the dropship is not overpriced. Though now that I think of it, if you (not you specifically, just those that think it's op) can't fly it and think it is so weak then why on earth do you care about it's price? If anything you should be happy if you really believe they are all so easy to shoot down, more money for you. Really, with that logic this whole thread is rather pointless is it not? With any amount of willpower and several or more braincells on the opposing team that simply will not happen. If and when it does, is only a testament to apathy or failhards. Alright dude, that's your opinion, you clearly think a LOT of it and you're entitled to it, just don't act like it's some ultimate truth. I'm sure we could argue this all night but I'm done with this line of conversation
As do you with yours : / That's fine. I'm no crack shot but when I'm playing and a ds comes out it lasts on average as long as it takes till I have line of sight for >3 seconds. Usually I'm the first or only one to try killing it but it's easy cheesey and I know if I can do it, virtually anyone who wants to can. Fully skilled and fitted DS (costing between 7-900k) can take some hits from a militia fg and bug out but they're toast to anything better.
It is my strong opinion that it's nearly impossible to MISS with a fg given line of sight. And that it's easy to put yourself in a good vantage point if they person pilot is being more erratic. The ship is huge and the shot is near instant. Least it by nearly a reticule off from it's trajectory, and just let go of the trigger. It's harder to jump and miss the ground than fail a fg shot.
That being said I wish you the best of luck, and hope it keeps up as well as it has been. Lastly, for you and anyone who hasn't tried it I'd highly suggest making a militia FG fit and just swapping right to it anytime you see a DS called in. It's both fun and will demonstrate through experience just how far a little determination and a forge gun can go against any DS. |
Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
195
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 08:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
copy left wrote: See this guy that said "a pilot needs to know the map well enough" well what about when we have hundreds of maps to play on? You cant expect a pilot to know every spot to hide! AV vs Dropships is broken at the moment. The way to fix it is to implement those countermeasures
That's a very valid point because the devs did say they intend there to be so many maps you'll virtually never play the same one twice lol.
Good luck memorizing the terrain safe-spots for thousands of planets... And if that's the premise by which DS are currently balanced then it's broken and will be more broken. However I think the problem goes far deeper than this alone. |
Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
195
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 09:06:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jack McReady wrote:the shield tanked ones are great because it can tank swarms well and there arent that many people that skilled into forge guns.
Um, you don't need to be skilled into forge guns at all to use the militias. They're dirt cheap, basically free. And they will tear up a shield ds with that 150% damage to shield (I heard it has). Either way once they get the shield down (probably one shot, maybe 2) then the next one spells a death sentence. Shield ships don't like burning |
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Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
198
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Posted - 2013.04.10 11:02:00 -
[11] - Quote
REMNANCY 1 wrote:Isn't the DS supposed to get an additional pilot controlled turret next build and hopefully un-nerfed as well?
There will be a variant with a pilot controlled turret. No telling what if any trade offs there will be. And there's been no mention of balance tweaks to vehicles in the next build. Cloaking was mentioned as possible in the next build but DS cloaking (as per the 3 year old dev blog) has not been addressed. They seemed to only directly mention scout drop suits and by omission probably not ships. |
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