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semperfi1999
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Posted - 2013.04.05 19:47:00 -
[1] - Quote
Wow you shouldnt go quoting a post in the feedback section and put it in the general section. Obviously noone went to the original post and read it.
FLux is unquestionably OP. If you dont think so then you most likely use it as a crutch. The Flux was designed to work against vehicles and does dmg to shields for such high values because of that. However it is also effective against all infantry because there is no infantry that could get more than 1200 shields (the lowest flux nade dmg) that means you never had to lvl up and day 1 noobs can completely destroy proto a proto suit with a single flux nade. That is a pretty big issue.
The suggested fix was for flux dmg to be related to the signature profile of that suit. IE shields suits have larger sig profiles than armor suits and thus would take more dmg (up to a max amount). However the sig profile of infantry suits are alot smaller than HAVs. HAVs should be the standard that takes the full dmg from a flux nade. IE HAV take 1200 dmg from a flux nade but if the HAV has a signature profile of 150 and the infantry suit has a sig profile of 50 then that means the infantry suit would take 1/3rd less damage than the HAV would take. That is the idea and though it can be tweaked it was a thought on how to balance out the flux nade....instead of it being an insta pwn weapon that can be used against infantry.
Just imagine if I could throw a single grenade that did 80% dmg to a proto heavy if the heavy was anywhere in the blast radius....would that be considered "balanced"? No it wouldnt and this is exactly what you are arguing for and if you cant see that logic then there is no point in discussing it further because you are blinded by your own desire to continue to use this weapon. |
semperfi1999
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Posted - 2013.04.05 19:48:00 -
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Jakar Umbra wrote:Sev Alcatraz wrote:I want a thermite grenade that will bring down an opponents armour then Explosives are 130% effective against armour if I'm not mistaken (unless it changed recently and I didn't notice) A locus grenade would suffice.
He is talking about a nade that at lvl 1 will completely ignore shields but will drain all armor HP from any heavy including proto. |
semperfi1999
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Posted - 2013.04.05 19:53:00 -
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Jammeh McJam wrote:Nerfing AV nades would balance out the HAVs IF flux nades got nerfed, however it would make HAVs way too OP and i doubt anyone would like that (exept the tank drivers). Eventually tanks would get nerfed, meaning more and more things get nerfed to give the nerfed tanks a chance, until it takes a forge gun to take down a scout suit (in the extremes).
Personally I love AV nades and seeing them nerfed would really ruin my gameplay style because I use them with every fit and I like seeing expensive vehicles burn at my feet.
The only ppl talking about nerfing AV nades are people who never read the original post that is being quoted. |
semperfi1999
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Posted - 2013.04.05 20:10:00 -
[4] - Quote
Jakar Umbra wrote:semperfi1999 wrote:Wow you shouldnt go quoting a post in the feedback section and put it in the general section. Obviously noone went to the original post and read it.
FLux is unquestionably OP. If you dont think so then you most likely use it as a crutch. The Flux was designed to work against vehicles and does dmg to shields for such high values because of that. However it is also effective against all infantry because there is no infantry that could get more than 1200 shields (the lowest flux nade dmg) that means you never had to lvl up and day 1 noobs can completely destroy proto a proto suit with a single flux nade. That is a pretty big issue.
The suggested fix was for flux dmg to be related to the signature profile of that suit. IE shields suits have larger sig profiles than armor suits and thus would take more dmg (up to a max amount). However the sig profile of infantry suits are alot smaller than HAVs. HAVs should be the standard that takes the full dmg from a flux nade. IE HAV take 1200 dmg from a flux nade but if the HAV has a signature profile of 150 and the infantry suit has a sig profile of 50 then that means the infantry suit would take 1/3rd less damage than the HAV would take. That is the idea and though it can be tweaked it was a thought on how to balance out the flux nade....instead of it being an insta pwn weapon that can be used against infantry.
Just imagine if I could throw a single grenade that did 80% dmg to a proto heavy if the heavy was anywhere in the blast radius....would that be considered "balanced"? No it wouldnt and this is exactly what you are arguing for and if you cant see that logic then there is no point in discussing it further because you are blinded by your own desire to continue to use this weapon. Have to say, this is an interesting solution and well thought out. While I know you used the numbers as an example and like you said they could of course be tweaked, I'm going to reuse your numbers for my question. Let's say the HAV is the 150 sig profile and the medium frame suit is 50, therefore the 1/3 damage applies, that's still 400 from a basic flux grenade. Of course chances are if this method with the profile was used the medium frame suit would probably be what, 1/5 or even lower than that of the HAV's profile? Thing is in the end it can't kill you (bug not withstanding) so finding how exactly to apply that to the suits would be a little difficult. My next thing is, looking at it from a different standpoint, is if a flux grenade has enough capabilities to overpower the electronic systems in a HAV in order to do that much damage to shields through whatever redundant systems it has wouldn't it essentially just cause a dropsuit to seize up? Of course I'm not saying this is what it should do, I'm just saying its an interesting perspective.
If we are thinking realisticaly then yes it should cause a dropsuit to sieze up. But without having at least a correspondingly strong nade to use against armor infantry (locus is nothing compared to flux) there is a serious imbalance. I think it would be imbalanced even if there was a corresponding nade as the amount of dmg we are talking about it wayy to high for the suits. Couple this with all the other issues gunner noted and the fact remains....there is something wrong with the flux nades. Whether we go this route for balancing or another something needs to be done. To be able to strip 100% of the shields at lvl 1 (meta 1) from a suit lvl 3 (meta 4-5) is somethign that should not exist. It might be easier to make it even a set amount of shields total that it can drain. IE if there are 6 ppl in the blast radius then the dmg to shields is spread equally among them making it only do 200 dmg per peron. This would make it still useful against a lone HAV but make it not quite so OP when throwing it into groups of infantry.
I dont know I think there are many possible solutions. The issue is that is needs to be fixed....how that is done is up for debate. |
semperfi1999
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Posted - 2013.04.05 21:23:00 -
[5] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:semperfi1999 wrote:Wow you shouldnt go quoting a post in the feedback section and put it in the general section. Obviously noone went to the original post and read it.
FLux is unquestionably OP. If you dont think so then you most likely use it as a crutch. The Flux was designed to work against vehicles and does dmg to shields for such high values because of that. However it is also effective against all infantry because there is no infantry that could get more than 1200 shields (the lowest flux nade dmg) that means you never had to lvl up and day 1 noobs can completely destroy proto a proto suit with a single flux nade. That is a pretty big issue.
The suggested fix was for flux dmg to be related to the signature profile of that suit. IE shields suits have larger sig profiles than armor suits and thus would take more dmg (up to a max amount). However the sig profile of infantry suits are alot smaller than HAVs. HAVs should be the standard that takes the full dmg from a flux nade. IE HAV take 1200 dmg from a flux nade but if the HAV has a signature profile of 150 and the infantry suit has a sig profile of 50 then that means the infantry suit would take 1/3rd of the damage that the HAV would take. That is the idea and though it can be tweaked it was a thought on how to balance out the flux nade....instead of it being an insta pwn weapon that can be used against infantry.
Just imagine if I could throw a single grenade that did 80% dmg to a proto heavy if the heavy was anywhere in the blast radius....would that be considered "balanced"? No it wouldnt and this is exactly what you are arguing for and if you cant see that logic then there is no point in discussing it further because you are blinded by your own desire to continue to use this weapon. The Flux nade does what it does. Destroy shields. Its called the Metagame, get used to it, EVE has lots of it and so will Dust. As it is right now, shields are the way to go. They recharge faster and don't slow you down like plates do. That's why the Flux is fine, it counters a more effective shielding system. And about locus nades, unlike Flux nades, they damage both shields and armor. So I'm giving up the ability to take down someones armor in exchange for a more effective anti shield grenade.
Then they need a nade that when thrown does 1200 dmg to armor only that i can use against heavies. Hey its meta game man.
I love your argument. Literally its so illogical you can use it to defend anything and just call it metagame. I think ccp should give ppl the ability to call in a gundam to completely whipe the map of all enemies.....its not OP its called meta game you noob.
Why dont you come back with well reasoned arguments on why a weapon should exist that can completely kill 80% of a players HP if they are even slightly in the AOE when there is no corresponding nade that is as effective against the other hp option.
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semperfi1999
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Posted - 2013.04.06 16:30:00 -
[6] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:semperfi1999 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:semperfi1999 wrote:Wow you shouldnt go quoting a post in the feedback section and put it in the general section. Obviously noone went to the original post and read it.
FLux is unquestionably OP. If you dont think so then you most likely use it as a crutch. The Flux was designed to work against vehicles and does dmg to shields for such high values because of that. However it is also effective against all infantry because there is no infantry that could get more than 1200 shields (the lowest flux nade dmg) that means you never had to lvl up and day 1 noobs can completely destroy proto a proto suit with a single flux nade. That is a pretty big issue.
The suggested fix was for flux dmg to be related to the signature profile of that suit. IE shields suits have larger sig profiles than armor suits and thus would take more dmg (up to a max amount). However the sig profile of infantry suits are alot smaller than HAVs. HAVs should be the standard that takes the full dmg from a flux nade. IE HAV take 1200 dmg from a flux nade but if the HAV has a signature profile of 150 and the infantry suit has a sig profile of 50 then that means the infantry suit would take 1/3rd of the damage that the HAV would take. That is the idea and though it can be tweaked it was a thought on how to balance out the flux nade....instead of it being an insta pwn weapon that can be used against infantry.
Just imagine if I could throw a single grenade that did 80% dmg to a proto heavy if the heavy was anywhere in the blast radius....would that be considered "balanced"? No it wouldnt and this is exactly what you are arguing for and if you cant see that logic then there is no point in discussing it further because you are blinded by your own desire to continue to use this weapon. The Flux nade does what it does. Destroy shields. Its called the Metagame, get used to it, EVE has lots of it and so will Dust. As it is right now, shields are the way to go. They recharge faster and don't slow you down like plates do. That's why the Flux is fine, it counters a more effective shielding system. And about locus nades, unlike Flux nades, they damage both shields and armor. So I'm giving up the ability to take down someones armor in exchange for a more effective anti shield grenade. Then they need a nade that when thrown does 1200 dmg to armor only that i can use against heavies. Hey its meta game man. I love your argument. Literally its so illogical you can use it to defend anything and just call it metagame. I think ccp should give ppl the ability to call in a gundam to completely whipe the map of all enemies.....its not OP its called meta game you noob. Why dont you come back with well reasoned arguments on why a weapon should exist that can completely kill 80% of a players HP if they are even slightly in the AOE when there is no corresponding nade that is as effective against the other hp option. 1200 to Armor will insta kill a player, considering that there is no third layer to the suit :) Which is another reason why shield is better, you get a buffer to run into cover.
I have survived wirh 0 armor. Taking armor down to zero and not affecting shields would not insta kill a char. |
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