I can understand that the scout suit needs some more cpu & pg to allow more fits but allowing a super fast suit, stealth movement coupled with a cloacking device and a say a breach shotgun is going to turn this game into aliens vs predator 2 and the ability to fit allot of stuff graciously is going to make for 4-6 man dedicated teams focused on solely invisible combat.

Up to the point you cannot react anymore when theres 6 people behind you, in eve the Stealth Bomber ships are recon class ships and can fire an alpha strike from a distance, then take a while to get back in cloak and are very easely destroyed when caught or fired upon when they are fighting without support.

Adding specialized additional slots like you say will only add onto the problem, and that is still beyond the issue of how 99% of the playerbase can't seem to hit a strafing scout at short range coupled with the pressure of being OHKilled added ontop to impair their aim further.

In short, If they design the suit to be a strafing, speed monster, with extra cpu & pg, additional slots for moar speed & shields, with exclusive rights to battle cloak we are going to have a problem when a scrub equips this suit, but a disaster if i would equip it.

Sensor dampened scouts, the good ones anyway always get into my back without the cloak and my situational awareness is flawless, imagine a scrub needing to find me while i am cloaked lol.

8. I play my assault 85% of the time because it fits my playstyle the most, i also dont play Dragon Rider failfits & Dual SMG failfits just for giggles and then come on here whining its infective.

You play Scout Logibro with Dual SMG's to make up for whatever it is your lacking or giggles, i dunno, i play to kill as many each round possible.

So far i have learned allot coming from COD and BF3, APB R and had to ditch allot of my bad habits, reading how you approach encounters sounds to me like you are still stuck to bad gameplay, fixing the suit still wont make it any better.

Now I want you to make this fitting and field test it and the tell me how well you do in it.

And for the record, I also know for a fact that Rei knows how to handle a Scout. A good Scout player with the right fitting can be nearly invisible. Particularly against Assaults and Heavies with their higher Scan Precision.

I've managed to get hatemail where people were claiming I used an invisibility hack because they just heard a Shotgun blast, saw a teammate appear next to my name on the kill feed, then turned around and nobody was there. If you know what you're doing, know your enemies' field of view, and know where and how to move so they don't see you getting there, you can clear out several people before anyone knows where you are.

Yes, sometimes things go wrong. Sometimes a squad has a Sniper on overwatch that I didn't realise was watching (usually turns my next spawn into a sniper hunt), and sometimes a guy with an AR shows up at a distance looking the right way at the right time (wrong way at wrong time for me, obviously). Without any range upgrades, a well-skilled Scout can already see 30m in every direction.

Well, I'm glad I'm not that guy. Shotguns suit how I prefer to play, but they definitely aren't the only viable weapon on a Scout. Point to one post I've made - EVER - that states Shotguns are the only viable Scout weapon, or even rules out a particular weapon as being viable on the suit. Please? I'd love to see where I said that. I suck with ARs, but if I need to, I can run an AR Scout and do well. I run SMG Scouts on a couple of characters. So, please explain what exactly your point in quoting me here was?


I'm not saying your DESIRES are outlandish. I'm saying that your method to try and get there is. Increasing CPU alone would give Scouts more versatility. You can't increase it by too much, or the "OP" cries would be justified. A small PG/CPU increase would be nice, and would probably balance the suits without need for any other tweaks. Increasing strafe speed back to pre-nerf levels would break the game like it has in the past. A small - VERY small - buff to strafe speed would be nice, but it needs to be carefully done, and should be the ONLY change if it happens. Nothing else. Definitely not strafe AND fitting buffs.

You can already use the Scout as a scout. I've done it more than once. With and without a Shotgun. When we get Active Scanners, this will be even more viable and (hopefully) even provide some form of WP reward.

So whenever i see posts about people not using any tactic, standing stll etc but wanting their suit to compensate for their own lack of skill, i get riled up i suppose, its nothing personal but once you get passed the "its the suit, its the game, he had an advantage, he had a tank, he had a shotgun, he saw me, i ran out of bullets, he got lucky, he got lucky twice" and change it to "what am i doing wrong here and how can i fix this and be more efficient at what i do, your skill growth rate is always going to stay stagnant".

Wow. Someone finally looked up the stats on my FORUM ALT THAT I DON'T PLAY and tried using them against me.

Good job.

And good luck finding my in-game name even if you have the PSN ID. I'm not that easy to track down.

The primary job of recon is to spot for your squadmates. Locate the enemies so the assault elements can move in with a better picture of what they're heading into.

They know where the enemies are, which direction they're facing, and how best to ambush them. If you hit a couple of guys with a quick spray of gunfire then disappear, that will divert their attention from where your main attack is about to hit. That means 2 - 3 enemies facing the wrong way, which can be enough to turn the tide. Sometimes you'll be able to draw more than just a couple of eyes your way without significant risk. You only fired a handful of shots, and didn't stay visible for long enough to even take fire, let alone get killed like you would if you entered combat, but you draw enemy attention away from the threat, and give your teammates an edge they could never have without you. The high speed and low profile mean that as soon as you turn the corner, you're invisible. The scanning modules (backed by relevant skills) mean the same DOESN'T hold true for your enemies, who remain lit up as long as they're anywhere near you.

I take that approach at times as well, check my edit.

Also, it's funny that someone who keeps saying he wants a "recon" build thinks that EHP is a primary consideration for such a build. If you're looking at EHP over other stats, you're doing recon wrong.

I'm living in a wonderful, magical dreamworld where VIDEOGAMES AREN'T REAL LIFE AND DON'T FOLLOW THE SAME RULES. Maybe you should try it sometime?

If you're arriving at the point of an attack with more than a few seconds to spare, either your teammates are taking too long or you forgot to help them out in a couple of fights along the way. Real-world recon involves a lot of elements that are impractical, impossible or just not fun to simulate. Real-world recon requires set-up time and lots of waiting around and "not contributing" before anything happens.

And if you suck at recon in DUST, you die lots. If you're good at it, the enemy rarely even sees you.

All i read from you is that you want Recon AND be able to take care of the enemies on your own.

Basically you want to be a Cloaked Assault Recon....



There are more usefull mods then just stacking MAX HP, armor plates are used on a VK0 not a VK1 and having speed + ability to recharge my shields to maximum in 8-9s from 0 is worth more then just having more HP.

So say you stack 533 shields on a VK1, someone depletes those, then you sit there 4.8s before regen kicks in and gain 28 shields a second = 23 seconds thumb twiddling or at 15s mark jumping back out with 250 shields.

Or with my suit you have 401 shields back after just 8.6 seconds.

So that guy if he engages me again after he "depleted" my shields at the 9 second mark he has 100 shields back, while my suit has 401, ill eat the guy for dinner and any shields idd lose to the first guy will be back for the second and the third ...unless they flank me or engage all at once, but then again i got greater sprint speed then you have in my VK1.

It lets me chew trough those supposed teams you talk about, because each and every one of them stacks HP HP and more HP.

13ear even send me fan-mail, 12 of them after we raped his team, blew up his tank and killed him 4 times, ussually he quits a game after 2 deaths so it was a record by his standards. :)

My fits r fine and are specced for Lone Wolfing, yours are all "I wanna do everything all at once" witch in EVE does not work.

Since when is it the job of a recon to escort or guard personnel?

You want:
*Invisible
*Assault capabilities
*Recon
*Escort, Guard Duty
*Commando Lone wolfing

With your scout ?

thats the stuff you wanna do summed up in this thread, in your tights...suit..

Wrong suit choice, the Assault is better at all that, except Invisible & Recon but those are the parts you talk about only and never seem to actually be doing....


Would be cool, also expect it to have a Sidearm Slot only.

More important than survivability? No.
More important than EHP? Definitely.

Unlike EVE, there's more to survival than balancing EHP vs. DPS.


B-Series Logi? Or vk.1? They're the ones with the speed buff that actually lets them match (or outpace) Scouts. They may not have the evasive abilities of a Scout during combat, but they have high sprint speed AND more fitting capacity, which means they can be more heavily tanked (with more HP to start with) while still getting a Stamina mod to help balance their shortage in that regard. Also, more equipment slots, which will mean room for a cloak when they show up - they're supposedly going to be equipment.

I don't claim to be psychic, but I think it's largely the evasive qualities our abrasive friend is after.

Dance like a butterfly, sting like a dude with a plasma assault rifle.

And the tactics you want to use are based around you running off completely unsupported instead of having at least half a squad working together like the guy you're complaining about, in a suit that's NOT built for direct combat, and complaining that you can't go into straight-up fights against enemies who outnumber you and have more EHP because you're built for speed and stealth more than durability.

If you're running a Scout and actually providing recon for a squad, you should rarely even be getting shot at, let alone taking hits, but you're not, you're off doing everything lone wolf style completely alone.

Maybe you should think about the fact that your own arguments are countering one another before trying to make them?

Ok, lets assume they fix the scout the way you like it,

You arrive at the coordinates before your team like in your post and encounter multiple assaults, you then proceed with engaging them like you say, you dont twiddle thumbs while waiting for backup and kill them all...

The only reason you can't use e-war is because you're focusing on EHP instead, when you shouldn't be as concerned with that on a Scout because your goal is to not be getting shot. Maybe a Shield Extender, maybe an Armour Repper or Triage Nanohive (because you're usually out of reach of Repair Tools), then pile on the e-war gear. Dampeners, Precision/Range Amps, etc. Load yourself up for scanning and/or stealth, with only a little bit of tank in case the plan falls apart. Pick off stragglers from the group. Chip away at people who are already taking fire. Hit someone as a DISTRACTION rather than a direct attack.

It may not be the best source of WP, but it makes you more of a benefit to the team.

And yes, if you're spotted, you go *splat* really fast, but if you do the job well, that's the exception rather than the rule. Active Scanners will change this up a little, and so will cloaking. But neither will have a huge impact on the role of such a suit, only its performance in that role.

All good. One of my housemates is a dedicated, rationalist techie who shows some of the same qualities, so I'm familiar with the phenomenon (though I appreciate the context). Of course, I also was not one of those receiving the brunt of your wrath.

It's ironic that discussions among people engaged in what is meant to be a pure exercise of reason (the hard sciences, not DUST) get heated easily. Ah, well ... we're all human, after all.

Do I have your desire for "scout as agile combatant" down correctly? It's a perspective, as I've mentioned, I can understand and respect even if I don't agree with it-- or at least with the need for the current scout to be transformed into it.

The scout as it presently stands doesn't seem particularly underpowered to me, though I've admittedly been using it in public matches (corp matches want the best, and I'm certainly not the best the PFBHz have to offer). My setup isn't high-end, but I survive well enough and can do a lot of mischief in a short time.

Just ... not so much of it while looking down the sights of a gun. I defend myself or pick off easy kills, but otherwise I'm busy hacking the CRU or objective while my squad is fighting (works surprisingly well even if there are shots zinging past my ears-- people usually hunt the hacker only after they're not getting shot at) , or setting traps to blow up later.

So far, the best weapons I've had as a scout are AV grenades and remote explosives. I spring for Advanced on both, the only higher-quality gear I usually carry.

That seems like a perfectly acceptable scouting role, to me: use electronics, hacking, traps, and the occasional seeking grenade. Provide good intel, take shameless advantage of chaos, make yourself a confounded nuisance, and try to provide that little bit of "edge" that wins the match.

An agile attacker seems like a worthwhile, and arguably unfilled, role, but it's not my role, at least not right now. I like my role. It suits me. I expect it to suit me even better when the maps are twenty times their current size.

I can understand what you want, and why, but I don't feel I should need to give up what I have for you to obtain it.

Well ... hm. Let me think.

Giving you a little more defense would allow you to pursue your preferred tactics more easily. Clear enough. Just tweaking that doesn't really cost us anything ... assuming that's all that happens.

I suppose what we're concerned about is that this shift would come at the expense of our preferred tactics-- that the scout suit would become less-frequently used for straight-up stealth. The suit doesn't seem underpowered to us, so what you suggest seems like it would be more of a change of role than an improvement on an existing one.

We're kind of the conservatives in this discussion: "It's fine as is. Just leave it alone!"

Of course, if it were used for attack more often, that could actually make sneaking easier.

One concern, though: the shotgun scout only avoids being flavor of the month by virtue of that title having been given to the laser assaults already. Are you sure this change of yours wouldn't just result in scout suits taking over for assault as the most-used, with ravening packs of well-defended scouts overrunning everything in sight with their creaky-gate weaponry?

I mean, I kind of smile, right now, when a shotgun scout tries to sneak up on me (my Analysis skill is high enough that I see them coming), but I'm not sure I'd be smiling if they could take more hits than they currently can.

Well ... hm. Let me think.

Giving you a little more defense would allow you to pursue your preferred tactics more easily. Clear enough. Just tweaking that doesn't really cost us anything ... assuming that's all that happens.

I suppose what we're concerned about is that this shift would come at the expense of our preferred tactics-- that the scout suit would become less-frequently used for straight-up stealth. The suit doesn't seem underpowered to us, so what you suggest seems like it would be more of a change of role than an improvement on an existing one.

We're kind of the conservatives in this discussion: "It's fine as is. Just leave it alone!"

Of course, if it were used for attack more often, that could actually make sneaking easier.

One concern, though: the shotgun scout only avoids being flavor of the month by virtue of that title having been given to the laser assaults already. Are you sure this change of yours wouldn't just result in scout suits taking over for assault as the most-used, with ravening packs of well-defended scouts overrunning everything in sight with their creaky-gate weaponry?

I mean, I kind of smile, right now, when a shotgun scout tries to sneak up on me (my Analysis skill is high enough that I see them coming), but I'm not sure I'd be smiling if they could take more hits than they currently can.