DUST Search - So should I just give up on the heavy and go with Assault since it's clearly...

Disturbingly Bored wrote:

So, I'm a bit of a dork. (We're all arguing over a videogame on the Internets, that shouldn't come as a surprise.) So I try to put numbers behind balance suggestions as best I can.

A Heavy-II kills an Assault-II in 0.78s.
An Assault-II kills a Heavy-II in 1.94s. 149% difference in Heavy's favor.

A proto Heavy kills a proto shield Assault in 0.86s.
A proto shield Assault kills a proto Heavy in 1.94s. 129% difference in Heavy's favor.

A Heavy-II (basic HMG) kills a proto shield Assault in 1.04s.
A proto shield Assault kills a Heavy-II (basic HMG) in 1.76s. 69% difference in Heavy's favor. (!)

Really, I think the balance between the two is the same all the way up the technology scale. The problem is really the price.

(That, and the AR boys are getting better and better at headshots, while most Heavies are still aiming for center mass like morons.)

Fix the price and you'll fix the problem. Though I still think the proto Heavy suit needs another slot, most likely low slot for balance.


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Saj T IT'S NO USE 23	Posted - 2013.03.09 11:15:00 - [1] - Quote An assault suit effectively can tank way better than a heavy suit. This is due to the combination of the power of complex shield mods, superior amount of slots and the significantly smaller hitbox and mobility. Now add to the fact that heavy suits are considerably more expensive, to the point that with a properly kitted type-II suit (complex mods, blueprint sidearm, no proto gun) you can't afford to die more than 3 or so times per game. Now, considering that the heavy suit primarily works close up it's quite easy to die that often and it really doesn't matter how many kills you get because they won't offset the fact that you're making a net loss each game. Then for some reasons proto heavy suits are astronomically expensive where as the proto assault ones are not. On top of that they assault proto suits actually provide a useful boost where once again, the proto heavy suits do not. So yeah, proto equivalents sucks, heavy suits are more expensive in general (in the case of proto, a LOT more), tank less and have less mobility. The only advantage the heavy suit has is the ability to field the HMG and Forge Gun. Unless you're that oddball forge sniper who enjoys clicking pixels all day the Forge Gun is a situational weapon that's typically used for AV-work whenever a vehicle is deployed on the field, you don't need to be a specialized heavy to use it for this purpose. As for the HMG, really, I believe the AR to be a superior weapon and even if you do think the HMG is better, I don't see how you could find it redeeming the suckage that is the Heavy suit. Long story short, why play the heavy except for the cool factor and how it tears up bad and/or low SP players?
Saj T IT'S NO USE 23	Posted - 2013.03.09 12:59:00 - [2] - Quote Argo Filch wrote: the funny thing is... you guys seem to have the impression that this game is a 1v1 kinda deal... might be that a proto assault dude is better than a proto heavy dude... but a proper ehp tanked heavy with good weapon skills and 2 capable logibros as support will absolutely murder everyone in cqc... and if them two logibros have proto reppers with two streams to support two heavies... this is and should be first and foremost a team/squad focused game. Edith: too stupid to spell Okay, yes logibros are very nice and yes this is a team game. However, what's preventing you from running an assault suit instead with the same two logibros? In fact, the assault rifle will likely better complement the role of the logistics players since weapons like the HMG shine up-close where the DPS is often too high for the logistics players to cope with and it also puts them at larger risk since they do not enjoy the same tank that their target has. In addition to this, the assault suit gets a utility slot that heavy suits don't have, a slot which is especially useful for his fellow team members. Lastly, an assault suit won't limit the movement of the team like a heavy suit will. If you ask me, if anything the logi class existing is a point which supports the notion that the assault suit is superior to the heavy, not the opposite.
Saj T IT'S NO USE 23	Posted - 2013.03.09 15:49:00 - [3] - Quote Disturbingly Bored wrote: So, I'm a bit of a dork. (We're all arguing over a videogame on the Internets, that shouldn't come as a surprise.) So I try to put numbers behind balance suggestions as best I can. A Heavy-II kills an Assault-II in 0.78s. An Assault-II kills a Heavy-II in 1.94s. 149% difference in Heavy's favor. A proto Heavy kills a proto shield Assault in 0.86s. A proto shield Assault kills a proto Heavy in 1.94s. 129% difference in Heavy's favor. A Heavy-II (basic HMG) kills a proto shield Assault in 1.04s. A proto shield Assault kills a Heavy-II (basic HMG) in 1.76s. 69% difference in Heavy's favor. (!) Really, I think the balance between the two is the same all the way up the technology scale. The problem is really the price. (That, and the AR boys are getting better and better at headshots, while most Heavies are still aiming for center mass like morons.) Fix the price and you'll fix the problem. Though I still think the proto Heavy suit needs another slot, most likely low slot for balance. Some problems with your calculations here. 1) what the hell do these guys have equipped and what are their modules? 2) the larger hitbox of the heavy, larger spread of the HMG and slower turn ratio of the heavy are not taken into account. 3) Spread becomes an even bigger issue with the HMG when you're aiming at the head. 4) Did you take armor and shield into account when calculating effective HP versus the weapon type?