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Philipp Achtel
Immobile Infantry
10
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Posted - 2013.03.09 01:58:00 -
[1] - Quote
On Planet Earth, when a tactic or technology is discovered to be unable to overcome a different technology that is designed to defeat it, the smart strategist changes tactics. Airplanes can be shot down by relatively inexpensive missiles? Let's invest in stealth technology or bomb their radar facilities.
On Planet DUST, when a tactic is checked by a relatively inexpensive tech, we cry and cry for a nerf. Why can't we just accept that not all tactics are equal, and spending more SP or ISK should not always give you an advantage if you chose to use those skills or that equipment in an unfavorable environment?
If half the corps here lived on Planet Earth, they'd spend half their time QQing to God or some such to "Nerf missiles! OMG, a $200 missile can shoot down my $30M bomber. Can we get some balance here! I paid money for this! "
The fact is that cheap, smart solutions trump expensive technologies all the time. Just because an IED costs 20 bucks doesn't mean it can't destroy a vehicle that costs thousands of times that price. If you don't like it, then adapt.
Or you could cry like a baby. Whichever, really.
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Yozora Mikadzuki
Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.03.09 02:03:00 -
[2] - Quote
Nope, completely false.
You clearly do not be long on this forum. |
Philipp Achtel
Immobile Infantry
10
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Posted - 2013.03.09 02:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
Yozora Mikadzuki wrote:Nope, completely false.
You clearly do not be long on this forum.
Pretty much the level of discourse I've come to expect. |
Swufy
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
73
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Posted - 2013.03.09 02:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
Lol, tis true. |
Yozora Mikadzuki
Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.03.09 02:20:00 -
[5] - Quote
Philipp Achtel wrote:Yozora Mikadzuki wrote:Nope, completely false.
You clearly do not be long on this forum. Pretty much the level of discourse I've come to expect. Glad I could help. |
Beld Errmon
UnReaL.
507
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Posted - 2013.03.09 02:22:00 -
[6] - Quote
Its a beta everyone should be talking about balance its kinda the point besides looking for bugs. |
Nguruthos IX
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
82
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Posted - 2013.03.09 02:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
Beld Errmon wrote:Its a beta everyone should be talking about balance its kinda the point besides looking for bugs.
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The Infected One
CrimeWave Syndicate
146
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Posted - 2013.03.09 03:20:00 -
[8] - Quote
FORUMS ARE NO PLACE FOR REASON AND LOGIC!
CCP, NERF ROCK! IT'S OVERPOWERED! Paper is fine. - Scissors |
Wicked Glory
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
103
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Posted - 2013.03.09 03:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
It's not like this is a video game or anything like that, right? |
Sleepy Zan
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
2077
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Posted - 2013.03.09 03:29:00 -
[10] - Quote
Wicked Glory wrote:It's not like this is a video game or anything like that, right? Wha... |
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Wicked Glory
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
104
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Posted - 2013.03.09 03:32:00 -
[11] - Quote
Sleepy Zan wrote:Wicked Glory wrote:It's not like this is a video game or anything like that, right? Wha... Idk I guess I'm just crazy. |
Piercing Serenity
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION
190
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Posted - 2013.03.09 03:41:00 -
[12] - Quote
Philipp Achtel wrote:On Planet Earth, when a tactic or technology is discovered to be unable to overcome a different technology that is designed to defeat it, the smart strategist changes tactics. Airplanes can be shot down by relatively inexpensive missiles? Let's invest in stealth technology or bomb their radar facilities. On Planet DUST, when a tactic is checked by a relatively inexpensive tech, we cry and cry for a nerf. Why can't we just accept that not all tactics are equal, and spending more SP or ISK should not always give you an advantage if you chose to use those skills or that equipment in an unfavorable environment? If half the corps here lived on Planet Earth, they'd spend half their time QQing to God or some such to "Nerf missiles! OMG, a $200 missile can shoot down my $30M bomber. Can we get some balance here! I paid money for this! " The fact is that cheap, smart solutions trump expensive technologies all the time. Just because an IED costs 20 bucks doesn't mean it can't destroy a vehicle that costs thousands of times that price. If you don't like it, then adapt. Or you could cry like a baby. Whichever, really.
What new tactics can we "invest" in? We don't have the modules to diversify our tactics. There is no stealth. There are no 'unfavorable environments". We will keep asking for balance between different tactics until we have the means to create our own. |
Zahle Undt
Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire
24
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Posted - 2013.03.09 04:31:00 -
[13] - Quote
Philipp Achtel wrote:On Planet Earth, when a tactic or technology is discovered to be unable to overcome a different technology that is designed to defeat it, the smart strategist changes tactics. Airplanes can be shot down by relatively inexpensive missiles? Let's invest in stealth technology or bomb their radar facilities. On Planet DUST, when a tactic is checked by a relatively inexpensive tech, we cry and cry for a nerf. Why can't we just accept that not all tactics are equal, and spending more SP or ISK should not always give you an advantage if you chose to use those skills or that equipment in an unfavorable environment? If half the corps here lived on Planet Earth, they'd spend half their time QQing to God or some such to "Nerf missiles! OMG, a $200 missile can shoot down my $30M bomber. Can we get some balance here! I paid money for this! " The fact is that cheap, smart solutions trump expensive technologies all the time. Just because an IED costs 20 bucks doesn't mean it can't destroy a vehicle that costs thousands of times that price. If you don't like it, then adapt. Or you could cry like a baby. Whichever, really.
You sir, are my new hero |
Coleman Gray
Coalition Of Goverments
80
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Posted - 2013.03.09 05:36:00 -
[14] - Quote
Piercing Serenity wrote: What new tactics can we "invest" in? We don't have the modules to diversify our tactics. There is no stealth. There are no 'unfavorable environments". We will keep asking for balance between different tactics until we have the means to create our own.
No amount of digital based modules can compenstate for the sheer stupidity you see the players perform on this game. dorry to be a **** but for example Tactics are down to you and your team, unless they release Mods that play the game for you |
Philipp Achtel
Immobile Infantry
13
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Posted - 2013.03.09 06:10:00 -
[15] - Quote
Piercing Serenity wrote: What new tactics can we "invest" in? We don't have the modules to diversify our tactics. There is no stealth. There are no 'unfavorable environments". We will keep asking for balance between different tactics until we have the means to create our own.
For one, you can do something different. Is AV cramping your style in a particular match? How about you don't spawn tanks over and over? An unrealistic expectation, I know.
Most players here would rather lose a few tanks, then come on the forums to get the rules changed in their favor, because it somehow offends them that they can't buy a win all the time.
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Piercing Serenity
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION
190
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Posted - 2013.03.09 06:11:00 -
[16] - Quote
I'm confused with your most recent post Coleman.
You spoke of real-life scenarios between two technologies separated by their cost, utility, and age. You note that expensive airplanes can be destroyed by inexpensive missiles. The appropriate reaction (If I understood the OP correctly) is to invest in a superior technology designed to counter the one that destroyed you. I agree with the point but disagreed with your conclusion. That example does not justify ending the discussion of balance within DUST. It does justify a more close examination of the context in which our equipment was used.
You contended my point in your most recent post, arguing that no amount of "digitally based modules" - which I'll just call "gear" can compensate for player stupidity. Again, I also agree. My confusion comes from the shift in arguments between your posts.
If you are arguing that: "People should stop complaining about losing gear so much and focus on using their gear more tactfully." then I agree. We, as a community, could always benefit from being more level headed. That doesn't mean that we should stop discussing balance. I still believe that there aren't any new tactics in this game. To use your example, if my plane is destroyed by a missile, I currently don't have the option to research stealth or destroy radar arrays. All I can do is avoid this obstacle or challenge it in spite of the difficulties.
If you are arguing that: "People should focus more on improving their own game before blaming their faults on their gear and the gear of their opponents", then I also agree. However, there is no solid connection between these two arguments, save for the one link I'm thinking of. Which argument are you using? We'll go from there. |
Buster Friently
Rosen Association
102
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Posted - 2013.03.09 06:26:00 -
[17] - Quote
+1 to the op. Balance is a never ending game of illusion anyway. |
Philipp Achtel
Immobile Infantry
13
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Posted - 2013.03.09 06:39:00 -
[18] - Quote
Piercing Serenity wrote:I'm confused with your most recent post Coleman.
You spoke of real-life scenarios between two technologies separated by their cost, utility, and age. You note that expensive airplanes can be destroyed by inexpensive missiles. The appropriate reaction (If I understood the OP correctly) is to invest in a superior technology designed to counter the one that destroyed you. I agree with the point but disagreed with your conclusion. That example does not justify ending the discussion of balance within DUST. It does justify a more close examination of the context in which our equipment was used.
I was the OP, not Coleman. You misunderstood my point. In fact, your interpretation is the exact opposite of my point. Smart strategists don't complain when their tools don't work, they do something different. That something different isn't always throwing more tech at the problem. If tanks aren't working, don't complain about AV, just stop using tanks for that match. It's not a "balance problem" that cheap weapons can destroy expensive things, so don't come onto the forums and claim that there's some problem that needs to be fixed
Piercing Serenity wrote:If you are arguing that: "People should stop complaining about losing gear so much and focus on using their gear more tactfully." then I agree. We, as a community, could always benefit from being more level headed. That doesn't mean that we should stop discussing balance. I still believe that there aren't any new tactics in this game. To use your example, if my plane is destroyed by a missile, I currently don't have the option to research stealth or destroy radar arrays. All I can do is avoid this obstacle or challenge it in spite of the difficulties.
If you are arguing that: "People should focus more on improving their own game before blaming their faults on their gear and the gear of their opponents", then I also agree. However, there is no solid connection between these two arguments, save for the one link I'm thinking of. Which argument are you using? We'll go from there.
People aren't discussing balance, really. They're meta-gaming by trying to influence patches in their favor. |
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