I literally don't care

With the other thread not seeming to get the point across and some more recent ideas that will probably not get taken notice of, I decided to make another thread. This thread will hopefully convey my reasons properly and if you're going to reply please actually read the thread before replying with "AMAGAD YOU JUST WANT THIS GAME TO BE ABOUT ARS" "YOU NEED TO STOP WHINING ABOUT MILITIA AV WAAAAAAH" because these are not constructive nor are they part of the reasoning for this thread.

Before we go any further, to clarify what I'm talking about (noticed many people were getting confused by what I was asking previously), We are talking about Starter Fits, not the removal of BPOs, nor the removal of Militia Items but the free suits that never run out.



These starter fits are used by new players to get a hang of the game but can be used forever, I myself use the LAV and the Anti Armor all the time as I'm able to add additional BPOs to make them better and completely free. This I feel is a problem which has not been addressed. DUST 514 Devs have stated that the game is about Risk, about having to think about what you're using. I understand this is a crutch meant for newbies yet here I am earning 250k a game running free LAVs and Anti Armor suits without having to pay a dime.

But we cannot remove them outright, to remove such a vital crutch to new players is unfair, if they die enough times they may just end up running out of cash completely and will have no way to earn back their ISK as they will not be able to pay for more suits to actually play the game. (No CCP, no Aurum puchases, go away.)

I've thought about it and come up with (what I believe is) a reasonable idea.

1) Create a Free Gallente, Caldari, Minmitar and Amarr Assault suit, each distinct in colour with no slots other than the weapon slot, give each suit an assault rifle of the related factions styling. This suit does not appear at the fitting menu.
2) Allow this suit to be chosen based on what faction you're fighting. So If I enter a public match and I'm on the Gallente side, I will receive a Gallente Suit for the duration of the battle.
3) Give all players 50 Suits of their respective class in line with the current suits.

This I believe is not only a fair solution (Allowing you your 50 suits at the start of the game but also having a fallback suit with just an assault rifle if you are getting desperate) but one that allows players to feel like they are part of the respective factions "mercenary army" so to speak, if they are broke they can use the suit and gun provided by their faction.

Removal of the free LAVs:

The removal of the LAV is needed, it removes the arguement for free AV stuff to counter them and also gives a much greater need for players who have actually spec'd into vehicles. My main point being how many of you, if the maps were larger, would use the free LAV to get to a point? Quite a few I suspect, while players who are primarily spec'd into vehicles to transport others are just ignored due to this free "feature".

Now it's not as if I'm asking for the removal of the Militia LAVs, but using lots of militia LAVs the cost begins to stack, you can easily destroy around 10 LAVs in a match, one of these alone (with no fittings) costs 27,600 ISK, 276,000 worth destroyed in a match. Players constantly get these free LAVs, crash them and run off letting them burn with no forethought. I feel removal of these would change the battlefield slightly and for the better.

Again, we don't have to remove them outright, perhaps supplying all new players with 10 LAVs at the start of their character would help and gives them a fit that they don't have to make themselves and can just restock should they want to use it again.

Now before you post, do not thing "But such and such is an easy kill and it means free points", it is not constructive, instead give proper reasons why the should continue to exist as they are and not be changed for the reasons I have given. Thanks!

I think your being very nice/ kind. too kind for New Eden. My proposals are most probably too.

Starter fits should be removed. I like the idea of 50 suits upfront as you say and thats it.

BPOs dropsuit modules should be removed. Apart from being absolutely worthless I dont think it helps promote the idea of the market economy. I am inclined to think BPO suits should be removed too (thinking about it -yes I want them removed)

The only difference I have is on militia LAVs. If the maps are to get bigger we will need to get around the place etc. In corp matches they shouldnt be free. In faction warfare if it is a set up like the domination mode in MAG then yes they should be. And yes in pubs.

Whether it should add any benefit to your ISK total at the end of the match I am not sure - i err on the side of no.

Also, the milita LAVs set-up / fitting should not be able to be changed/ modified. For example, I can put a resistance module etc on them so they can take more than one hit from an AV grenade. This shouldnt be allowed.

As for BPO removal I am in full disagreement, considering that the velator in eve with its civillian miner and blaster is like resellable for 30 isk? Now further nerfing of the performance of the militia items I would not mind seeing to encourage players to upgrade out of the meta 0 gear.

Free LAVs need to go though I would agree. However an easily buyable lav with prefitted modules for a starter one I would like to see.

As for other starter kits I would like to see them for sale separately in the market militia category.

I dont know what Velator is. sorry

I agree with the idea of nerfing the performance of militia gear if this solves the problem of BPOs - then thats good by me. The problem is the BPOs are stopping people getting out of meta 0.

This not only hampers their play but must create a distortion to the in-game economy

We're only over the month into the game and I'm not surprised people are still sticking to lower meta gear.

I dont know what Velator is. sorry

I agree with the idea of nerfing the performance of militia gear if this solves the problem of BPOs - then thats good by me. The problem is the BPOs are stopping people getting out of meta 0.

This not only hampers their play but must create a distortion to the in-game economy

been here since last April. Its pretty much been the case. Tbh the differences in the weapon tiers were flattened over time so we now dont see a difference. In part people kept on being smoked by higher tier gear because they wouldnt get out of low gear stuff. So a nerf was called. For the game to work people are somehow going to have to be forced out of the lower tier gear.Its an RPG after all - and the mechanics are counter intuitive to the way people behave (thinking of behavioural economics for example) And why BPOs in my mind create a mindset for people - its ok I am not losing any ISK

I think your being very nice/ kind. too kind for New Eden. My proposals are most probably too.

Starter fits should be removed. I like the idea of 50 suits upfront as you say and thats it.

Rookie ships.

If you remove rookie ships from EVE, you remove the ability for new players to take risks.

The same is true for Starter Fits.

Do I think the Starter Fits are a little too good? Yes.

However, instead of removing them, why not deduct their cost from the payout at the end of the battle?

Show it on the screen at the end of the match. Then they aren't FREE, there is just no upfront cost. Your employer is fronting you the money and now that your contract is done, you owe them.

To be nice, you could cap it so you can't go negative or below say, 10,000 ISK, but there is a real reason to die less and to pay for suits upfront. Heck, you could even refund some or all of it if your team wins.

Rookie ships.

If you remove rookie ships from EVE, you remove the ability for new players to take risks.

The same is true for Starter Fits.

Do I think the Starter Fits are a little too good? Yes.

However, instead of removing them, why not deduct their cost from the payout at the end of the battle?

Show it on the screen at the end of the match. Then they aren't FREE, there is just no upfront cost. Your employer is fronting you the money and now that your contract is done, you owe them.

To be nice, you could cap it so you can't go negative or below say, 10,000 ISK, but there is a real reason to die less and to pay for suits upfront. Heck, you could even refund some or all of it if your team wins.

I like the idea of Starter Fits being paid for by the corp.

When you start out, the NPC corp helps you out with Starter Fits, but when you leave to join a player corp, the free ride is over.

but that would ruin the system of joining a corp . why leave when you get free stuff

Before we go any further, to clarify what I'm talking about (noticed many people were getting confused by what I was asking previously), We are talking about Starter Fits, not the removal of BPOs, nor the removal of Militia Items but the free suits that never run out.



These starter fits are used by new players to get a hang of the game but can be used forever, I myself use the LAV and the Anti Armor all the time as I'm able to add additional BPOs to make them better and completely free. This I feel is a problem which has not been addressed. DUST 514 Devs have stated that the game is about Risk, about having to think about what you're using. I understand this is a crutch meant for newbies yet here I am earning 250k a game running free LAVs and Anti Armor suits without having to pay a dime.

But we cannot remove them outright, to remove such a vital crutch to new players is unfair, if they die enough times they may just end up running out of cash completely and will have no way to earn back their ISK as they will not be able to pay for more suits to actually play the game. (No CCP, no Aurum puchases, go away.)

I've thought about it and come up with (what I believe is) a reasonable idea.

1) Create a Free Gallente, Caldari, Minmitar and Amarr Assault suit, each distinct in colour with no slots other than the weapon slot, give each suit an assault rifle of the related factions styling.

This suit does not appear at the fitting menu.
2) Allow this suit to be chosen based on what faction you're fighting. So If I enter a public match and I'm on the Gallente side, I will receive a Gallente Suit for the duration of the battle.
3) Give all players 50 Suits of their respective class in line with the current suits.

This I believe is not only a fair solution (Allowing you your 50 suits at the start of the game but also having a fallback suit with just an assault rifle if you are getting desperate) but one that allows players to feel like they are part of the respective factions "mercenary army" so to speak, if they are broke they can use the suit and gun provided by their faction.

Removal of the free LAVs:

The removal of the LAV is needed, it removes the argument for free AV stuff to counter them and also gives a much greater need for players who have actually spec'd into vehicles. My main point being how many of you, if the maps were larger, would use the free LAV to get to a point? Quite a few I suspect, while players who are primarily spec'd into vehicles to transport others are just ignored due to this free "feature".

Now it's not as if I'm asking for the removal of the Militia LAVs, but using lots of militia LAVs the cost begins to stack, you can easily destroy around 10 LAVs in a match, one of these alone (with no fittings) costs 27,600 ISK, 276,000 worth destroyed in a match. Players constantly get these free LAVs, crash them and run off letting them burn with no forethought. I feel removal of these would change the battlefield slightly and for the better.

Again, we don't have to remove them outright, perhaps supplying all new players with 10 LAVs at the start of their character would help and gives them a fit that they don't have to make themselves and can just restock should they want to use it again.

I thought of that: Player corps could be allowed to make their own starter fits, most likely with better gear than the cheap militia fits NPC corps give out.

If you're a dropship pilot, imagine your corp giving you access to Starter Dropships, for when you can't afford your own.

How about instead you remove all starter suits, give them 50 lav's and the frontline suit and that's it.