DUST Search - Since we are getting new suits....

Loss Tovas wrote:

Maken Tosch wrote:

If you want Dust to be dragged down to the level of scubs who just want everything handed to them, you are playing the wrong game. CCP is the kind of company (not unlike others) that is willing to put their players through the process of living their choices for the rest of their lives even if those choices turned out to be bad choices.

Awe, you don't like that. Too frakking bad.

Casuals make games. Not hardcore players. A balance has to be struck. I get that you want to force others to play the game the way you want them to play it, that's a pretty common thread amongst gamers. Allowing a casual to chase flavor of the month doesn't impact anyone but allows the casual to enjoy himself.

If we were talking release with everything available instead of trickling in and matches that put militia gear with prototype suits sure, maybe I would agree. But right now, how it is, and for what the casuals are needed for. I disagree no matter how smug you are.


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Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 17:29:00 - [1] - Quote I am just going to post this link right here for you to read For god sake people, do a search of the forums. The SEARCH function is there for a reason.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 17:49:00 - [2] - Quote Quote: A skill refund would allow players to not feel frustrated or left out and isn't even something new to Eve since CCP has done it for Capsuleers. The only time CCP ever reimbursed us for the SP we trained for is when they officially removed the "Learning" skills and revamped the attribute system due to the fact that the "Learning" skill books were a hindrance to the immersion of Eve for trial users. Since then there has been no SP reimbursements. That was YEARS ago.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 17:55:00 - [3] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: So we agree. They've done it before so they can do it again. I think a lot of people oppose this because it would allow a lot of the new players to undo their mistakes and catch up to the more hardcore players. The way the game is set up right now it isn't very user friendly and frankly that's not good. I think a refund would help casuals even the playing field and make the game all around more enjoyable. You are right. they can do it again but only if a case similar to the removal of the "Learning" skills were to happen or if London gets destroyed. That is not expected to happen as CCP is being careful with how skill books are being arranged. Currently, they are revamping the entire skill tree for Eve Online and so far... ABSOLUTELY NO ONE expects any SP refund of any kind.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 17:56:00 - [4] - Quote Scheneighnay McBob wrote: I support the idea of a respec when some new (and this major) comes out. I need all the SP I can get to put into being a full time pilot. NO. Terrible idea. I would rather see to it that the entire game economy is burned to the grown like what happened to Jita back in 2012 then to see a respec happen. I'm not alone in that opinion.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 18:16:00 - [5] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Scheneighnay McBob wrote: I support the idea of a respec when some new (and this major) comes out. I need all the SP I can get to put into being a full time pilot. NO. Terrible idea. I would rather see to it that the entire game economy is burned to the grown like what happened to Jita back in 2012 then to see a respec happen. I'm not alone in that opinion. Why? It makes little sense, this is still beta. Eve Online is still beta as well if you think about it.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 18:38:00 - [6] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: You are dodging the question. The other thing to think about is again, this isn't eve. While it exists in the same universe, it can not function the same way. Skill refunds so people can repsec allow casuals to keep up by not being penalized for not having the time to grind. I'll answer for you then. Respecing will simply allow players, especially those who have trained up tens of millions SP (some are currently up to at least 5 million in Dust) to be able to focus everything on one single flavor of the month and then once they get bored they simply move on to the next flavor of the month to respec into thus making each class into just some disposable set of skill books that people can just throw away. But that's not the biggest problem. The big problem is that respeccing will take away the very essence of having meaningful choices by taking away permanent consequences. You are not the first to ask for a Respec and Dust is not the first game to see players ask for this. Eve players have asked for the same thing, but thankfully the vast majority of the playerbase in Eve oppose it for the very reasons I mentioned. What is the point of having meaningful choices if none of my choices have a permanent consequence for me to live with for the rest of my life? Do you find it strange that I want to hinder myself like this? To choose to live with the mistakes of my past because my past has defined me and made me who I am? I made the choice of being a Nova Knifer only and I am glad to live with that choice even though I knew for a fact that there are better options out there. You're probably wondering "Maken, what if your profession is a bust?" Well then, that is my problem. Not yours. Stay out of it. Let me live with my permanent consequences so that my choices are meaningful.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 19:02:00 - [7] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Do you find it strange that I want to hinder myself like this? To choose to live with the mistakes of my past because my past has defined me and made me who I am? I made the choice of being a Nova Knifer only and I am glad to live with that choice even though I knew for a fact that there are better options out there. You're probably wondering "Maken, what if your profession is a bust?" Well then, that is my problem. Not yours. Stay out of it. Let me live with my permanent consequences so that my choices are meaningful. This isn't real life this is a video game. I'd rather have fun not worry about someones little libertarian wet dream. Honestly, if you like what Eve has to offer go play Spread-Sheets In Space. I already play Spreadsheets in Space. Also, just because this is a video game it doesn't mean it should cater to the lowest common denominator like big-business companies like EA and Microsoft do. If you want Dust to be dragged down to the level of scubs who just want everything handed to them, you are playing the wrong game. CCP is the kind of company (not unlike others) that is willing to put their players through the process of living with their choices for the rest of their lives even if those choices turned out to be bad choices. Awe, you don't like that. Too frakking bad.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 19:09:00 - [8] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: If you want Dust to be dragged down to the level of scubs who just want everything handed to them, you are playing the wrong game. CCP is the kind of company (not unlike others) that is willing to put their players through the process of living their choices for the rest of their lives even if those choices turned out to be bad choices. Awe, you don't like that. Too frakking bad. Casuals make games. Not hardcore players. A balance has to be struck. I get that you want to force others to play the game the way you want them to play it, that's a pretty common thread amongst gamers. Allowing a casual to chase flavor of the month doesn't impact anyone but allows the casual to enjoy himself. If we were talking release with everything available instead of trickling in and matches that put militia gear with prototype suits sure, maybe I would agree. But right now, how it is, and for what the casuals are needed for. I disagree no matter how smug you are. I'm not expecting you to agree with me. You answered exactly how I expected you would answer. Have a good day sir. If you decide to quit playing Dust, no one will miss you.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 19:17:00 - [9] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: I'm not expecting you to agree with me. You answered exactly how I expected you would answer. Have a good day sir. If you decide to quit playing Dust, no one will miss you. 678 kills huh? For a second there I thought you actually played the game. I understand why you fear a respec now. LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OMFG!!!!!!!!!!!! Oh wow, since when does my KDR matter? Have you ever considered this? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=40601&find=unread Maken Tosch wrote: Third thing I had to do was forget about SP and ISK. My job is to help my team by being a complete pest to the enemy. Imagine you see your team being annoyed by that one scout who seems to nova knife your team mates every now and then and can't seem to catch up to him as he does hit-n-run tactics. If you wish to be a ninja knifer, you have to forget about SP and ISK gains. That means limited KDR as stabbing people doesn't amount to much kills.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 19:31:00 - [10] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Oh wow, since when does my KDR matter? Didn't say anything about your KDR. Some needs to get better at reading comprehension. Hmm Loss Tovas wrote: 678 kills huh? For a second there I thought you actually played the game. I understand why you fear a respec now. What was this then? Pointing out my limited amount of kills (which I don't give a rat's ass about) in this fashion pretty much implies that you think I'm scared about having my KDR negatively affected. Ask everyone around here if I care about my KDR and they will all tell you that the only thing I care about is stabbing players in the face or in the back. You fail at best.

Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 19:37:00 - [11] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: What was this then? Pointing out my limited amount of kills (which I don't give a rat's ass about) in this fashion pretty much implies that you think I'm scared about having my KDR negatively affected. Ask everyone around here if I care about my KDR and they will all tell you that the only thing I care about is stabbing players in the face or in the back. You fail at best. It was a comment about how much you play. Not a comment about how much you suck at playing. That's evident by your membership in PRO not your KDR and Warpoint count. I play a lot, dude. I just like using a knife which limits my use. Even if I do pick up a gun, I often find myself carefully picking targets rather than farming kills in a tank like Bad Furry. Again, the number of kills don't matter. I also play support roles.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 19:39:00 - [12] - Quote Arbor Viridanus wrote: It's still an odd point to be making, however. Yes, a very odd point to make in a thread that is about SP resets/refunding.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 19:45:00 - [13] - Quote Loss Tovas wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: I play a lot, dude. I just like using a knife which limits my use. Even if I do pick up a gun, I often find myself carefully picking targets rather than farming kills in a tank like Bad Furry. Again, the number of kills don't matter. I also play support roles. Your measly 86k warpoints don't really suggest that. What the hell are you trying to do? Belittle me? Humiliate me? Good luck with that. I'm not the kind of person who cares about that.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 19:47:00 - [14] - Quote Arbor Viridanus wrote: Loss Tovas wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: I play a lot, dude. I just like using a knife which limits my use. Even if I do pick up a gun, I often find myself carefully picking targets rather than farming kills in a tank like Bad Furry. Again, the number of kills don't matter. I also play support roles. Your measly 86k warpoints don't really suggest that. I find that people only resort to mocking another's stats if they have no logical rebuttal to their argument. It's pretty much an admission of defeat. This. Notice he's now distracting us with unrelated points like this that don't contribute to the original topic of SP resets/refunds.
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1591	Posted - 2013.02.17 22:17:00 - [15] - Quote And here I was thinking that a scrub is a player who just doesn't like a challenge and hates to adapt to avoid dying. Perhaps being a needy player and joining the lowest common denominator is the new Elite trend. Who knew.