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Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 12:36:00 -
[1] - Quote
I would have posted this in the feedback/suggestion section, but I don't think that it is enough of a complet or well enough explored concept yet (at least on my part) so I wanted to get the opinions of the "general" community first.
I am a scout user. One of my favorite pass times is dodging bullets while moving in close for the kill, I can't tell you how many times I have been ingaged in this activity and have thought "if only i could do an aerial right now, I could completely dodge this guys line of fire" in stead of jumping, which is achievable but more clumsy with unnecessary hight and not enough horizontal arch (and it doesn't look as cool). What would be even cooler is if while doing the aerial I could continue to fire/aim in mid air/mid inversion.
Other things I have found myself in a position of desire/need.
GÇóAn omni directional diving roll. GÇóWall running GÇóA vaulting flip with a twist to go over the top of an opponent and come down behind facing them.
In and of themselfs, if only limited to the scout suite, these things would most certainly be OP. So it is my intention to gather intel from other suit class users about what could be implemented to the other classes to even the odds.
Example:
Assault class: Diving roll [not as far or quick as the scouts] Rushing shoulder [slight speed burst, impact target with shoulder, staggers target. Does not affect heavys. Affect scouts the most.
So on and so forth.
Also, I would like to hear from anyone who thinks that this is a terrible idea and why.
Thank you for your time. |
Reiki Jubo
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
63
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 12:51:00 -
[2] - Quote
what is this the matrix? just no please no. current agile mechanics are fine. diving roll would be imbalanced unless it had serious scope sway & gather afterwards which would render it useless unless u rolled behind cover. face facts u just cant dodge bullets. wall running sounds cool but only if it took massive stamina. rushing shoulder? really? would rather see them give them nova knives a slight buff and option 2 use them uncharged with r3. |
Zyrus Amalomyn
Militaires-Sans-Frontieres
29
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:06:00 -
[3] - Quote
People seem to like forgetting these suits are meant to be heavily armored tanky exoskeletons with a semi exception for the scout.
Freerunning would not only be ridiculous in this, but also redundant. People would just grenade your ass. |
Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
Zyrus Amalomyn wrote:People seem to like forgetting these suits are meant to be heavily armored tanky exoskeletons with a semi exception for the scout.
Well if I can jump in them as high as I can now there should be no reason why I can't do an aerial, or most other free runing stunts for that mater.
Zyrus Amalomyn wrote:Freerunning would not only be ridiculous in this, but also redundant. People would just grenade your ass.
This makes no sense to me what-so-ever. |
Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
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Posted - 2013.02.15 13:22:00 -
[5] - Quote
Reiki wrote:...render it useless unless u rolled behind cover.
Roll into cover was my intention.
Reiki wrote:...sounds cool but only if it took massive stamina.
Of course all of this stuff would require stamina, which would give people more of a reason to skill into stamina.
Reiki wrote:face facts u just cant dodge bullets
Your opinion. Tbh I don't find it overly difficult to dodge a good majority of the AR tracer bullets rather frequently. |
Rei Shepard
Spectre II
72
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:27:00 -
[6] - Quote
Ignoble Son wrote:Zyrus Amalomyn wrote:People seem to like forgetting these suits are meant to be heavily armored tanky exoskeletons with a semi exception for the scout. Well if I can jump in them as high as I can now there should be no reason why I can't do an aerial, or most other free runing stunts for that mater. Zyrus Amalomyn wrote:Freerunning would not only be ridiculous in this, but also redundant. People would just grenade your ass. This makes no sense to me what-so-ever.
Still would not make a bit of difference, if you where upside down, running on a wall or do high aerials against someone with good aim, it would however let you be totally invincible against scrubs.
Personally, idd just shoot you between the eyes mid cartwheel, shrug and move on.
Just guessing here, but sounds like you need some extra mechanic to save your *ss, just get better it helps.
|
Tectonious Falcon
The Southern Legion
395
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:28:00 -
[7] - Quote
Please no. |
Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:32:00 -
[8] - Quote
Rei Shepard wrote:Ignoble Son wrote:Zyrus Amalomyn wrote:People seem to like forgetting these suits are meant to be heavily armored tanky exoskeletons with a semi exception for the scout. Well if I can jump in them as high as I can now there should be no reason why I can't do an aerial, or most other free runing stunts for that mater. Zyrus Amalomyn wrote:Freerunning would not only be ridiculous in this, but also redundant. People would just grenade your ass. This makes no sense to me what-so-ever. Still would not make a bit of difference, if you where upside down, running on a wall or do high aerials against someone with good aim, it would however let you be totally invincible against scrubs. Personally, idd just shoot you between the eyes mid cartwheel, shrug and move on. Just guessing here, but sounds like you need some extra mechanic to save your *ss, just get better it helps.
Arrogance and hubris, such childishness is not nessesary. Thank you for your input, but I would just as soon do without it.
|
Rei Shepard
Spectre II
72
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:40:00 -
[9] - Quote
Quote:Arrogance and hubris, such childishness is not nessesary. Thank you for your input, but I would just as soon do without it.
Then don't ask for a mechanic that will make you dodge bullets artificially without the need to do it yourself. |
Travi Zyg
G I A N T
13
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:41:00 -
[10] - Quote
No way! Everyone knows all scout suits are OP. Free running would make it worse... |
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Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 13:44:00 -
[11] - Quote
Rei Shepard wrote:Quote:Arrogance and hubris, such childishness is not nessesary. Thank you for your input, but I would just as soon do without it. Then don't ask for a mechanic that will make you dodge bullets artificially without the need to do it yourself.
To do it myself? How is that even posible in a video game? Please stop, your just imbarassing yourself now, and I'm starting to feel bad for you. |
Rei Shepard
Spectre II
72
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:08:00 -
[12] - Quote
Ignoble Son wrote:Rei Shepard wrote:Quote:Arrogance and hubris, such childishness is not nessesary. Thank you for your input, but I would just as soon do without it. Then don't ask for a mechanic that will make you dodge bullets artificially without the need to do it yourself. To do it myself? How is that even posible in a video game? Please stop, your just imbarassing yourself now, and I'm starting to feel bad for you.
Ohhh i am so embarrassed on a forum on the internets..... you know full well that 90% of the players out there already have issues with scout suit tracking, thats why at some point in beta they lowered the movement rate of the suit, because people could not track them properly.
The suit is made for infiltration stealth and in general not to get detected, if you get detected its game over, not for matrix style evasion with Neo at the controls. Gunz The Game --> that way...
Quote:Also, I would like to hear from anyone who thinks that this is a terrible idea and why.
all i did was point out how a terribad idea it was because you asked for it. |
Rasputin La'Gar
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
28
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:38:00 -
[13] - Quote
I laughed when I read some of that. Theoretically, wouldn't it be of more use to assault guys who don't sit around in hills to camp? I think assault should get a turn around skill and scout could get a roll. Heavy shoulder sounds like it would help heavies with assault guys jumping around them. |
Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:42:00 -
[14] - Quote
Rei Shepard wrote:Ignoble Son wrote:Rei Shepard wrote:Quote:Arrogance and hubris, such childishness is not nessesary. Thank you for your input, but I would just as soon do without it. Then don't ask for a mechanic that will make you dodge bullets artificially without the need to do it yourself. To do it myself? How is that even posible in a video game? Please stop, your just imbarassing yourself now, and I'm starting to feel bad for you. Ohhh i am so embarrassed on a forum on the internets..... you know full well that 90% of the players out there already have issues with scout suit tracking, thats why at some point in beta they lowered the movement rate of the suit, because people could not track them properly. The suit is made for infiltration stealth and in general not to get detected, if you get detected its game over, not for matrix style evasion with Neo at the controls. Gunz The Game --> that way... Quote:Also, I would like to hear from anyone who thinks that this is a terrible idea and why. all i did was point out how a terribad idea it was because you asked for it.
No you were attempting to insult the idea and me as well, in so many words, calling me a scrub, without knowing anything about me, as opossed to offering constructive criticism. In fact you're still doing it.
The fact that scouts are well suited for infiltration does not meant that this is the only role on the battle field they should play. Some people like to be tough others like to be agile, and I happen to fall into the latter catigory.
90% of players, really. Sounds like QQ to me, and I've been playing for quite a while now.
The fact is that it should be difficult to kill a scout, and that difficulty should be based around how agile a scout suit is compounded by player skill. Simply because a few geniuses can completely own people with them is not a fair gauge for level of affective agility to set the scout suit at for the common player. And this is going to be the case for any suit class/weapon.
So please, do not continue to insult me. If you are interested in discussing the mater civily, I would be glad to do so, otherwise I could do without your comments.
Thanks |
Malinche La Llorona
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
65
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:48:00 -
[15] - Quote
Just to make sure I understand the OP - You through an idea out there. That idea is horrible. People told you the idea is horrible. Your feewing got butt hurt on the internet.
Yeah... you should do just fine in New Eden... |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
2866
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:50:00 -
[16] - Quote
I think all classes should have it.
However because scouts have the most speed jump and stamina they be the best users of it.
Heavies could use it to vault that stair railing. |
Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:51:00 -
[17] - Quote
Malinche La Llorona wrote:Just to make sure I understand the OP - You through an idea out there. That idea is horrible. People told you the idea is horrible. Your feewing got butt hurt on the internet.
Yeah... you should do just fine in New Eden...
Lol, man the world is full of them. |
Malinche La Llorona
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
65
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:57:00 -
[18] - Quote
Ignoble Son wrote:Malinche La Llorona wrote:Just to make sure I understand the OP - You through an idea out there. That idea is horrible. People told you the idea is horrible. Your feewing got butt hurt on the internet.
Yeah... you should do just fine in New Eden... Lol, man the world is full of them.
Full of people that realize trying to turn Dust into Assassin's Creed/Dishonored is a terrible idea that would only occur to people who have no idea how video game development works and/or are so bad at playing that they need superpowers to stop getting owned?
Yep. The world is full of people just like that. |
Oxskull Duncarino
Shadow Company HQ
164
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:08:00 -
[19] - Quote
Ignoble Son wrote:Rei Shepard wrote:Ignoble Son wrote:Zyrus Amalomyn wrote:People seem to like forgetting these suits are meant to be heavily armored tanky exoskeletons with a semi exception for the scout. Well if I can jump in them as high as I can now there should be no reason why I can't do an aerial, or most other free runing stunts for that mater. Zyrus Amalomyn wrote:Freerunning would not only be ridiculous in this, but also redundant. People would just grenade your ass. This makes no sense to me what-so-ever. Still would not make a bit of difference, if you where upside down, running on a wall or do high aerials against someone with good aim, it would however let you be totally invincible against scrubs. Personally, idd just shoot you between the eyes mid cartwheel, shrug and move on. Just guessing here, but sounds like you need some extra mechanic to save your *ss, just get better it helps. Arrogance and hubris, such childishness is not nessesary. Thank you for your input, but I would just as soon do without it. Arrogance IS hubris!! And you shouldn't get all peeved off if someone does as you directed. You asked to hear from anyone who thinks that this is a terrible idea and why. Rei said it was a terrible idea because no matter what shapes you pulled, with good aim Rei could still shoot you. Feedback as per request!!!!!
I'd be happy to see all this introduced once everything else that we've been told about has been implemented. I like the idea of the scout doing an overhead flip, but I'd like everybody to have some kind of rapid 180 turn ability as a counter. Of course these moves would have to be stamina based. As it is, scouts can do an over the head jump with just a slight rise in terrain and land behind their target to either run or blast them. |
Sleepy Zan
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
2047
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:10:00 -
[20] - Quote
Mirrors Edge 514?.. Add it!
\/ |
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Your Absolut End
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
11
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:16:00 -
[21] - Quote
Im mostly playing Assault and I get killed sometimes, so I was wondering if it wouldn't be cool if Assaults could get a fire bursting function to the normal function, also I would like to become immortal and invisible for a decent time, I think like 1 minute, and it should be recharging like the shield for sure.
Seriously, you are a SCOUT, you now what scouts do? The sit in their hills and try to give support to their team, look where the enemy moves and maybe take out some and try to defend our Null-Cannons. And you know what scouts don't do? Run around in CC and kill a shitload of people. Scouts are glascannons, they deal pretty much dmg, but also don't have much health.
Deal with it, if you wanna go CC take assault, heavy or logi, these are the classes meant for that. |
Travi Zyg
G I A N T
13
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:17:00 -
[22] - Quote
Sleepy Zan wrote:Mirrors Edge 514?.. Add it! \ /
ya know? i actually really enjoyed that game, last i heard they are still supposed to be making it a trilogy.
Back on topic here, you cant expect to post a suggestion here and expect construtive critism or people liking it to no end. So many people hanging out here just waiting for the right moment to get their low jab in on you for saying something they dont agree with. |
Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:19:00 -
[23] - Quote
Malinche La Llorona wrote:Ignoble Son wrote:Malinche La Llorona wrote:Just to make sure I understand the OP - You through an idea out there. That idea is horrible. People told you the idea is horrible. Your feewing got butt hurt on the internet.
Yeah... you should do just fine in New Eden... Lol, man the world is full of them. Full of people that realize trying to turn Dust into Assassin's Creed/Dishonored is a terrible idea that would only occur to people who have no idea how video game development works and/or are so bad at playing that they need superpowers to stop getting owned? Yep. The world is full of people just like that.
Please do explain in what way an aerial, diving roll, or wall running is a super power? Ridiculous.
Based on reality alone, i should AT LEAST be able to perform a diving roll (not to mention go prone). These other abilities (aerial, wall running) are purely situational in battle (and would be further limited by stamina) and completely atchivable by any fit human being, if one devotes the time to the mater (to skill into them so to speak). My ideas are based in reality, which is something I find that this game is in short supply of. one of the best weapons ever created is the human body. I would at least like to be able to use a decent fraction of its potential in combat. |
Travi Zyg
G I A N T
13
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:22:00 -
[24] - Quote
Your Absolut End wrote:Seriously, you are a SCOUT, you now what scouts do? The sit in their hills and try to give support to their team, look where the enemy moves and maybe take out some and try to defend our Null-Cannons. And you know what scouts don't do? Run around in CC and kill a shitload of people. Scouts are glascannons, they deal pretty much dmg, but also don't have much health..
Not entirely true imo. A shotty scout with a decent amount of SP specd into profile dampening and mobility/vigor and the like could be quite deadly up front . Just takes a certain kind of player to be able to plan all your moves in a very stealthy way and be in and out in a jiffy and catch a few bodies on the way. Ive seen it done quite a bit. Also couldnt hurt to dabble with a little shield tanking too just in case you do get caught out to give yourself a couple extra seconds of survivability. |
Rei Shepard
Spectre II
72
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:40:00 -
[25] - Quote
Quote:No you were attempting to insult the idea and me as well, in so many words, calling me a scrub, without knowing anything about me, as opossed to offering constructive criticism. In fact you're still doing it.
constructive or not, its a bad idea for 'this' game.
Quote:The fact that scouts are well suited for infiltration does not meant that this is the only role on the battle field they should play. Some people like to be tough others like to be agile, and I happen to fall into the latter category.
Scouts are well Scouts! Well damn ...a scout suit is a assault suit stripped from its armor plates, specialized for scouting, be it infiltration or elimination, its not designed for head on evasion jumping....if you use it to go head on into a bunch, prepare to die...
Quote:90% of players, really. Sounds like QQ to me, and I've been playing for quite a while now.
You should check the scoreboards after a game sometime, usually its 4-6 people in the positive, rest all deep in negative KDR.
Quote:The fact is that it should be difficult to kill a scout, and that difficulty should be based around how agile a scout suit is compounded by player skill. Simply because a few geniuses can completely own people with them is not a fair gauge for level of affective agility to set the scout suit at for the common player. And this is going to be the case for any suit class/weapon.
You should make it the enemy more difficult to kill you by using your speed, not by trying to dance around him doing body flips, if you make the scout suit godlike for evading for the common player, guess what the geniuses are gonna do with it?
I wouldn't just shoot you between the eyes when you are doing a cartwheel of a wall, idd be doing it mid-flight in my own cartwheel dropping down from a container stacked 4 stories high with a sniper rifle :p
Seriously though it would just give a whole lot of power to people who can do that stuff right now with the scout suit.
Just look at this clip Here
Just me playing some Jump Sniping as you can see the movement players have in APB R is faster then a scout suit in Dust and you cannot run out of stamina and regardless of them using automatic weapons, they still get killed by 2 rounds to the face with a 1.5s re-chamber interval while their weapon has a Time to kill of 0.75s-1s if they hit their rounds i would be long dead up close with a sniper rifle halfway trough re-chambering.
Its also the reason i get Hackused about 5-8 times per evening on there but thats for another topic... Just imagine a scout, doing a wallwalk then jumps aims and headshots you while dodging bullets.....cool in APB R, not cool in Dust 541, one guy capable of pulling it off is all that's needed to ruin the match.
I haven't sniped yet in this game, but once i get to it skillwise, its gonna be fun.
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Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 16:13:00 -
[26] - Quote
Oxskull Duncarino wrote:Arrogance IS hubris!!
Actually hubris is a particular kind of arrogance, which means I must be commenting on two separate aspects of his post. Novel idea? Humm.
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Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 16:13:00 -
[27] - Quote
Rei Shepard wrote:Quote:No you were attempting to insult the idea and me as well, in so many words, calling me a scrub, without knowing anything about me, as opossed to offering constructive criticism. In fact you're still doing it. constructive or not, its a bad idea for 'this' game. Quote:The fact that scouts are well suited for infiltration does not meant that this is the only role on the battle field they should play. Some people like to be tough others like to be agile, and I happen to fall into the latter category. Scouts are well Scouts! Well damn ...a scout suit is a assault suit stripped from its armor plates, specialized for scouting, be it infiltration or elimination, its not designed for head on evasion jumping....if you use it to go head on into a bunch, prepare to die... Quote:90% of players, really. Sounds like QQ to me, and I've been playing for quite a while now. You should check the scoreboards after a game sometime, usually its 4-6 people in the positive, rest all deep in negative KDR. Quote:The fact is that it should be difficult to kill a scout, and that difficulty should be based around how agile a scout suit is compounded by player skill. Simply because a few geniuses can completely own people with them is not a fair gauge for level of affective agility to set the scout suit at for the common player. And this is going to be the case for any suit class/weapon. You should make it the enemy more difficult to kill you by using your speed, not by trying to dance around him doing body flips, if you make the scout suit godlike for evading for the common player, guess what the geniuses are gonna do with it? I wouldn't just shoot you between the eyes when you are doing a cartwheel of a wall, idd be doing it mid-flight in my own cartwheel dropping down from a container stacked 4 stories high with a sniper rifle :p Seriously though it would just give a whole lot of power to people who can do that stuff right now with the scout suit. Just look at this clip HereJust me playing some Jump Sniping as you can see the movement players have in APB R is faster then a scout suit in Dust and you cannot run out of stamina and regardless of them using automatic weapons, they still get killed by 2 rounds to the face with a 1.5s re-chamber interval while their weapon has a Time to kill of 0.75s-1s if they hit their rounds i would be long dead up close with a sniper rifle halfway trough re-chambering. Its also the reason i get Hackused about 5-8 times per evening on there but thats for another topic... Just imagine a scout, doing a wallwalk then jumps aims and headshots you while dodging bullets.....cool in APB R, not cool in Dust 541, one guy capable of pulling it off is all that's needed to ruin the match. I haven't sniped yet in this game, but once i get to it skillwise, its gonna be fun.
You have made your point, with civility this time, even. And, though i do not agree with what you have said (for resons already stated) I do respect it.
"Next!" |
Your Absolut End
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
11
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 16:18:00 -
[28] - Quote
Travi Zyg wrote:Your Absolut End wrote:Seriously, you are a SCOUT, you now what scouts do? The sit in their hills and try to give support to their team, look where the enemy moves and maybe take out some and try to defend our Null-Cannons. And you know what scouts don't do? Run around in CC and kill a shitload of people. Scouts are glascannons, they deal pretty much dmg, but also don't have much health.. Not entirely true imo. A shotty scout with a decent amount of SP specd into profile dampening and mobility/vigor and the like could be quite deadly up front . Just takes a certain kind of player to be able to plan all your moves in a very stealthy way and be in and out in a jiffy and catch a few bodies on the way. Ive seen it done quite a bit. Also couldnt hurt to dabble with a little shield tanking too just in case you do get caught out to give yourself a couple extra seconds of survivability.
You're totally right with this, but this might only work in Ambush which is a very quick gamemode, I don't think this strategie pays out that well when you are playing skirmish.
I really don't want to sound completely against scouts, I also like using this dropsuit, but not that often. I just think there is a very nice role for every dropsuit, and I really don't get the point why ccp should add so much stuff just to make it more easy for scouts, if it's boring up the hill grab you Assault suit and go for it. Or try the shotgun trick you mentioned. For sure this need skill, I mean ingame SP and also skill from the player, but thats just the same with every class.
Once again: OP here's the game, deal with it.
Not meant offensive, but I just don't get the point people complaining about everything and try to make CCP inculding things which makes your life more easy. It's not meant to be an easy game and thats what makes Dust intresting over all the other games IMO. |
lowratehitman
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
284
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 16:23:00 -
[29] - Quote
The scout is an awesome suit and runs plenty fast enough |
Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 16:32:00 -
[30] - Quote
Oops |
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