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Aqil Aegivan
The Southern Legion
50
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Posted - 2013.02.11 18:04:00 -
[1] - Quote
I was surprised after searching the words "nova knives ignore shields" and getting no results. It seems like a natural idea for making them worthwhile. Not that it's necessarily a good idea, but I am surprised it hasn't been raised. What do people think? OP? Tacky? Worth exploring?
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Face McStabby
Doomheim
0
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Posted - 2013.02.17 04:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
Nope. Nova Knives are great the way they are. I made this alt today to skill specifically into them, and my first game I went 7-5. The one after, I went 12-5. |
KalOfTheRathi
CowTek
168
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Posted - 2013.02.17 05:01:00 -
[3] - Quote
Bit dirt. And eat HMG rounds as well.
NK are a total waste of time. Some useless Lone Wolf pretending that DUST is different game. |
Barnabas Wrex
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
148
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Posted - 2013.02.17 05:03:00 -
[4] - Quote
I would imagine when people can cloak suits... Nova knives will be looked at VERY differently. |
Coleman Gray
Coalition Of Goverments
47
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Posted - 2013.02.17 05:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
their a side arm, so really should be used by long range classes if someone gets close surely? |
Vel'sar Altruin
Shadow Company HQ
5
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Posted - 2013.02.17 05:49:00 -
[6] - Quote
I've used Nova Knives and while I think they are alot of fun and if you are good at hit and run tactis not that bad, you're not going to be helping your team much. I usually stick around one objective and stab anyone that starts hacking things, but as soon as two people appear I am more or less dead. |
Maken Tosch
Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore
1594
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Posted - 2013.02.18 14:22:00 -
[7] - Quote
They are actually quite effective but you have to remember that the nova knives are not the sort of weapon to be used by rookies. They are weapons for professionals only who know how to properly use them. This means that the nova knives present the ultimate challenge for the extremely hardcore players who strive for a challenge. |
Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
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Posted - 2013.02.18 16:23:00 -
[8] - Quote
A.) Nova Knives need to be able to be charged while sprinting to make them useful. B.) They need to have slightly longer range considering how close you have to be to use them. C.) "tracking" targets needs to be implemented as all they have to do is strafe fast enough and you can't hit them. D.) Different 'styles' of nova weaponry, such as larger blades and the like. |
iceyburnz
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
283
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Posted - 2013.02.18 16:25:00 -
[9] - Quote
Nova sword please. |
Stefan Stahl
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
25
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Posted - 2013.02.18 18:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
I think there should be racial variants for melee weapons. They'd all work off the same skill, but be functionally marginally different.
The current nova knives look Caldari in design. They deal a lot of damage, but take two consecutive swings to use. A Gallentean design would be perhaps more look like a set of small kris. They'd deal slightly less damage, but be quick to charge and strike both hands at once. An Amarr variant could be a single large dagger that takes longer to charge but deals massive damage in one strike. The Minmatar could perhaps wield a sort of Nova Axe that looks like a Sci-Fi Tomahawk. |
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Aqil Aegivan
The Southern Legion
50
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Posted - 2013.02.18 19:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:They are actually quite effective but you have to remember that the nova knives are not the sort of weapon to be used by rookies. They are weapons for professionals only who know how to properly use them. This means that the nova knives present the ultimate challenge for the extremely hardcore players who strive for a challenge.
For these dedicated people are the knives really an equivalent alternative to other sidearms? Or is the extra challenge more of a gimmick? Considering the range of sidearms we have I wouldn't mind if these are the "I brought a knife to a gun fight and won" style weapon but considering the range of possibilities available for stealth roles in the future an argument could be made for keeping the option of a more easily used melee weapon open.
If we see expanded stealth mechanics in the future I think there would be a need for weaponry that meshes with that role. Glass cannon style weapons like high powered nova knives would help drive the cov-ops/counter cov-ops gameplay by placing more at stake. There would be a reason to dedicate SP and slots to scanning gear when there's a real risk, rather than the risk of having to turn around and gun down the hapless guy who thought nova knives were a weapon any one takes seriously. |
Mithridates VI
New Eden Research Foundation
169
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Posted - 2013.02.18 19:34:00 -
[12] - Quote
Aqil Aegivan wrote:For these dedicated people are the knives really an equivalent alternative to other sidearms? Or is the extra challenge more of a gimmick?
I am by no means a badass with nova knives (I think you've actually shot me in the face while I tested whether frontal assault was viable) but I've found that they have a role in which they're better than other weapons. All of the times I've died with a knife ninja build (knife as primary, 2x sidearm modifer, 2x kinetic catalyser) have been experimenting with taking that build outside of the role I find it excels in.
Even though sprinting with nova knives isn't properly implemented yet (though I understand it's coming SOONGäó) it's still possible to do and, for me, that's what makes them unique. I've had a lot of success with sprinting hit and runs, being caught in front of a heavy and exploiting their slow turning to get behind them and strike. I don't think I would have had the same result if I was running a shotgun scout (which is admittedly better in many situations, like narrow hallways).
When I've stuck to sprinting between cover and flanking with knives charged, I've had more success than doing the same with a shotgun because I can make the attack part of my sprinting past and back into cover.
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Aqil Aegivan
The Southern Legion
50
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Posted - 2013.02.18 19:51:00 -
[13] - Quote
Mithridates VI wrote:Aqil Aegivan wrote:For these dedicated people are the knives really an equivalent alternative to other sidearms? Or is the extra challenge more of a gimmick? I am by no means a badass with nova knives (I think you've actually shot me in the face while I tested whether frontal assault was viable) but I've found that they have a role in which they're better than other weapons. All of the times I've died with a knife ninja build (knife as primary, 2x sidearm modifer, 2x kinetic catalyser) have been experimenting with taking that build outside of the role I find it excels in. Even though sprinting with nova knives isn't properly implemented yet (though I understand it's coming SOONGäó) it's still possible to do and, for me, that's what makes them unique. I've had a lot of success with sprinting hit and runs, being caught in front of a heavy and exploiting their slow turning to get behind them and strike. I don't think I would have had the same result if I was running a shotgun scout (which is admittedly better in many situations, like narrow hallways). When I've stuck to sprinting between cover and flanking with knives charged, I've had more success than doing the same with a shotgun because I can make the attack part of my sprinting past and back into cover.
I find that success with most weapons is based on the idea of playing to that weapon's strengths (obvious I know but anyone on the forums has seen their fair share of people complaining about exactly this). If it turns out that the forthcoming sprinting nova knives work then problem solved. I just thought that given the general consensus about their relative strength it might be useful to discuss more interesting changes than a simple damage buff. |
YourDeadAgain76
Red Star.
133
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Posted - 2013.02.18 19:54:00 -
[14] - Quote
Aqil Aegivan wrote:I was surprised after searching the words "nova knives ignore shields" and getting no results. It seems like a natural idea for making them worthwhile. Not that it's necessarily a good idea, but I am surprised it hasn't been raised. What do people think? OP? Tacky? Worth exploring?
Skill up in them and try them out dude. If you are trying to kill peeps with LVL 1 Nova knives they probably aren't worth a crap. |
Mithridates VI
New Eden Research Foundation
169
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Posted - 2013.02.18 19:58:00 -
[15] - Quote
Aqil Aegivan wrote:I find that success with most weapons is based on the idea of playing to that weapon's strengths (obvious I know but anyone on the forums has seen their fair share of people complaining about exactly this). If it turns out that the forthcoming sprinting nova knives work then problem solved. I just thought that given the general consensus about their relative strength it might be useful to discuss more interesting changes than a simple damage buff. Oh, for the record, I'm not against the idea of a buff for the knives. My response was mainly to whether they worked as an alternative now, which they do, but in a much more limited role than other weapons have.
I'm for the idea of tweaking them so they're more versatile. LVL 1 knives probably do fit into the "knife to a gunfight" category. I think if a swipe dealt damage to a wide enough cone in front of the player, they'd probably do a lot better.
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Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
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Posted - 2013.02.18 19:59:00 -
[16] - Quote
Stefan Stahl wrote:I think there should be racial variants for melee weapons. They'd all work off the same skill, but be functionally marginally different.
The current nova knives look Caldari in design. They deal a lot of damage, but take two consecutive swings to use. A Gallentean design would be perhaps more look like a set of small kris. They'd deal slightly less damage, but be quick to charge and strike both hands at once. An Amarr variant could be a single large dagger that takes longer to charge but deals massive damage in one strike. The Minmatar could perhaps wield a sort of Nova Axe that looks like a Sci-Fi Tomahawk.
Noooooo Gallente should be Kukri and deal HIGH damage with slow charge.
Don't you know anything about Gallente fighting style? Up close and personal with the highest damage output! |
Hotaru Oda
Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.02.20 17:34:00 -
[17] - Quote
Well i would say the Nova Knifes are amusing to use. If they added an ability to throw them at people besides just hack n slash and wait for the charge up. Another addition would be allowing them to be attached to weapons for a bayonet layout. Not sure if it is possible to increase the range with them even with the Sidearm Skill to increase range it would be nice if it was. Hand to Hand combat should increase their Damage i think. I don't get very many kills with nova knifes unless the person is sitting still hacking or something with their back turned to me or i cause them to panic as i run then jump at them with the nova Knifes in hand. Against a person that uses that Jumping and gunning or actually pay's attention it is useless. Sometimes it misses or doesn't do anything even if i am up close and right next to the person and i hit them.
The only thing i would be against would be instant assassination because then everyone would be using them. |
Maken Tosch
Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore
1594
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Posted - 2013.02.20 18:26:00 -
[18] - Quote
It is true that the nova knife is a very situational weapon. But it can become more effective so long as you have the element of surprise which you can get in a skirmish match. However, since ambush matches don't provide that kind of luxury, the best way to go about using the nova knife is to rely on your enemy's lack of organization since ambush matches cause massive confusion even among members who squad up with experienced players. If you can exploit the lack of organization, then you can do better with the knife.
Another thing to remember its to always utilize as much cover as possible and use it to create a distraction against your enemy while your team comes in for the kill. Which brings me to my next point. Rely on your teammates. You can use them to provide cover fire while you flank your enemy.
One more thing.
The red zone. Use it. Lady Redline can be such a pain in the buttocks, but if you know how to woo her in a proper courtship then you will have a very gorgeous companion. Contrary to what she normally demands, its best not to take it slow. |
Jack Sharkey42
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
18
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Posted - 2013.02.20 19:26:00 -
[19] - Quote
Math wise it looks like you'd be better off just getting a shotgun; No charge up and you can run and gun. Need to do it stealthy? Put ranks in Hand to Hand, gives 10% per rank and you can get a HI module that gives another 25% to melee damage. If the math I've been told in DUST is right it'd be around...
135 base melee damage X 1.5 Hand to Hand V X 1.25 mod = 253.12 per whack with the melee weapon with no charge up. Like the fit? Throw on another of those HI damage mods and it goes up to 316.4 per hit, enough to ice almost anyone and even put the beat down on a heavy in 2 or 3 swings. You even get to keep at least some range potential with a shotgun for when things go sour. |
Necrodermis
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
460
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Posted - 2013.02.20 20:03:00 -
[20] - Quote
nova knifes are the hull tankers of dust. you can do it, but it's stupid. special snowflakes that think guns are too mainstream for them to use. |
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