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Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors
183
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Posted - 2013.01.31 16:09:00 -
[1] - Quote
So watching some of these youtubes such as this where there are guys just trouncing the map with hardhitting (and expensive) guns....I'm wondering if the law of many MMOs apply: try to take down the hard hitting DPS first.
I'm wondering if we (us blueberries) should shift to a hunter-killer mindset, when you see somebody creeping to the top of the leaderboard, and they are getting killstreaks. I'm wondering if they should really start to become a sub-objective. If somebody is becoming responsible for 25%-50% of a teams kills why not try and nuetralize their effectiveness as much as possible. Make them realize that if they spawn in their 50k+ isk fit, that you will want to eat that.
I really think this is what the squad leader's 'attack order' is for. So blueberries, the next time you are sitting in cover, take a look at the leaderboard and who his raking in kills for the moment. Then find their chevron on the battlefield and have at thee. |
Vaerana Myshtana
ScIdama
Endless Renaissance
198
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Posted - 2013.01.31 16:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
I think this is actually a very good idea.
Not to punish people for fielding expensive fits or being good, but because it makes very basic tactical sense:
Gang up on the big guy. |
Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors
183
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Posted - 2013.01.31 16:27:00 -
[3] - Quote
It will also mean that the heavies wont be able to walk around solo a lot of time. Which means DPS will be forced to be more concentrated. Which could mean helps their enemies in a lot of ways. If squads have to support heavies that limits squad mobility. Then they have to choose to get in LAVs for mobility or slow foot it from one objective to the next over open group. Either way it increases their vulnerability. I mean we already do this with tanks, but when you hear the BONG of a FG or whiiirrr of an HMG we should be trying to find it ASAP. The downside of FGs though is that they don't have a trail I know of. Which makes them pretty stealthy. |
Knarf Black
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
396
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Posted - 2013.01.31 16:52:00 -
[4] - Quote
I always develop a bloodlust for that one guy in every match with a GEK and hella damage mods. (Usually after being insta-popped by him a couple times.)
On the other side of the equation, it's kind of flattering when the enemy team has to make a specific effort to take you out. I went on a non-upgraded (besides Weaponry V) laser rampage the other day, and suddenly found myself facing a whole team of snipers standing just outside of my range. |
gbghg
L.O.T.I.S.
Legacy Rising
371
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Posted - 2013.01.31 18:45:00 -
[5] - Quote
as a logi player i tend to focus on enemy logi's when i can, because if i kill them i can prevent them from supporting their team effectively, remember the DPS guy is useless without ammo or armour |
Scheneighnay McBob
Bojo's School of the Trades
1058
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Posted - 2013.01.31 22:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
The rule does not apply here. Traditionally in MMOs, the tank is guarding the **** out of the healer. Here, healers only have their own stats and wits to protect them. |
Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors
183
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Posted - 2013.02.01 00:15:00 -
[7] - Quote
I disagree, I think the analog for the tank is more like vehicles while the analog for DPS is the heavy. |
Jackof All-Trades
Bojo's School of the Trades
78
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Posted - 2013.02.01 11:11:00 -
[8] - Quote
Take out the one doing the most damage; however what the damage may be is relative. Getting hacked a lot? Shot a lot? Sniped a lot? The key to any game, and many things in life in fact, is thinking on your feet. Making decisions. Which is the largest thread.
I've played many a game where the opposite team just moved as one unit taking bases, never stopping. In this case, their movement needs to be addressed, and a heavy fire fight needs to be encouraged to induce losses. They will be mutual, but tactically, you will be clearing the playing field, and giving neutral advantages to both sides, allowing you to try and make your move.
It's just chess really. I suck at chess, but you know what I mean. |
Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors
183
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Posted - 2013.02.01 14:13:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jackof All-Trades wrote:Take out the one doing the most damage; however what the damage may be is relative. Getting hacked a lot? Shot a lot? Sniped a lot? The key to any game, and many things in life in fact, is thinking on your feet. Making decisions. Which is the largest thread.
I've played many a game where the opposite team just moved as one unit taking bases, never stopping. In this case, their movement needs to be addressed, and a heavy fire fight needs to be encouraged to induce losses. They will be mutual, but tactically, you will be clearing the playing field, and giving neutral advantages to both sides, allowing you to try and make your move.
It's just chess really. I suck at chess, but you know what I mean.
I think this is a great point. Analyzing what is the biggest threat is more important than just lining up kills or shooting the closest red.
One example I've found are the skim junction maps with the base with only the 3 road entrances. You can very easily prevent LAV rushes (one of the biggest threats) with proximity mines. This forces them either to sneak in through an infantry entrance, drop in via dropship, or force their way through with a tank or by foot enmasse. |
0 Try Harder
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
RISE of LEGION
114
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Posted - 2013.02.01 20:05:00 -
[10] - Quote
Beren Hurin wrote:So watching some of these youtubes such as this where there are guys just trouncing the map with hardhitting (and expensive) guns....I'm wondering if the law of many MMOs apply: try to take down the hard hitting DPS first.
ugh. If you want to be good at FPS games, look at FPS games. I guess if you want to get some kills you can run around like a n00b forge sniping or a LOLREDLINESNIPER (yes, my alt is 101Duck Hunt D0G, and if you have a KDR less than 100-1 and you're a redline sniper, you are TERRIBLE!)
Anyways, for good team play, go watch some FPS vids! Quake Live has some good action, but personally I was more of an Unreal Tournament kind of guy over Quake. I don't think there's any great UT3 tournament movies, for a number of reasons, but it wasn't a hugely played game. IMO the biggest was because COD4: MWF came out at the same time, but it did separate itself from older UTs (like not in grand championship, slower weapon swap than UT2003, etc, etc). I mentioning UT because this game runs on UE3 (not id tech's used in COD games), and the UT style of play can easily be transferred to this game.
In terms of team tactics, you need to get familiar by playing all the time with certain people. ie. play with people in your corp. You'll want to play with many in your corp so you can play with anyone, but you're never going to get the team based synergy going without doing it. In terms of what you want to target, there are many things you need to consider. As a general rule you want to neutralize the biggest threat. That might be a mass-drivering logi healing a heavy, a heavy with a forge, swarms on your vehicles, or even just a skilled player who has an advantage over other members on your team.
You also have to take into account the strengths and weaknesses of your own weapons. I love pistols, so I have a pistol-only alt. Pistols do extreme damage if you can hit an opponent in the head within 5-20 meters, but you're just plinking away at their shields and armor at any range greater than that. If I go against a player with an assault rifle, I need to make sure that I'm in the effective range of my pistols to do enough damage. That means I utilize cover, and frequently take a flanking approach. While playing with a squad, I let the AR users in my squad engage the enemy at a distance while I move to a better position. In terms of who I kill first, it usually depends on who is closest.
However, there are a number of things that I and others do for squad-based play. If my squad mate is low on hp/shields and I'm full, I might step into the enemy's line of fire and bullet shield for a bit so he can get his HP up. Same thing for reload. You'll also want to play off of your strengths and weaknesses. Heavy's are a big threat, but if there's a HMG at range and I'm on pistol while my squad mate has an AR, I'll focus on closer targets (if there are any), or provide covering fire/support (reps, ammo, positioning, etc etc) while he focuses his fire on the heavy.
If you want to think about it in terms of DPS, in MMOs the highest DPS is the person with the highest potential DPS, but in FPS games you usually target the person who is doing the most damage at that moment. For instance if there's a high priority target and a low priority target, I will focus on the high priority target first. However, if the low priority target is shooting at my squad mate, the low priority target becomes the high priority target because he has the highest current DPS. Certain weapons have different damages at different ranges and against different targets. Laser against shield at range is awesome, but a laser against an AR user at close range is fail. Damage types are important too. Lasers do less damage to armor than they do to shield, and explosive damage like mass drivers do additional damage to armor, and slightly less to shield.
You have to understand that in almost all FPS games, everyone is equal. Everyone has access to the same weapons, armor, shields, etc. etc., so the target priority is almost 100% situational.
hope that helps. There's so much more, but I took a break halfway through this post and forgot what I posted earlier. lol.
edit: I found this quick video of Quake Live on youtube. Idk how great it is, but it does show some nice flanking, team covering, target prioritization and ambushing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmHd9ZltDfI |
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0 Try Harder
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
RISE of LEGION
114
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Posted - 2013.02.01 20:13:00 -
[11] - Quote
This should also explain why I dislike shotgun noobs so much too. They are a no-skill weapon of chance. EVERYTHING that the shotgun noobs claim they need skill for can be applied to almost every other weapon. The range of a shotgun makes them so situational, they are almost useless in corp battles. Shotgun noobs apparently think "skill" means hoping someone spawns in front of you in ambush, or walks around the wrong corner.
I'm not butthurt about shotguns, but I am annoyed that people think it requires any skill at all @.@ I'm 100% fine with CCP leaving shotguns as-is because I don't see them as a threat in corp battles. They do have a use in corp battles, imo they are great at taking out close AV if you operate a vehicle, but beyond that... lol.
edit: I was loling at one of the "best" shotgun noobs in one of the pub matches I did the other day. All the guy on my team did was just move back and forth between three choke points. If you're good, you'll attempt to limit the number of ways an enemy can attack you from. All this shotgun noob was run back and forth hoping that there was an opening. Had he had any other weapon, even a pistol, he could at least have given his teammates a little covering fire. |
0 Try Harder
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
RISE of LEGION
114
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Posted - 2013.02.01 21:10:00 -
[12] - Quote
Oops, I finished reading the rest of your post lol.
Beren Hurin wrote:a lot of people seem to switch to sniper once you are camped. Which really prevents a push forward. You can't really advance with snipers.
Sometimes it's best to let the people who are going for kills farm them. Just make sure you don't get cloned. I like to make people in expensive gear waste it, but that's more of a personal preference. Some of the players using a ton of AUR gear are so terrible that you're better off killing a random day-one militia blue dot, but it's more fun to make the other guy lose real $. |
gbghg
L.O.T.I.S.
Legacy Rising
371
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Posted - 2013.02.01 21:22:00 -
[13] - Quote
As the people above have said one of the most important things to do in any battle is to make sure the right weapons are being used for the right jobs, for example if you need to clear out a CQ area make sure sure a heavy with a HMG is leading because that's where their weapon is most effective. AR's are always going to be the backbone of any force simply because they're so versatile and do well in pretty much any situation. However when you get to weapons like the LR that have minimum ranges as well it becomes a balancing act at making sure you're close enough to do decent damage while far enough away not to lose that damage, as someone who uses a logi/laser combo if i get trapped in CQ I'm dead. one of the best LR tactics you can use in on the map "line harvest" get 1-2 guys with LR up on the central platform and you can lock down entire sections of the map. |
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