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Cyn Bruin
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
653
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 14:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
So after reading Potato's thread here... https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=54680&p=1
I wanted to come up with a list of a things the New Blue Dots could do better. I played 15-20 or so Skirmish games last night and noticed alot of the basics lacking. In no particular order:
1. BATTLE AWARENESS, HAVE IT. By this I mean, when you are running away from an objective and that objective starts getting hacked, PLEASE turn around and shoot the guy hacking it. It A) is an easy kill for you and B) will help the further team goal. Also please be aware of where the enemy is, seen plenty of blues run right by a red without stopping.
2. DON'T STAND IN THE OPEN. This goes mainly for you snipers, although i did see a bunch of AR guys doing the same thing. Idk how many of you guys I killed sitting in the middle of the road/open area focused intently on sniping people. Get to cover, use it.
3. IF YOU'RE AT AN OBJECTIVE, HACK IT. I saw at least 4 people standing around an objective when it was still red. No red dots anywhere around and they are just standing there. Where they waiting to farm people? Maybe, but someone should tell them they don't spawn right on the point, just in an area around it. HACK THE OBJECTIVE.
4. WAIT FOR A REZ. Noticed alot of people releasing way to soon when they die. Look for the "Standby - Triage in the Area" at top of screen and see if someone picks you up, especially after a mass push. Even if you don't get picked up and bleed out, your spawn timer will reflect that and it'll only take 2-3secs to spawn in. This will also help in clone count, which are how alot more battles seem to be lost.
5. DONT BE RAMBO. This is a big one. I am breaking this one while soloing, but I try not to put myself in unwinnabel situations. Don't think you can take that objective yourself. This is a squad based game, go as a squad. Nothing reminds me more of this than killing 2 people and starting to hack an objective only to get shot in the back because I don't have a wingman with me.
6. MASS PUSH OBJECTIVES. This fits with the Rambo thing. Go as a a big group to take objectives. You will usually have covering fire from team members, get better firing angles and are not the only one they are shooting at.
7. TEAM FIRE, PROTECT TEAMMATES. If there are 2-4 of you running around together, team fire the same person, don't all take different people. If someone is shooting your teammate, shoot them back. Don't run off after the shiny red supply depot.
8. KNOW YOUR CLASS AND HAVE A PLAN. When you spawn in, have plan of what you want to do in the first 2 mins of the battle. Example: I always spawn in my scout shotgun fit and run drop an uplink close around objectives. This way I know its a safe spawn pt and is usually close enough to influence an objective when I spawn on it. Make sure you know your class well, what can a Logi do, more armor heavies wear slower they are etc.
All I can think of now. The main one that irritated me last night was watching the blues mill around an unhacked objective when we were losing the MCC battle. Hack that mutha. If I think of or witness more I'll edit.
EDIT ---> Not a BASH list, hopefully a list that will help new guys understand a few basics. |
Yagihige
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
177
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:00:00 -
[2] - Quote
Equip an armor repair mod. Seriously, every since open beta i keep seeing people with their armor almost completely depleted and only have their shields protecting them. |
Cyn Bruin
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
653
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:04:00 -
[3] - Quote
Yagihige wrote:Equip an armor repair mod. Seriously, every since open beta i keep seeing people with their armor almost completely depleted and only have their shields protecting them.
Sometimes it's smarter to NOT run one. Whether due to CPU or PG or just the fact a more useful module could be used in it. I used to swear by the armor repair mods, not so much anymore.
|
Razekial Flameclaw
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
19
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:06:00 -
[4] - Quote
+1 i second most of your points but #4 is a doozy the amount of times i see someone go down and i run over only to see them release - its rather annoying and more importantly quite dangerous for a logi to pick you up.
additionally when you do get picked up MOVE dont just stand there waiting for me to heal you get to cover and i'll heal you i dont like being out in the open either! |
General Tiberius1
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
206
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:07:00 -
[5] - Quote
common sense thread, WOOHOO!!! |
Yagihige
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
177
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
Cyn Bruin wrote:Yagihige wrote:Equip an armor repair mod. Seriously, every since open beta i keep seeing people with their armor almost completely depleted and only have their shields protecting them. Sometimes it's smarter to NOT run one. Whether due to CPU or PG or just the fact a more useful module could be used in it. I used to swear by the armor repair mods, not so much anymore.
Sure, if it's something you put some thought on, you can build your fittings however it pleases you but it's not the case with the people i'm seeing. They just don't have a clue about it. These are the people with 140/175hp that most likely haven't upgraded any skill nor installed any mod. They're oblivious to the fact that they're not getting that armor back up and they become even easier prey.
For these people, before they even evolve to building their fittings without it, they first need to learn how to build it with it.
|
General Tiberius1
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
206
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:12:00 -
[7] - Quote
Cyn Bruin wrote:So after reading Potato's thread here... https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=54680&p=1 I wanted to come up with a list of a things the New Blue Dots could do better. I played 15-20 or so Skirmish games last night and noticed alot of the basics lacking. In no particular order: 1. BATTLE AWARENESS, HAVE IT. By this I mean, when you are running away from an objective and that objective starts getting hacked, PLEASE turn around and shoot the guy hacking it. It A) is an easy kill for you and B) will help the further team goal. Also please be aware of where the enemy is, seen plenty of blues run right by a red without stopping. 2. DON'T STAND IN THE OPEN. This goes mainly for you snipers, although i did see a bunch of AR guys doing the same thing. Idk how many of you guys I killed sitting in the middle of the road/open area focused intently on sniping people. Get to cover, use it. 3. IF YOU'RE AT AN OBJECTIVE, HACK IT. I saw at least 4 people standing around an objective when it was still red. No red dots anywhere around and they are just standing there. Where they waiting to farm people? Maybe, but someone should tell them they don't spawn right on the point, just in an area around it. HACK THE OBJECTIVE. 4. WAIT FOR A REZ. Noticed alot of people releasing way to soon when they die. Look for the "Standby - Triage in the Area" at top of screen and see if someone picks you up, especially after a mass push. Even if you don't get picked up and bleed out, your spawn timer will reflect that and it'll only take 2-3secs to spawn in. This will also help in clone count, which are how alot more battles seem to be lost. 5. DONT BE RAMBO. This is a big one. I am breaking this one while soloing, but I try not to put myself in unwinnabel situations. Don't think you can take that objective yourself. This is a squad based game, go as a squad. Nothing reminds me more of this than killing 2 people and starting to hack an objective only to get shot in the back because I don't have a wingman with me. 6. MASS PUSH OBJECTIVES. This fits with the Rambo thing. Go as a a big group to take objectives. You will usually have covering fire from team members, get better firing angles and are not the only one they are shooting at. 7. TEAM FIRE, PROTECT TEAMMATES. If there are 2-4 of you running around together, team fire the same person, don't all take different people. If someone is shooting your teammate, shoot them back. Don't run off after the shiny red supply depot. 8. KNOW YOUR CLASS AND HAVE A PLAN. When you spawn in, have plan of what you want to do in the first 2 mins of the battle. Example: I always spawn in my scout shotgun fit and run drop an uplink close around objectives. This way I know its a safe spawn pt and is usually close enough to influence an objective when I spawn on it. Make sure you know your class well, what can a Logi do, more armor heavies wear slower they are etc. All I can think of now. The main one that irritated me last night was watching the blues mill around an unhacked objective when we were losing the MCC battle. Hack that mutha. If I think of or witness more I'll edit. EDIT ---> Not a BASH list, hopefully a list that will help new guys understand a few basics.
note: if you try doing this stuff in public matches, odds are, you're gonna get pissed, as you will die...a lot! and not really achieve anything. have tried follow my squad mates in pub matches, they go every which way but to the objectives.(i assume they are looking for people to kill, completly ignoring the objective in skirmish-to blow the othe MCC up!) |
Yagihige
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
177
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
General Tiberius1 wrote:common sense thread, WOOHOO!!!
Lol, you reminded me of someone now.
|
Vaerana Myshtana
ScIdama Endless Renaissance
203
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:15:00 -
[9] - Quote
Very good points!!! Thank you!
I think the Rambo point is one of the most important in terms of why people think the game is unbalanced. The game is not designed around the same run-up-and-shoot mechanic as some other FPS games. There is a very important RPS (Rock-Paper-Scissors) element to the game.
If you want to do solo work, fit out a Shotgun Scout and learn to hide Drop Uplinks behind enemy lines. Of course, learning to sneak by lowering scan profile, moving (not sprinting), and using cover is an important part of that. Otherwise, stick with other teammates and support them.
This is why I keep saying that people should try being a Logi (repper) before trying other "classes" of the game. It is all about sticking with the team. Even if your goal is to be a sniper or a front line heavy or something, you can fit out a cheap Logistics suit with a Nanoinjector and a Repair Tool and play that for a few days. |
Braxxis Fonsworth
Quantum Kittens Syndicate
3
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
OP can't be said enough. Good Job. |
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Cyn Bruin
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
653
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:17:00 -
[11] - Quote
Yagihige wrote:Cyn Bruin wrote:Yagihige wrote:Equip an armor repair mod. Seriously, every since open beta i keep seeing people with their armor almost completely depleted and only have their shields protecting them. Sometimes it's smarter to NOT run one. Whether due to CPU or PG or just the fact a more useful module could be used in it. I used to swear by the armor repair mods, not so much anymore. Sure, if it's something you put some thought on, you can build your fittings however it pleases you but it's not the case with the people i'm seeing. They just don't have a clue about it. These are the people with 140/175hp that most likely haven't upgraded any skill nor installed any mod. They're oblivious to the fact that they're not getting that armor back up and they become even easier prey. For these people, before they even evolve to building their fittings without it, they first need to learn how to build it with it.
9. YOU CAN REPAIR YOUR ARMOR AT SUPPLY DEPOT. Lets say you are running your Sniper fit and you have 20 armor left out of 90. If you switch your fit to something other than scout (assault, heavy, logi basic) at the supply depot, it will auto rep your armor to full. You can then switch back to the sniper fit with full armor.
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Pure Healthy
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
26
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:28:00 -
[12] - Quote
It's nice to see the basics reenforced like this. Sadly, even though this is standard fair for many team based shooters, games like COD have dumbed the FPS into a easily absorbed little package that caters to even the most shitbrained console player. |
Guinevere Bravo
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
140
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
Aim for the head when the cherries are in armour, Unless its a heavy it should be a 1 shot kill (of very close to it.) |
Cyn Bruin
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
653
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:39:00 -
[14] - Quote
Pure Healthy wrote:It's nice to see the basics reenforced like this. Sadly, even though this is standard fair for many team based shooters, games like COD have dumbed the FPS into a easily absorbed little package that caters to even the most shitbrained console player.
I used to be like this. I had and still have a little bit of the Rambo mentality. It's hard for me to NOT be aggressive. I like to constantly push the line, but in a game like this, knowing WHEN to push the line is the most important feature. I still take alot of dumb F'ing deaths, but trying to learn from each one.
As one of my corp mates said, holding and defending 2 points is not a bad thing unless its a 5pt map. |
Blind Nojoy
G I A N T
14
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 16:04:00 -
[15] - Quote
Great post Cyn. For those new heavies out there, it's especially important to not try and solo. Especially in those crappy militia armor suits. Cover is your best friend. Here's some other tips for new heavies.
Start getting into the following skills: work on getting into shield control as soon as you can. This will increase your suit (and vehicle!) max armor by 5% each level.
Work on your field mechanics as well. This will increase your armor by 5% each level.
Get out if the militia drop suit as soon as you can. The Type 2 is a good goal, it's only a standard but its very nice. I'm stopping at the type 2 for now, since they may come out with other race suits that may be better than amar for a heavy. Plus, getting into the b series with the current skill cap will probably take about 10 days.
Focus on survivability, not lethality. A heavy should expect to defend points, not run across the map chasing assault suits then get sniped. I don't run a damage mod, I use double shield extenders. I let the kills come to me, at close quarters, while defending an objective (in most cases).
That said, once your survivability is improved, start working on weaponry skills. Heavy weapon sharpshooter is a good place to start. Once you get that to level 3 plus, you can start hitting guys from admittedly rediculous ranges with a chain gun, but that's another QQ all together.
Hopefully this will help some new heavies. See you guys out there. |
Drado Arona
Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State
64
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 16:11:00 -
[16] - Quote
Razekial Flameclaw wrote:+1 i second most of your points but #4 is a doozy the amount of times i see someone go down and i run over only to see them release - its rather annoying and more importantly quite dangerous for a logi to pick you up.
additionally when you do get picked up MOVE dont just stand there waiting for me to heal you get to cover and i'll heal you i dont like being out in the open either! Hey look, someone already posted my life story as a logi! |
Cyn Bruin
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
653
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 17:13:00 -
[17] - Quote
10. CHECK TO SEE IF YOU'RE SQUAD LEADER.
When you are in the MCC waiting to go into battle, check and see if you are the squad leader. If so, make sure to set commands when you enter the game. A lazy tip, set the Defend Order on a GREEN dot, Green means they are in your squad and you will get warpoints for their actions.
11. KNOW HOW TO SET SQUAD ORDERS.
If you are a squad leader and want to set orders, hold R2 down, hit R3 it will bring up choices. Pick DEFEND, it will then want you to target something to put the order on. Choose a person that is GREEN to you (means they are in squad) and hit R1. This should put a moving circle around the chosen person. Anyone in squad in vicinity of the Defend Order that does actions that give warpoints, will give extra warpoints to you (squad leader).
12. KNOW HOW TO USE AN ORBITAL STRIKE (OB).
If youve mastered the squad commands and gain enough warpoints as a squad, you will earn an OB. It is hard to tell when you get them now, the text is in upper right hand corner of the screen when it announces you have one. To place the OB, its just like calling in a vehicle. Hit the RB (right button) on the movement pad, choose Off Map Assets, Orbital Strike. The map will then come up and you can choose on the map where to place it. If you have trouble seeing any red dots, hit R2 to zoom in a bit on map and look for scurrying ants, easy to see opposing players when you look for them. Hit X on spot you want it on. Done.
Let me know if any questions about the above, it is somewhat convoluted (both my sentence structure and the process).
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Cyn Bruin
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
653
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 18:01:00 -
[18] - Quote
13. GRENADE TIP
Since they fixed the short fuse on the grenades, they are easier to avoid. When in a firefight, if the guy goes through the greande throwing animation. Walk forward into the person that through it (preferably still firing). If you go forward into him it will close distance to your real target and make distance from the grenade. I always see people going backward from grenades, this usually gets you killed as you are walking into the radius, not away from it.
14. MAKE AN UPLINK CLASS
I mentioned this earlier when spawning in... Make sure you have at least one fast moving class that can drop uplinks. You don't necessarily have to spawn in as this class. But if you take a supply depot, take 1 min to switch classes, place a drop uplink in a secluded/secure spot, then got back and switch suits. This way when you or your squad mates die they can spawn on this spot an be instantly back in the battle.
|
G Torq
ALTA B2O
88
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 20:18:00 -
[19] - Quote
General Tiberius1 wrote:Cyn Bruin wrote:3. IF YOU'RE AT AN OBJECTIVE, HACK IT. I saw at least 4 people standing around an objective when it was still red. No red dots anywhere around and they are just standing there. Where they waiting to farm people? Maybe, but someone should tell them they don't spawn right on the point, just in an area around it. HACK THE OBJECTIVE. have tried follow my squad mates in pub matches, they go every which way but to the objectives.(i assume they are looking for people to kill, completly ignoring the objective in skirmish-to blow the othe MCC up!)
No, lots of newberries trying to blow up the MCC ... |
Gemini Cuspid
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 20:33:00 -
[20] - Quote
Just my 2~cents, but sometimes being at an objective and hacking it isn't always a good idea just because "you're there". There are a few cases where in skirmish if I am solo I end up hacking the blaster installation before the lettered objective next to it or the clone just because those are faster to hack versus a lettered objective; once you do hack those letters it's a big giant flag to "plz kill me" so I prefer to be smart about what I hack.
Also sometimes you find out someone left a remote explosive and stuck either revealing your position to destroy it or taking something else that's more meaningful until you can take care of it.
The point raised on armor repairers are a mix; you can't always have a supply depot and the counter side is that repairers do take a while. I have yet to try nanohives as a replacement but it also depends on the suit as well; some scouts may prefer to add stamina/speed modules and some heavies who run in corps have someone with remote repairs so they can replace those slots with armor plates. It really comes down to your playstyle and comfort. If you find yourself more solo than with a ccorp/team, I'd go with the repairer. If you have the right backup and team, it's not as needed.
As for that point on rez, it's a battle experience versus getting used to it. I'm pretty sure I've pissed off players but if I see two heavies approaching and you're going to rez me as shield fodder, I'm probably going to die anyway so I'd rather die once thank you. Most of the time players are good about doing a rez when it's clear and I won't get shot down but I do notice experienced players do what I do: if I see you're going to rez someone I will take that time to simply reload and kill them again since it's only a few shots. |
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Cyn Bruin
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
653
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 20:47:00 -
[21] - Quote
Gemini Cuspid wrote:Just my 2~cents, but sometimes being at an objective and hacking it isn't always a good idea just because "you're there". There are a few cases where in skirmish if I am solo I end up hacking the blaster installation before the lettered objective next to it or the clone just because those are faster to hack versus a lettered objective; once you do hack those letters it's a big giant flag to "plz kill me" so I prefer to be smart about what I hack.
Very good point.
I usually skip the objective until last. If you can "turn" the CRU so troops can spawn there without the enemy noticing its a tactical advantage and could easily turn the tide. I make sure to hack anything surrounding the objective first in case I need to use them. (guns, supply depots, crus).
15. MAKE SURE TO LOOK AT MAP BEFORE SPAWNING IN
When I die I make sure to look at the overall picture of the map before I spawn in. Where can I make the biggest difference? You can see enemy players running around on the map if you look closely (like small dots moving on map). Is there an objective with noone around it I can spawn near and acquire? Do I see 2-3 running toward an unprotected objective I could spawn there and protect it? Just make sure to look the map over before spawning in and if you cant decide where to go, spawn next to the closest group of people and go from there. |
Soght Toi
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
14
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 20:47:00 -
[22] - Quote
Blind Nojoy wrote:Great post Cyn. For those new heavies out there, it's especially important to not try and solo. Especially in those crappy militia armor suits. Cover is your best friend. Here's some other tips for new heavies.
Start getting into the following skills: work on getting into shield control as soon as you can. This will increase your suit (and vehicle!) max armor by 5% each level.
Work on your field mechanics as well. This will increase your armor by 5% each level.
Get out if the militia drop suit as soon as you can. The Type 2 is a good goal, it's only a standard but its very nice. I'm stopping at the type 2 for now, since they may come out with other race suits that may be better than amar for a heavy. Plus, getting into the b series with the current skill cap will probably take about 10 days.
Focus on survivability, not lethality. A heavy should expect to defend points, not run across the map chasing assault suits then get sniped. I don't run a damage mod, I use double shield extenders. I let the kills come to me, at close quarters, while defending an objective (in most cases).
That said, once your survivability is improved, start working on weaponry skills. Heavy weapon sharpshooter is a good place to start. Once you get that to level 3 plus, you can start hitting guys from admittedly rediculous ranges with a chain gun, but that's another QQ all together.
Hopefully this will help some new heavies. See you guys out there.
Dude thanks! I was really starting to lose faith in my ability to play as a heavy but you showed me exactly what I was doing wrong! I ran after people, trying to aggro them and mow them down with my unreasonably powerful gun when I should've been defending and holding the line for the guys with the AR's and Sniper Rifles to pick them off while I sprayed! |
56 truth
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
73
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 21:04:00 -
[23] - Quote
know when to swich gears and use the map
it perttty much says it all if you see a drop ship or a tank on the map pick the right dropsuit you can view it (the map)by pressing down on the d pad or when you spawn you can also use squad orders this way if you are the squad leader, also you can swich out dropsuits at the sd also use the edge's of the map and pick them off |
56 truth
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
73
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 01:27:00 -
[24] - Quote
*drop kick* |
Mofo Mankey
SIK NATION RISE of LEGION
5
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 02:12:00 -
[25] - Quote
Battle awareness. Is it something you can buy? |
KripnawtiQ Prime
L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising
207
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 02:56:00 -
[26] - Quote
This is a great thread. Id just like to add buy a mic (or turn yours on). If you don't have one turn on the Multi-Out in your PS3 sound settin so that you can at least hear what others are saying. The influx of newer players hs really turned Skirmish into a frustration. Voice would at least help. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 02:59:00 -
[27] - Quote
KripnawtiQ Prime wrote:This is a great thread. Id just like to add buy a mic (or turn yours on). If you don't have one turn on the Multi-Out in your PS3 sound settin so that you can at least hear what others are saying. The influx of newer players hs really turned Skirmish into a frustration. Voice would at least help. It would also help a LOT to turn voice on - even without a mic.
A lot of people haven't even got that far yet. |
Mordecai Snake
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 04:21:00 -
[28] - Quote
KripnawtiQ Prime wrote:This is a great thread. Id just like to add buy a mic (or turn yours on). If you don't have one turn on the Multi-Out in your PS3 sound settin so that you can at least hear what others are saying. The influx of newer players hs really turned Skirmish into a frustration. Voice would at least help. There needs to be a better team chat window, the current one is pretty much useless; If it was combined with the death message window like it is in pc games, then it would be easier to communicate and work as a team without using mics. |
Returner Tekki
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
24
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 04:32:00 -
[29] - Quote
Also when a new player is riding in a dropship on a turret don't fire at NPC gun installations. As a dropship pilot I will thank you. |
Mars El'Theran
Red Rogue Squadron Heart 0f Darkness
52
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 05:23:00 -
[30] - Quote
I'm not sure if anyone has said this already, (I didn't read the whole thread obviously), but it is not a "class," it is a role. You are not stuck with it, and you can change roles easily provided you have even a modicum of SP somewhere else. |
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