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Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 12:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
Scroll down to the bottom of the post for the TL;DR version.
Right, so. To be brief, I want to get this out on the board real fast. I enjoy the hell out of Dust 514. I love it to death. I've been playing Eve Online since 2005 and I actually enjoy Dust 514 more than I do Eve Online.
However. I've run into sort of a predicament that... I honestly don't know the answer to.
Once I hit my daily SP cap and ensure that I'm on the same level as my peers, the battles become solely for the ISK and assets. Sure, officer gear is fun but it's not something I'm going to spend countless hours grinding away for.
Now, as an Eve player, ISK is no issue. I can fund entire armies. Hell, I can hire two or more corporations to fight solely for my own pleasure - in fact, I already have when I recently pitted two major Dust corporations against one another and tossed them a few million ISK BECAUSE I CAN.
Arrogance aside... I know for a fact that one day all of these Dust mercs are going to be filthy frakking rich. They're going to run into the same predicament that I'm facing. What are we fighting for..?
This is already an issue for me because I can just throw ISK at any problem I face. I hit the daily cap and thats... pretty much it. I can pour ISK down like a waterfall and afford all of the prototype gear I can honestly lose and still come out with a profit and I know one day, all of you are going to have that very same issue.
So... What are we fighting for..? Territory is nice, but it's not implemented yet. Not sure when it's going to be implemented, honestly. In Eve Online there's a billion things to do, if I'm tired of running missions and killing NPCs I'll go corner the market on Oxygen. If I'm tired of that I can go try my luck with pirate/bounty hunting. Tired of that I can set up planetary colonization and any other endless list of things because there's just that much to do in Eve Online.
Aside from instant matchmaking, fights for sovereignty/faction warfare and the PvE element of fighting Rogue Drones - what else is there to do? Maybe I'm overlooking something...
TL;DR Version - Have more ISK than I know what to do with and hit the SP cap. Other than FW/fighting Rogue Drones, what else is there to do? |
Captain-Awesome
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
349
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 12:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
we need to wait on CCP to start implementing new features.The last build was to implement a lot of features, current for bug fixes, next? well there are already threads asking about that.
I think now CCP has improved on functionality and performance, the next should be content.
More levels, implement the scrambler riffle and other weapons coming into play, better accessibility, faction warfare, queue sync, training grounds etc....
atm it is very linear - get in a match, shoot. Rinse repeat. Even though it's been nearly a year, there's still no reason to winning other than leader boards.... and nobody cares about that stat.
I do however understand that the first year was a roll out of core functionality and these were major updates, we are still a long way from being "Stable". I would like to see new content next patch - what it is I don't mind, but give the matches meaning (to the corp or the player) |
Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 12:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
Captain-Awesome wrote:we need to wait on CCP to start implementing new features.The last build was to implement a lot of features, current for bug fixes, next? well there are already threads asking about that.
I think now CCP has improved on functionality and performance, the next should be content.
More levels, implement the scrambler riffle and other weapons coming into play, better accessibility, faction warfare, queue sync, training grounds etc....
atm it is very linear - get in a match, shoot. Rinse repeat. Even though it's been nearly a year, there's still no reason to winning other than leader boards.... and nobody cares about that stat.
I do however understand that the first year was a roll out of core functionality and these were major updates, we are still a long way from being "Stable". I would like to see new content next patch - what it is I don't mind, but give the matches meaning (to the corp or the player)
As much as others would disagree, I would love to see some industry implementation. I have no qualms with using my vast capsuleer resources to become the biggest arms dealer in the galaxy for the Dust Mercs. Hell, I'd even give free samples.
Irrelevant. What we need is something to do - on the side. Industry, exploration; things to add filler to the static that is the constant warfare. The game will get old if we're just constantly fighting and hitting the daily SP cap will just become a job. |
Snaps Tremor
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
41
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 13:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
It makes sense to get the gun game down first, before piling on the cross-game interaction. By doing both at the same time it'll be very hard to pin down what's wrong with the game at any point, and EVE players won't appreciate having to carry a half-baked concept on the back of their own game.
Instead they're trying to make a game that can stand on its own against the others out there today, and only once that is achieved, add real far-reaching consequences that will immediately set it on another level than the endless deathmatch repetition of the most popular FPS games.
I wasn't sure about Dust six months ago, but after Chromosome's surprising jump in quality I think they might just pull it off. |
Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 13:03:00 -
[5] - Quote
Snaps Tremor wrote:It makes sense to get the gun game down first, before piling on the cross-game interaction. By doing both at the same time it'll be very hard to pin down what's wrong with the game at any point, and EVE players won't appreciate having to carry a half-baked concept on the back of their own game.
Instead they're trying to make a game that can stand on its own against the others out there today, and only once that is achieved, add real far-reaching consequences that will immediately set it on another level than the endless deathmatch repetition of the most popular FPS games.
I wasn't sure about Dust six months ago, but after Chromosome's surprising jump in quality I think they might just pull it off.
Yeah, the smoothness and polish is really nice. I was terrified it was going to constantly be that low framerate... monster...
Also, if you've played Eve Online before the Crucible expansion - you'll know that "half-baked concept" and Eve Online were conjoined twins >_>; |
Longshot Ravenwood
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
680
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 13:16:00 -
[6] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:TL;DR Version - Have more ISK than I know what to do with and hit the SP cap. Other than FW/fighting Rogue Drones, what else is there to do?
You have the solo options:
- Buy skill books and plug them in, just because you can.
- Buy militia vehicle parts to assemble and test pilot.
- Squad up in unfamiliar fittings/styles just because.
- Try to do things just because you can (Example: Driving your LAVs backwards at all times while you're driving them; using them to ramp, then bailing out of them to reach rooftops; etc..)
And the social options:
- Found a corporation.
- Save it for upcoming stuff that you think you'll want (for example helping your corp fund a corp battle or defensive installation equipment when it's available).
- While in a corporation that you've joined/founded meet up with other mercs who aren't doing so well on their ISK revenues and speak with your CEO to get them money to help them do any of the above.
- Help with corp recruiting.
- Chat.
|
Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 13:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
Longshot Ravenwood wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:TL;DR Version - Have more ISK than I know what to do with and hit the SP cap. Other than FW/fighting Rogue Drones, what else is there to do? You have the solo options:
- Buy skill books and plug them in, just because you can.
- Buy militia vehicle parts to assemble and test pilot.
- Squad up in unfamiliar fittings/styles just because.
- Try to do things just because you can (Example: Driving your LAVs backwards at all times while you're driving them; using them to ramp, then bailing out of them to reach rooftops; etc..)
And the social options:
- Found a corporation.
- Save it for upcoming stuff that you think you'll want (for example helping your corp fund a corp battle or defensive installation equipment when it's available).
- While in a corporation that you've joined/founded meet up with other mercs who aren't doing so well on their ISK revenues and speak with your CEO to get them money to help them do any of the above.
- Help with corp recruiting.
- Chat.
Lulz. Eve Online virtual chat room =D Now with Merc Spinning |
Arramakaian Eka
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
363
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 13:22:00 -
[8] - Quote
Us FPS vets are entertained for years with mere gunplay (being at it since mid-90s myself). We don't need any more than a (somewhat) intelligent human opponent - melting faces is a reward in itself, not some artificial metric. In fact, I dislike the metagame of most modern FPSs with their money and unlocks and SP, but that's beyond the topic.
One of Dust's stated purposes is that it works as a gateway drug to EVE. The "what else is there to do" comes from opening an EVE account.
Having said that, I'm sure CCP has plans for expanding beyond gunplay. I've heard talk about PvE (eww) which possibly might attract some players. Crafting of gear is another one. But the game needs to fix gunplay before CCP should put any substantial resources into expanding beyond. |
KalOfTheRathi
CowTek
168
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 13:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
What else is there to do?
Nothing.
Hopefully, the Open Beta will enable more features and CCP will gradual include some of their promised features that got Non-Eve players, like myself, to join. Then there will be a different answer available.
Right now. Pretty much, nothing.
I have two characters. It was better with the Weekly SP Cap because after the weekly update there were a lot of battles that I could get my primary up to the cap in a few days. Or close enough, I usually quit when the rewards were too meager. Why bother, wait until next week. Then I would switch to my alt and do it again. The rewards weren't as high because a lot of the higher level players had exited after the SP Cap had hit them like my primary, and it took a little longer to hit the Cap.
Now, I have to grind everyday. On both my characters. Until I get bored and switch to a game that has rewards that are not meager.
Something versus Nothing.
I have been patient. I am becoming less so. |
Guinevere Bravo
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
140
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 13:48:00 -
[10] - Quote
Hit the SP cap? Then grind it out on another character for the day. Three characters x6 matches is around 2 hours without all the restocking and waiting for squads multiply this by 3 and you have over 6 hours a day of productive leveling. During the week if your still hitting 3 caps and have time to spare GO GET SOME SUN. |
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Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 14:48:00 -
[11] - Quote
Guinevere Bravo wrote:Hit the SP cap? Then grind it out on another character for the day. Three characters x6 matches is around 2 hours without all the restocking and waiting for squads multiply this by 3 and you have over 6 hours a day of productive leveling. During the week if your still hitting 3 caps and have time to spare GO GET SOME SUN.
I have one character so this doesn't really apply to me... However, I'd like to enjoy the game in my spare time when I have more than two hours.
Also - I'm conveniently blessed with the life of a musician O_o I don't need sun xD |
Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 14:49:00 -
[12] - Quote
KalOfTheRathi wrote:What else is there to do?
Nothing.
Hopefully, the Open Beta will enable more features and CCP will gradual include some of their promised features that got Non-Eve players, like myself, to join. Then there will be a different answer available.
Right now. Pretty much, nothing.
I have two characters. It was better with the Weekly SP Cap because after the weekly update there were a lot of battles that I could get my primary up to the cap in a few days. Or close enough, I usually quit when the rewards were too meager. Why bother, wait until next week. Then I would switch to my alt and do it again. The rewards weren't as high because a lot of the higher level players had exited after the SP Cap had hit them like my primary, and it took a little longer to hit the Cap.
Now, I have to grind everyday. On both my characters. Until I get bored and switch to a game that has rewards that are not meager.
Something versus Nothing.
I have been patient. I am becoming less so.
It is in open beta and they're connecting it to a pre-existing game.. It's one of those things where I'll say, "Hey bud, we've already got a randomization generator that affects time of day/terrain texture(s)/buildings on a map to go along with our pretty brutal gun game" so they've come a long way.. I'm just curious as to what else there will be to do after the Rogue Drones thing comes out - what they have planned that isn't just constant shooting. |
BursegSardaukar
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
55
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 17:48:00 -
[13] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Guinevere Bravo wrote:Hit the SP cap? Then grind it out on another character for the day. Three characters x6 matches is around 2 hours without all the restocking and waiting for squads multiply this by 3 and you have over 6 hours a day of productive leveling. During the week if your still hitting 3 caps and have time to spare GO GET SOME SUN. Also - I'm conveniently blessed with the life of a musician
You mean broke? jk ;) |
Skihids
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
968
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 18:01:00 -
[14] - Quote
The "Something Else" that I'm looking for is a force composed of infantry, artillery, Armored core, and Air units under a coordinated command attacking a like force with complex strategy and tactics.
Dust is promising a much deeper FPS experience than a simple four man squad running in circles capturing points, and that is what I'm sticking around for. If it remains nothing but meaningless matches limited to squad tactics it won't be any more interesting than any other FPS out there. |
Aeon Amadi
Maverick Conflict Solutions
1003
|
Posted - 2013.01.14 18:23:00 -
[15] - Quote
Skihids wrote:The "Something Else" that I'm looking for is a force composed of infantry, artillery, Armored core, and Air units under a coordinated command attacking a like force with complex strategy and tactics.
Dust is promising a much deeper FPS experience than a simple four man squad running in circles capturing points, and that is what I'm sticking around for. If it remains nothing but meaningless matches limited to squad tactics it won't be any more interesting than any other FPS out there.
We can hope that all of the maps become interconnected at some point, with much larger player counts, as to provide gameplay mechanics like Artillery.
Who wouldn't want to see a Minmatar Artillery HAV firing over mountains to provide ground support - only to have a fighter craft fly in and annihilate it from the air? |
KalOfTheRathi
CowTek
168
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 05:23:00 -
[16] - Quote
Skihids wrote:The "Something Else" that I'm looking for is a force composed of infantry, artillery, Armored core, and Air units under a coordinated command attacking a like force with complex strategy and tactics.
Dust is promising a much deeper FPS experience than a simple four man squad running in circles capturing points, and that is what I'm sticking around for. If it remains nothing but meaningless matches limited to squad tactics it won't be any more interesting than any other FPS out there. I was looking for a specific post and I am glad I reread this entire thread. Because I found this one from you, Skihids.
The problem I am having now is the rewards are too meager to keep my interest. However I am forced to grind everyday or fall behind. I am mostly doing it barring not feeling well, household things and such. But the reason I even got involved with Dust is what you are talking about. Even the basics of Corp, persistent Squads, finding a pilot or a HAV driver I can be a Gunner for are all much better than most of my experiences with any FPS is my past. Run and gun is how they were described to me and that is what I recall. Not interesting. Dust is interesting in concept. In future concepts.
They have made progress. Not as much as I would like but compared to the first several times I tried it is like night and day. Much better play. Much better graphics. Very much still a Beta but certainly a more polished Beta than the earlier versions left me concerned about. The map generation is progressing well. I was surprised by the weather. Mixed review. It did make finding targets a little more entertaining but the Sun glare was terrible. I have never liked that effect. I know how it is done and it has never impressed me. That is just me though.
I am getting tired of holding an objective by myself. Repeatedly. And getting nothing for it except a kill now and then with a few WP. I will still do it when the situations requires it. Blues never lose the match when I do it successfully which is pretty rewarding by itself. I enjoy the game. I just wish I was getting some consistent rewards past the couple of hours of play for two characters. The RPG side is just painful for me with the cutbacks yet it makes the FPS much more interesting.
Only a week until Open Beta. We will see what happens after that.
Although, the current noobs are driving me batty enough. |
fred orpaul
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
211
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 07:16:00 -
[17] - Quote
Captain-Awesome wrote:we need to wait on CCP to start implementing new features.The last build was to implement a lot of features, current for bug fixes, next? well there are already threads asking about that.
I think now CCP has improved on functionality and performance, the next should be content.
More levels, implement the scrambler riffle and other weapons coming into play, better accessibility, faction warfare, queue sync, training grounds etc....
atm it is very linear - get in a match, shoot. Rinse repeat. Even though it's been nearly a year, there's still no reason to winning other than leader boards.... and nobody cares about that stat.
I do however understand that the first year was a roll out of core functionality and these were major updates, we are still a long way from being "Stable". I would like to see new content next patch - what it is I don't mind, but give the matches meaning (to the corp or the player)
agreed hopefully all of that is coming in open beta with the additional players lending the additional population we need to keep new feature populated, as it stands we can barely keep the content we have full. |
fred orpaul
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
211
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 07:20:00 -
[18] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:KalOfTheRathi wrote:What else is there to do?
Nothing.
Hopefully, the Open Beta will enable more features and CCP will gradual include some of their promised features that got Non-Eve players, like myself, to join. Then there will be a different answer available.
Right now. Pretty much, nothing.
I have two characters. It was better with the Weekly SP Cap because after the weekly update there were a lot of battles that I could get my primary up to the cap in a few days. Or close enough, I usually quit when the rewards were too meager. Why bother, wait until next week. Then I would switch to my alt and do it again. The rewards weren't as high because a lot of the higher level players had exited after the SP Cap had hit them like my primary, and it took a little longer to hit the Cap.
Now, I have to grind everyday. On both my characters. Until I get bored and switch to a game that has rewards that are not meager.
Something versus Nothing.
I have been patient. I am becoming less so. It is in open beta and they're connecting it to a pre-existing game.. It's one of those things where I'll say, "Hey bud, we've already got a randomization generator that affects time of day/terrain texture(s)/buildings on a map to go along with our pretty brutal gun game" so they've come a long way.. I'm just curious as to what else there will be to do after the Rogue Drones thing comes out - what they have planned that isn't just constant shooting.
don't you mean nadegame?? sorry had to throw that one in there. |
Fivetimes Infinity
Immobile Infantry
1086
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 08:47:00 -
[19] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Aside from instant matchmaking, fights for sovereignty/faction warfare and the PvE element of fighting Rogue Drones - what else is there to do? Maybe I'm overlooking something...
Economic stuff, eventually. Resource harvesting, manufacturing, etc.
But beyond that, what exactly do you think the game would be missing? Instant battles, coop PvE survival, big, organized team fights... that's a fairly broad repertoire. What else should they add?
As for your largely irrelevant discussion about money, they will obviously be adding quite a lot more in the existing categories of suits, weapons, modules and vehicles which cost substantially more. It's just unlikely they'd bother adding such higher-powered items in when balance is still in flux, when many categories of weapon/etc are still vacant, and when corp fights for big money are still pretty clumsy and nascent. |
DJINN Riot
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
20
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 11:32:00 -
[20] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Scroll down to the bottom of the post for the TL;DR version.
Right, so. To be brief, I want to get this out on the board real fast. I enjoy the hell out of Dust 514. I love it to death. I've been playing Eve Online since 2005 and I actually enjoy Dust 514 more than I do Eve Online.
However. I've run into sort of a predicament that... I honestly don't know the answer to.
Once I hit my daily SP cap and ensure that I'm on the same level as my peers, the battles become solely for the ISK and assets. Sure, officer gear is fun but it's not something I'm going to spend countless hours grinding away for.
Now, as an Eve player, ISK is no issue. I can fund entire armies. Hell, I can hire two or more corporations to fight solely for my own pleasure - in fact, I already have when I recently pitted two major Dust corporations against one another and tossed them a few million ISK BECAUSE I CAN.
Arrogance aside... I know for a fact that one day all of these Dust mercs are going to be filthy frakking rich. They're going to run into the same predicament that I'm facing. What are we fighting for..?
This is already an issue for me because I can just throw ISK at any problem I face. I hit the daily cap and thats... pretty much it. I can pour ISK down like a waterfall and afford all of the prototype gear I can honestly lose and still come out with a profit and I know one day, all of you are going to have that very same issue.
So... What are we fighting for..? Territory is nice, but it's not implemented yet. Not sure when it's going to be implemented, honestly. In Eve Online there's a billion things to do, if I'm tired of running missions and killing NPCs I'll go corner the market on Oxygen. If I'm tired of that I can go try my luck with pirate/bounty hunting. Tired of that I can set up planetary colonization and any other endless list of things because there's just that much to do in Eve Online.
Aside from instant matchmaking, fights for sovereignty/faction warfare and the PvE element of fighting Rogue Drones - what else is there to do? Maybe I'm overlooking something...
TL;DR Version - Have more ISK than I know what to do with and hit the SP cap. Other than FW/fighting Rogue Drones, what else is there to do?
The draw for me, is playing with my corp mates. I'll roll through 100 75sp games, just because i enjoy my corp mates, and we have fun, we laugh, we BS, we talk about life etc. That's where the enjoyment comes from for me, it's the only reason I've been able to tolerate this at times buggy game.
I'am pretty sure, it is the same reason people still play eve. There is a lot to do, but at the end of the day, its the people who keep you coming back. |
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