Tarquin Markel
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
85
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Posted - 2013.01.15 07:27:00 -
[1] - Quote
... Hm. I hate to just be the contrarian all the time, but ... no. Don't think so.
Look: I play a scout over 95% of the time. Fast, quiet, and fragile is the name of the game, and there's very little I love so much as a good trap. If I'm doing my job right, you should see me in your sights somewhere between infrequently and never.
I'm at a disadvantage against absolutely everybody in a head-on fight. And you're telling me that what already takes me every grenade I'm carrying landed directly under a target's feet and most of a clip of SMG ammo burned into his freaking HEAD (albeit from 5 meters away, and missing some, but still) should be even more impossible?
(Yes, we're talking about a heavy I killed today.)
No. Just no.
Gear should be a tiebreaker, not a trump. Leaving the heavy and scout out of it for a moment, let's talk assault v. assault. If I decisively outmaneuver you, I see no reason why you should get to just shrug off the rounds from my mere AK-47 equivalent before turning around and burning me down with your scoped, laser-sighted assault rifle of godawfulness.
You should be punctured and bleeding on the floor.
"Prototype" does not mean "game-changing," it means "next generation." One expensive step up the ladder. Every step I take up that ladder with my character means that there are situations I will survive, situations I routinely encounter, that I would not have, and that is iteration enough for me.
Even in Eve, strategy and skill trump gear unless the gear is so ridiculously high-end as to transcend anything and everything we see in DUST. At the moment, Prototype = Arbalest, roughly speaking. There is no T2, and there is no Pirate Faction. Not yet.
I suspect we will, in fact, eventually see someone taking the field with an officer fit Dread Guristas heavy, and God help what stands in its way. As it is, though-- no. Prototype's proportional cost does not entitle you to rule the field like the freaking prince of darkness. |
Tarquin Markel
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
85
|
Posted - 2013.01.15 17:45:00 -
[2] - Quote
James Thraxton wrote:a bit tired, both mentally and physically, so may be a bit redundant
Happens to us all. 
As a side-note, you're declaring victory a bit early.
Quote:in the system i lined out, you would have your own dps and shield increases as well, also, your running as a scout, you should know better that the scout (ie not suited for real combat) is not equipped to handle any enemies in a close to medium range fight, only as a sniper, which is why your given sniper rifles.
Um, dude ... I suck at sniping. I also need a hell of a lot more practice with nova knives (a scout weapon if ever there was one-- speed is essential. Or so I hear; I don't yet have the skillz).
What I'm good at is sneaking into hostile bases without showing up on anybody's sensors and either ambushing the player on guard before hacking the asset, or else quietly hacking the clone facility and getting the strategic asset hacked in the ensuing chaos before booby trapping the hell out of it with remote explosives. Getting spotted means pulling the SMG and zig-zag-spraying like a mad fiend because the odds are inevitably against me in a big way.
That's without your "improvement."
Quote:furthermore, as it is a CCP game, if you're in a fair fight, something's already gone wrong.
Usually for both parties, if neither one has support right there. That's not to say it doesn't happen.
Quote:as for the ambush scenario, no, i shouldn't. it falls on you to have used a better assault kit than the militia. if you used an advanced suit, you'd have probably killed me, but you decided to skimp on isk or didn't have the skills, so your ability was nil.
It has always struck me as a major weakness of any roleplaying game aspiring to any resemblance to reality (D&D gets a pass-- it's trying to be epic, not realistic) if the strong cannot be struck down from ambush.
My "ability" is demonstrated by my capacity to catch you flatfooted, not by my capacity to accumulate points. Accumulating those points just makes it easier-- and that's how it should be. Cunning is the natural enemy of strength.
Dangerous but doable is the sweet spot. Heavies are an exception, but they pay a high price for their defenses. No non-lumbering godlings, please.
Quote:your issue with labeling i also find problems with, as it shows you don't have a full grasp on the concept or comparison of eve to dust. in eve, strategy and skill may trump gear, but ships usually decide quite a lot before all three. prototype gear matches versus prototype gear is equal and fair, and therefore there is no balance issue as both sides have an equal chance. if you're wearing a militia suit instead, since you paid nothing and he paid 500k isk, you will lose, just as how a normal cruiser loses against a T3 "prototype" tengu. the cost and skillpoints spent on the suit does entitle me to "rule the field like a freaking prince of darkness" if everyone else is wearing militia gear. if they spent more and went after me with advanced suits, my chance of survival would be much less.
*sigh*
Good sir, the Tengu is so far above prototype that ... ugh.
Look. Eve started out with only three categories of ships (frigate, cruiser, battleship), no T2, zero battleship rats, and stuff like "prototype gauss" as the top of the technological heap-- non-craftable named items recovered as rare random loot and sold on the market at high, high cost, granting a clear but limited advantage over basic T1.
This should be sounding vaguely familiar.
As a side note, the battleship was the first case of "capital ship proliferation." It was originally so rare that CCP saw nothing wrong with giving torpedoes the ability to shred frigates out of space by the dozens with splash damage. It has its own musical theme on the Eve soundtrack, dedicated to what an awe-inspiring sight a Megathron was supposed to be ("I Saw Your Ship").
That was at the start. That's more or less where we are now (though thankfully the heavies aren't quite battleships. The Marauders might be, though).
DUST's equivalent to the Tengu hasn't been invented yet, and probably won't be for a couple years. Give it room to grow; we'll get there. Meantime, I'd appreciate it if you'd give us level 3 fighters (24 hit points! Yay!) a chance to be something more interesting than chaff.
This much I will grant: militia seems a bit too strong. I don't say that because I resent being killed with it; I don't. Much. I say that because I'm finding it difficult to come up with reasons to lay out the skill points for the first level of non-militia gear, which generally seems to be "better" only in its fitting requirements. That's important for me because I want a full range of fitting options (for a while it was a "sniper rifle; grenades; remote explosives - pick two" situation), but there should be more, even for a front-line assault gunner who hardly ever switches away from the assault rifle.
That rings as something being a little wrong. Militia could use a further ding-- maybe a 10% penalty.
Moving up to prototype, though, I need no encouragement other than the additional fitting slots and resources. Mo flexibility = mo havoc I can wreak on other people's fields of honor. |