DUST Search - So where is the balance?

Caeli SineDeo wrote:

Logi Bro wrote:

Lots of bla bla bla

So you want to go by the numbers

So lets so most people doing well on sp are going to be around 700k sp

To get your standard tank unlocked you have to have spent 380k sp
so 700k- 380k-200k you start out with equals 120k sp left to spend that leaves me short of hybrid turrets which means i have to run militant which only does 89 dps per shot compared to the 115 i can do with a standard scattered blaster. Also you have a extra 4 cpu and 100 pg that the militant blaster requires for fitting. If you choose to put your SP into here you can fit better small turrets but then for go on skills needed to tank better.

gunnlogi CPU 330 PG 1805 Shield HP 2000
sica CPU 310 PG 1805 Shield HP 2600

Oh man you saying I just saved myself 100 PG going into standard blasters and gain tons of damage.

I am going to go with shield tanks because that is what I run but armor is very simular you have a couple options you can buff out your pg cpu skills which is usually needed to fit the better gear. Oh but if you spend your points here you do not have the better gear. You can spend SP into protoing out your shield extenders but oh ya you can not fit them with a militant blaster because it takes up to much PG and well you do not have the PG skills to needed to fit it.

So what does that mean your gunlogi is stuck fitting shield extenders that give 1710 each if you can fit 2 of them with how poor your skills are.
While I can fit extenders that give 2185 per extender plus a blaster that does 33 more damage per shot if you count skills in also

so on my sica I can hit 6370 my sica I use 1 10% mode on and get 6570
on the gunlogi saying a gunlogi gets lucky and can fit 2 1710 extenders he gets 6020 then he is uses 3 10% damage modes which only protect the base hull so he will gain a extra HP because they only give 780 HP for the base 2600 so he has a total of 6800 HP
So that means the gunlogi only has 230 more HP then my sica while I put out almost 28% more damge then he does and he only has 3.5% more health then me.

Looks like Caeli wins again. :)

some more facts for you lvl 3 resist skill on armor and shields cost 217k sp alone not including lvl 1 and 2

lvl 3 shield extenders and armor extenders cost 87k sp alone meaning getting it proto out will cost the remains of your 120k sp
Booster mods are the same

getting standard large blasater turrets you need to spend 156k sp into small first meaning your 120k is not even enough to achieve first lvl of blasters let alone the 75k total needed to get into the standard lvl large scattered blaster.

Remember these results are going to be very simular for for soma/madrugar cases.


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Gunner Visari Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 163	Posted - 2013.01.13 00:16:00 - [1] - Quote Okay AV works great against armor tanks mainly because they have a greater effect on armor and because of their low shielding they can be soloed quite easily. I use a militia shield tank with a few resistance mods and that helps my survivability quite a bit, but once my shield are gone 1-2 AV nades and im gone. Fact are the AV nade do indeed do a ton more damage than ppl realize especially since the only stat we know of is the splash damage which is 150ish but direct damage is way more, if they are on the level of flux nades then that is 1200 for a std nade(there are no militia AV nades), my understanding this was what nades did during the E3 build and even though the descriptions of some of the nades are lower clearly they are doing more damage then we know of. Now with regards swarm a single swarm strike takes out about a 1/4 of my shields on 2000+ shielding and thats with 2 resistance mods on my tank and the fact that swarms have a less than 100% efficiency on shields that is a lot of damage for a starter swarm. The reality is that tanks can be soloed quite easily but on the flip side if there is a good infantry around the tank it can do quite a bit of damage. Personally i find that simply moving around and not staying still is really the best way to keep the survivability of tanks. But ZItro tbf to others i'll say to you what you would probably say to me if i complained about not being able to solo a protobear(which isnt the case anymore) use tactics and dont try to be a god you will fail if you do. In the end there needs to be a better balance b/w tanks and infantry, should require a coordinated effort and though at times i feel like i was soloed it usually happens when i put my tank in the middle of a firefight and in bad spots where it can be nades and forged to death, but if i stay at the periphery of the battle and occasionally move at FULL SPEED through infantry firefight i can crush ppl and do what tanks are meant to which is provide infantry support. So to wrap it up i do agree with some of your points i dont think it is entirely out of balance. It may even be due to the fact that ppl unlock tanks but dont skill into them properly similarly to the way ppl dont skill into infantry properly. If you build it right then it should be pretty resilient i think ppl just unlock a tank, unlock a high level turret and say okay that should be enough, i think the more SP you put into field mech, shield boost, shield control and other things the better the tanks will become just not enough time or SP is put into those, who know maybe im just wrong about that, im going off of what i observe but i dont have all the variables to make an informed decision as to whether it is tanks are too weak or AV is too strong.
Gunner Visari Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 163	Posted - 2013.01.13 00:21:00 - [2] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: arimal lavaren wrote: Just so I'm clear Mr zitro who only a short while told us all to upgrade our gear or quit QQ'ing when we're fairly Rofl stomped is complaining that AV grenades popped his militia tank? Maybe try not calling in the tank on the smallest ambush map we have, I've seen you do it. Because the general answer to your problem is if the tank had proper infantry support those nades would have never gotten close enough. It doesnt really bother me when i lose tank, it bothers me when i lose a tank to one kid and av grenades or militia swarms thats somehow does 4000 while i have a hardener on but how can I level stuff up when I don't have sp? Might want to think that through... Just saying It just might be due to the fact that harndeners and resistances for armor seem to be just straight broke right now. It seems everything that does bonus damage to armor works but anything that helps armor resilience doesnt. It would really help to know if the core function of the items we use are actually working before we make tweaks.
Gunner Visari Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 163	Posted - 2013.01.13 15:22:00 - [3] - Quote Caeli SineDeo wrote: Logi Bro wrote: Lots of bla bla bla So you want to go by the numbers So lets so most people doing well on sp are going to be around 700k sp To get your standard tank unlocked you have to have spent 380k sp so 700k- 380k-200k you start out with equals 120k sp left to spend that leaves me short of hybrid turrets which means i have to run militant which only does 89 dps per shot compared to the 115 i can do with a standard scattered blaster. Also you have a extra 4 cpu and 100 pg that the militant blaster requires for fitting. If you choose to put your SP into here you can fit better small turrets but then for go on skills needed to tank better. gunnlogi CPU 330 PG 1805 Shield HP 2000 sica CPU 310 PG 1805 Shield HP 2600 Oh man you saying I just saved myself 100 PG going into standard blasters and gain tons of damage. I am going to go with shield tanks because that is what I run but armor is very simular you have a couple options you can buff out your pg cpu skills which is usually needed to fit the better gear. Oh but if you spend your points here you do not have the better gear. You can spend SP into protoing out your shield extenders but oh ya you can not fit them with a militant blaster because it takes up to much PG and well you do not have the PG skills to needed to fit it. So what does that mean your gunlogi is stuck fitting shield extenders that give 1710 each if you can fit 2 of them with how poor your skills are. While I can fit extenders that give 2185 per extender plus a blaster that does 33 more damage per shot if you count skills in also so on my sica I can hit 6370 my sica I use 1 10% mode on and get 6570 on the gunlogi saying a gunlogi gets lucky and can fit 2 1710 extenders he gets 6020 then he is uses 3 10% damage modes which only protect the base hull so he will gain a extra HP because they only give 780 HP for the base 2600 so he has a total of 6800 HP So that means the gunlogi only has 230 more HP then my sica while I put out almost 28% more damge then he does and he only has 3.5% more health then me. Looks like Caeli wins again. :) some more facts for you lvl 3 resist skill on armor and shields cost 217k sp alone not including lvl 1 and 2 lvl 3 shield extenders and armor extenders cost 87k sp alone meaning getting it proto out will cost the remains of your 120k sp Booster mods are the same getting standard large blasater turrets you need to spend 156k sp into small first meaning your 120k is not even enough to achieve first lvl of blasters let alone the 75k total needed to get into the standard lvl large scattered blaster. Remember these results are going to be very simular for for soma/madrugar cases. Writing down like its gonna be on the test! what else?