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So where is the balance?

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Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.12 23:47:00 - [1] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Logi Bro wrote: But your proto blaster tank can literally OHK militia and standard infantry it is so powerful. Your proto railgun can OHK infantry with blast-damage. And your proto missile launcher can OHK with blast-damage as well. But proto AV gear can't OHK any kind of tank, militia or otherwise, so I think you HAV drivers have the better side of things. Wrong proto av OHK all kinds of LAVs.... HAVs don't feel like tanks they feel like slow moving death traps waiting to find an ambush Zitro you should know that tanks need infantry support and without it one can easily solo a tank due to its lack of speed/maneuverability. This is the same in real life you rarely see tanks just going in somewhere and get the job done on their own. Not to say it can't but, with decent comms and a little situational awareness a man can easily solo a solo driver with ease. This is all but the same universally through out the game world and reality.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.12 23:50:00 - [2] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Logi Bro wrote: Mr Zitro wrote: Logi Bro wrote: The balance is any tank weapon can one-shot a infantry unit (ok, blasters don't one-shot, but they kill infantry fast, so you get my point) but AV units need to get multiple shots on tanks, which have incredibly bad maneuverability to make up for their power and armor. Yet one guy with av grenades beat a tank.... Hey balance where are you!? You could shoot the guy with the AV grenades...or just drive away from his range. Before he throws 3 av grenades and your tank goes boom??? 8/10 times the tank loses I don't know how it is now since I can't use AVs yet but, before the reset I remember many times I would get a direct hit on a tank with AV nades and not even scratch their shields. This happened to me many of times I just chalked it up to good module load outs.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.12 23:52:00 - [3] - Quote Scheneighnay McBob wrote: What I think is that, to be fair for everyone (and improve it greatly for everyone), all vehicle and AV starter fits should be removed. Keep militia, but there are both too many starter fit LAVs and too many starter fit AVers. If something takes down my methana, at least let it be a standard swarm, instead of a militia BPO swarm. Yes +1. This is one of the best ideas that I have seen yet set around vehic/AV balance.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 00:13:00 - [4] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Goat of Dover wrote: Mr Zitro wrote: Logi Bro wrote: But your proto blaster tank can literally OHK militia and standard infantry it is so powerful. Your proto railgun can OHK infantry with blast-damage. And your proto missile launcher can OHK with blast-damage as well. But proto AV gear can't OHK any kind of tank, militia or otherwise, so I think you HAV drivers have the better side of things. Wrong proto av OHK all kinds of LAVs.... HAVs don't feel like tanks they feel like slow moving death traps waiting to find an ambush Zitro you should know that tanks need infantry support and without it one can easily solo a tank due to its lack of speed/maneuverability. This is the same in real life you rarely see tanks just going in somewhere and get the job done on their own. Not to say it can't but, with decent comms and a little situational awareness a man can easily solo a solo driver with ease. This is all but the same universally through out the game world and reality. You should really know that ambush spawns make it possible for people to spawn right behind a tank and av grenade away but you are so right, I want tanks to solo and win a game... Please tell me more I was not attacking you and never stated that you wanted tanks to be a win button, was just stating that you have been here long enough to know that. Yet your comment was lacking the facts and I posted them. The problem right now is the lack of comms between tankers and their teams and, I mean the whole team not just your squad. If teams could come together in chat a least a little(yes I know some do not have UVTs but, I feel that they should get one. Just my opinion on a different topic) the out comes would be very different for these extremely pricey assets. Yes that is the problem with ambush but this is the situation you put yourself in when bringing a tank into one. On a spawn someone starts off with a serious ambush on you tank. I think the issue there is with spawning not with the balance. You personally take everything that responds to you as a attack, true a lot of people do given the way you responded to my post I can see why. I personally have no issue but, don't appreciate the way you came back and attacked me when there was not any offense on my side. I don't need any post from others saying that this is the way they are thanks.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 00:17:00 - [5] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Goat of Dover wrote: Mr Zitro wrote: Logi Bro wrote: You could shoot the guy with the AV grenades...or just drive away from his range. Before he throws 3 av grenades and your tank goes boom??? 8/10 times the tank loses I don't know how it is now since I can't use AVs yet but, before the reset I remember many times I would get a direct hit on a tank with AV nades and not even scratch their shields. This happened to me many of times I just chalked it up to good module load outs. Cause that was a maxed out tank So the better meta gear is doing better. A guy posted here just a sec ago that a standard locus can kill a militia heavy, so why cant a standard AV stand a chance against a militia tank.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 00:34:00 - [6] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Logi Bro wrote: This is quickly becoming a "classic" thread, so I will try to put this down before it is buried under thousands of argument comments between the AV people and the HAV pilots. You can't be asking for balance before anyone has gotten to standard tanks yet, the AV grenade is a standard piece of equipment, and the tanks in use currently are militia, so it is hardly a comparison. A standard locus grenade can OHK militia heavies, so you should be so lucky that three standard AV grenades will only severely damage your militia tank. Standard av grenades do 1500 damage per nade. Swarms do 1200 per volley and forges do about the same... Yep a little stick doing that much damage is ridiculous IMO True AV nades are a little much there. There real down fall is that they require you to be close to the tank, which most would think is not where you want to be but, in all actuality the is the weakest part of a tank since its turrets cant hit you. This again falls back to support. Why is someone this close to your tank? Why was he not called out and taken out? Given the exception of the ambush spawns and the people who sneaked up on you and deserve to be there. I know that AV nades are easier to get into than tanks way easier but they are not as wide ranged as a tank is. Swarms suck I fly dropships so I get how much of a pain they can be. As far as forges go I think this is the most iffy part of balance but, you can argue mobility price and Sp for this as well. So in over all I think there is pretty good balance. Yes I know that you don't but keep talking we can debate it.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 00:38:00 - [7] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Why in the hell are you parking somewhere, where your infantry support is nowhere near you? You deserve someone sneaking up behind you like a scout who throws down 3 proxy detos and then throwing an av nade to lite them off. Armor tanks have the movement speed of a heavy with all armor plates and half a leg. So unless you try the vehicle an know how it handles, don't talk about things you don't understand I agree armor tanks are very slow unbearably slow even, with no real plus to it out side of a little bit more total life. Retreat is barely an option with armor tanks, take a lot of trial and error to learn when you have stepped just a little bit to far. I have to say though if the armor hardeners are working they are much better than shields.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 00:53:00 - [8] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: I always play in a squad so if you have seen me you would know that. And as for taking it as an attack, lol you basically said teamwork is the key to keeping a tank alive... Nope the ability to micro manage your tanks mods is what keeps it alive. So go try a tank out with some teamwork and tell me how it goes Yes the ability to manage you mods is life or death for a tank especially an armor tank. I have tanked before I do understand stand how effective a having a decent ground force near you that you can contact make it great to be a tank and, how being alone when one or two guys show up with AV nades can really suck. No I am not an expert and will not say that I am but, I do have a really good understanding of tactics and strategy and I feel that having infantry tank support is the way to go. Tank vs 1 good player with good AV gear can be iffy especialy in an armor tank. Tank with infantry support on comms vs good players with good AV gear. Tank and infantry everytime. Lets chalk it up to a difference of opinions shall we.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 00:58:00 - [9] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Scheneighnay McBob wrote: Mr Zitro wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Why in the hell are you parking somewhere, where your infantry support is nowhere near you? You deserve someone sneaking up behind you like a scout who throws down 3 proxy detos and then throwing an av nade to lite them off. Armor tanks have the movement speed of a heavy with all armor plates and half a leg. So unless you try the vehicle an know how it handles, don't talk about things you don't understand You have a good point; however to be fair, you should still have infantry guarding your flanks and some good gunners (IMO, I think it's best to have a small blaster on the front with a small railgun on top) This just gave me an idea- how about an active module that drastically decreases the damage of all turrets, but increases movement speed/acceleration and shield/armor resistance by a ton? More or less a mechanism for an emergency retreat. The spawns are so dumb it puts forges next to me and kids with av grenades. You want me to have a squad just walking around my tank??? Are your serious? This is why I said I think some of you issue is with spawns not so much with the balance. Balance still yes but the spawns are still an issue.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 01:10:00 - [10] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: It's both spawns and av nades, nades doing more damage than a volley of swarms and a forge. That doesn't make sense to me Sounds like you get spawn naded quite a bit. So how about they fix the the spawns then see how effective they are because they wont be right on you all the time. I know who you run with and there is no reason some one should be able to get that close to your tank unless they deserved to be there.

Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 01:38:00 - [11] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Ydubbs81 RND wrote: You want an AV grenade nerf???? The person with an AV grenade has to try and escape infantry and be out of the view of a tank with 2 gunners. Then he has to throw grenades and be standing in a nanohive to reload and throw some more. Most tanks drive off after the 2nd grenade and you can't chase it into the spawn. Plus, the tank kills you more times than not. Wait...is this a troll or a serious thread asking for av grenades to be nerfed?? This is ambush talk not skirmish -.- I know that now but you didn't state that till like a couple post ago, or at least I didn't catch it till then. I agree with Ydubbs though right now tanks just don't belong in ambush do to the faults of the game type. Just in the same way the dropships are all but pointless given the faults of the game right now.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 01:50:00 - [12] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Goat of Dover wrote: Mr Zitro wrote: It's both spawns and av nades, nades doing more damage than a volley of swarms and a forge. That doesn't make sense to me Sounds like you get spawn naded quite a bit. So how about they fix the the spawns then see how effective they are because they wont be right on you all the time. I know who you run with and there is no reason some one should be able to get that close to your tank unless they deserved to be there. Read the earlier post,they spawn next to my tank! Do you speak another language want me to translate? No that post came in while I was typing this so I missed it we both speak I do believe english unless you have the greatest translator in the world. Again with the attack and attitude I am decent and respectful you and defend you on some cases yet you still have the way of being an ***. It may just be who you are just try and see the ones who are fighting you and the ones who are discussing with you.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.13 01:58:00 - [13] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Goat of Dover wrote: Mr Zitro wrote: Ydubbs81 RND wrote: You want an AV grenade nerf???? The person with an AV grenade has to try and escape infantry and be out of the view of a tank with 2 gunners. Then he has to throw grenades and be standing in a nanohive to reload and throw some more. Most tanks drive off after the 2nd grenade and you can't chase it into the spawn. Plus, the tank kills you more times than not. Wait...is this a troll or a serious thread asking for av grenades to be nerfed?? This is ambush talk not skirmish -.- I know that now but you didn't state that till like a couple post ago, or at least I didn't catch it till then. I agree with Ydubbs though right now tanks just don't belong in ambush do to the faults of the game type. Just in the same way the dropships are all but pointless given the faults of the game right now. Skirmish is a graveyard for tanks, people who think skirmish is better for tanks are stupid! Even if you rail tank snipe it's just pathetic I disagree I see people use tanks rather well in skirmish, well before the reset anyway. Just they tend to use them the way I stated with decent infantry in the vicinity to quell the AV. Until of course there are so many AV on the field they need to get cover because you can't handle that I don't care what tank you are running. Your statement makes it seem like tanks should be the be all end all.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.14 03:10:00 - [14] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Why do av grenades do more damage to armor than shields, should it not be a grenade that deal equal damage to all vehicles? CCP can you explain your hate towards armor? I think this is supposed to be based on the type of damage the AV nades do, which I believe is kinetic which is the same for swarms. There is no love for armor right now, it takes more skill to use and there is nothing but draw backs for it.
Goat of Dover Shadow Company HQ 161	Posted - 2013.01.14 21:41:00 - [15] - Quote Mr Zitro wrote: Goat of Dover wrote: Mr Zitro wrote: Why do av grenades do more damage to armor than shields, should it not be a grenade that deal equal damage to all vehicles? CCP can you explain your hate towards armor? I think this is supposed to be based on the type of damage the AV nades do, which I believe is kinetic which is the same for swarms. There is no love for armor right now, it takes more skill to use and there is nothing but draw backs for it. That is why shields need drawbacks (which I am I high leaning towards) or my armor stuff gets more health There was a post in the suggestion/feedback post that CCP does every week usually, that stated that armor is getting more to level the playing field but of course it does not go into state what it is getting. Hopefully it is not just more health maybe something a little bit more skill base as well. I just like using the things that require more skill to be effective with.