DUST Search - [Request] Ammo types treated as weapom customization modules

Ulysses Knapse wrote:

KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:

Ammo will only regenerate AFTER the battle IF you survive. I see no problem with it being like a module.

Except, ammunition shouldn't be like modules, because it's ammunition.

KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:

Like I said, bullets are easily replenished by manufacture nanites after the battle ends. Vehicle/dropsuit shields and armor regenerate after battle if they survive, so there is no reason to make ammo an exception.

Shields regenerate all the time, and armor is repaired. You cannot repair something that gets used up. It makes sense for ammo to run out when you use it, and it would give some incentive to conserve ammo. It's just like the cost of hi-tech dropsuits, except instead of being reckless with your life, you're being reckless with your bullets.

KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:

Having it to run out even when you don't die, not only wouldn't make sense, but would be tedious because it would mean you would always need to restock even when you don't die. So much time in the game is just spent managing fittings instead of actually doing battles, depleting ammo would only add to that.

Managing fittings? All you would have to do is restock ammunition, compared to your idea, so it really is very minimal.


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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.28 10:08:00 - [1] - Quote I hate the idea of having to buy ammo just to use a gun, or having to pay for every round of ammo; it seems like it would make things pointlessly tedious. I would however like to have a variety of optional exotic ammo types to equip and use though. There a way to have it both ways. When reading this, keep in mind gun customization is coming soon. Anyway, this is how it should work. All guns should come pre-fitted with a FREE basic ammo pack, much like how like how a vehicle comes with free turrets already equipped. This means if you don't care about ammo types and all that, and you just want your gun to work, then you don't have to have to buy ammo. When a gun (and the rest of the fitting) is destroyed in battle, so is the ammo pack as well. If the fitting survives the battle then the ammo pack should stay even if all the shots were all depleted in the battle; a surviving ammo pack should be resupplied back to its maximum capacity after the battle ends (since nanites can just replenish them). Non-basic ammo packs should not come pre-equipped in a gun, but should have to be purchased seperately, and fitted into the gun in place of the basic ammo pack. Nanohives should still work as usual, and replenish ammo of any type (basic, or non-basic). Purchasable non-basic ammo packs could include, but not limited: anti-shield rounds, anti-armor rounds, extra range rounds, faster swarm launcher missiles, incendiary mass driver rounds to light things on fire, stasis webifier mass driver rounds to slow enemies. There could also be non-basic ammo packs for higher round capacity and no other special effects. EDIT: Like it has been pointed out, this idea is basically having ammo packs as weapon customization modules, and not as a regular depleting resource like bullets in real life. Bullets are easily replaced by manufacturing nanites (like ones in nanohives), so it wouldn't make sense to have them work like real life bullets. This means if you finish a battle with an ammo pack not destroyed in the battle, but depleted of bullets, next time you deploy in a new battle you will start off with a full pack of ammo (yay for nanites). Thanks for reading.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.28 12:09:00 - [2] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Pointlessly tedious? Not really. Explain how it would be so tedious to customize your weapon with ammo or use infinitely free militia ammo. Please read the full post before commenting. All guns should come with free basic ammo already equipped because having to equip the basic ammo would be boring extra work. If you do want special ammo types, you buy and replace the free basic pre-fitted ammo type for the one you want. I'm saying it would be tedious if guns didn't already have a ammo already pre-fitted into them, and you had to buy ammo just to use basic ammo.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.28 20:57:00 - [3] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: Pointlessly tedious? Not really. Explain how it would be so tedious to customize your weapon with ammo or use infinitely free militia ammo. Please read the full post before commenting. I did, and your idea is quite different to what I imagine ammo being. Ammo packs? Ammo regeneration? I think for not. That would turn it into basically a module. Ammo will only regenerate AFTER the battle IF you survive. I see no problem with it being like a module. Like I said, bullets are easily replenished by manufacture nanites after the battle ends. Vehicle/dropsuit shields and armor regenerate after battle if they survive, so there is no reason to make ammo an exception. Having it to run out even when you don't die, not only wouldn't make sense, but would be tedious because it would mean you would always need to restock even when you don't die. So much time in the game is just spent managing fittings instead of actually doing battles, depleting ammo would only add to that. How do you want ammo to work?
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.29 04:01:00 - [4] - Quote Gunner Visari wrote: Okay im normally for more variety in a game but honestly i have to say no on this. Mainly because it would allow certain classes like Assault AR's to be effective against every enemy type they encounter. Now granted it could be cool yes in the sense that if any class can do it great, but even then all it will do is encourage more lone wolf behavior and more to the point will drive the player base back to using rifles and only rifles, especially if you could have different ammo types in a single fitting. As it is each weapon has a strength or weakness against a particular HP protection. This creates complimentary combinations when squads act as a unit, also weakness in one weapon can often be complimented by a grenade that makes up for it. I just feel like this type of system will drive more Mass Effect like Soldier builds where you have a single soldier able to handle each and every threat on his own without the need of squad/teammates. Im skeptical of its implementation, also because imagine a LR with this, MD"s with this would be shear chaos. The ammo types would have their weaknesses as well, like a anti-shield ammo pack would be terrible against armor. If its balanced, it won't be overpowered, and teamwork with others will still be required. You may have special ammo, but so will your enemies, so I really doubt it will make lone wolves overpowered since the people they fight will have access to the same assets.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.29 07:20:00 - [5] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Ammo will only regenerate AFTER the battle IF you survive. I see no problem with it being like a module. Except, ammunition shouldn't be like modules, because it's ammunition. KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Like I said, bullets are easily replenished by manufacture nanites after the battle ends. Vehicle/dropsuit shields and armor regenerate after battle if they survive, so there is no reason to make ammo an exception. Shields regenerate all the time, and armor is repaired. You cannot repair something that gets used up. It makes sense for ammo to run out when you use it, and it would give some incentive to conserve ammo. It's just like the cost of hi-tech dropsuits, except instead of being reckless with your life, you're being reckless with your bullets. KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Having it to run out even when you don't die, not only wouldn't make sense, but would be tedious because it would mean you would always need to restock even when you don't die. So much time in the game is just spent managing fittings instead of actually doing battles, depleting ammo would only add to that. Managing fittings? All you would have to do is restock ammunition, compared to your idea, so it really is very minimal. Actually, you can manufacture it with nanites. I said this before. You can manufacture things with nanites, that is how nanohives work; they manufacture bullets to replace the ones that got used up within seconds. Go read the nanohive (hive of nanites or nanobots) full description in the market. Just to make sure we're clear, nanites (self-replicating microscopic machines) can construct ammunition to replace depleted rounds within seconds. If its replenished that easily, there is no reason why it can't just behave like a module.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.29 09:45:00 - [6] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Because it's ammunition. Like it or not, the lore is already established. You realize that's not a valid argument right? "Why can't X be a subcategory of Y? because its X" Apply that same logic to anything else "Why can't a crow be a subcategory of birds? because its a crow" "Why can't a cat be a subcategory of animal? because its a cats" All of these counterexamples show this line of reasoning is invalid, therefore you can't just say "because its ammunition". You can't just restate something is what it is as proof as why it can't fall into a broader category.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.29 12:51:00 - [7] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: Because it's ammunition. Like it or not, the lore is already established. You realize that's not a valid argument right? "Why can't X be a subcategory of Y? because its X" Apply that same logic to anything else "Why can't a crow be a subcategory of birds? because its a crow" "Why can't a cat be a subcategory of animal? because its a cats" All of these counterexamples show this line of reasoning is invalid, therefore you can't just say "because its ammunition". You can't just restate something is what it is as proof as why it can't fall into a broader category. Ammunition is not a subcategory of modules, so don't play that card. Also, what you are suggesting (basically just another facet for weapon customization) would be much easier to accomplish if it worked like any other weapon customization feature, and not a separate sub-module. It would work identically to what you are suggesting, but be much simpler. I don't support it terribly, but it's better than nothing. I would much rather prefer a normal ammunition feature, but this alternative, so long as it was implemented as a customization configuration and not as a module, would be acceptable. Of course it isn't now, I never said it is right now. I'm saying *it can* be and there is no reason why it shouldn't**. It would fit with the lore (which you are so quick to ignore), and your "because its ammunition" answer no way proves it can't or shouldn't be. I would like it to be another facet for weapon customization as well, as a weapon customization module (as apposed to a dropsuit or vehicle module). Perhaps I should specify weapon customization module and not just module i the OP.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.29 13:56:00 - [8] - Quote Lorpsajee Nos wrote: I don't like the idea of separate modules. I think nanohives should still replenish the special ammo. Special ammo should compliment standard ammo not make it redundant. You could introduce tracer rounds, tracker darts, emp? If new ammo just does more damage then anyone using it would have an excessive advantage over normal players. I think nanohives should replenish special ammo as well. I don't want special rounds to just be higher damage versions of basic ammo, but instead just exist different roles, and with different strengths and weaknesses. Tracing rounds, and EMP rounds (guessing low damage rounds that mess up enemy HUD) would be awesome. How would you like it to work if not as a module you fit on your gun?
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.12.29 14:27:00 - [9] - Quote WHz DS9899 wrote: Just to clear this up: do you mean that you would attach a ammo type to the gun fitting, and f you didn't die, it would stay no matter how many shots you fired? If so, I thought of this idea ages ago, and I got raged at for saying this idea. I agree with you, this would be fun to have in Dust, especially if I could do this with my blaster on my HAV. +1 for you since you say you came up with it 1st.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2013.01.04 10:43:00 - [10] - Quote Ammo type modules for vehicles would be cool as well.

KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2013.01.12 07:39:00 - [11] - Quote Anyone else interested?
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2013.01.14 23:34:00 - [12] - Quote Feedback from others is welcomed.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2013.01.20 10:36:00 - [13] - Quote I still want to peew peew with different bullets for different roles.