DUST Search - Can someone explain to me why did CCP reduce the "stats" difference be...

Konohamaru Sarutobi wrote:

mikegunnz wrote:

Konohamaru Sarutobi wrote:

Mavado V Noriega wrote:

mikegunnz wrote:

You can make the argument that it'll work out well. In high-sec, most will opt for cheap or free suits. Very little at stake.
In null-sec, people are fighting for huge contracts, or attacking/defending sov territory. The stakes are high, so even though the proto gear doesn't give a huge advantage, people will use it because there's a lot on the line and they'll want ANY advantage they can get.... regardless of cost.

Makes sense to me. Maybe I'm just nuts. Shocked

someone is thinking. +1
When someone is paying u big bucks to secure a planet for them ur gonna roll in ur best gear anyway
so what if X corp best gear is only Adv lvl should they be automatically curb stomped because the difference in gear gives proto 300 more shields than adv? thats gear winning ur fights for u not ur skill

As a FPS player thats a big ass crutch and NO srs competitive clan will come to this game and stick around for such an inbalance

And guess what? when the proto corp in that scenario wins easily they will continue to get richer and richer and the poorer corps find it almost impossible to make any dent when trying to take their planets because of gear which results in actually LESS competition happening because then only the few top corps who been winning non stop can keep funding more and more proto gear and that puts the top corps with little to no risk at losing unless someone can match their funds 1st and foremost then gotta worry about matching their skill

But you both are talking about "corp" battles. That's means as a "random" player, i can't enjoy the game 100% because some things are thinking just for corp battles. Thanks for forcing me to join in a corp. (Sarcasm)

This applies to highsec pubs as well. If I'm new to game, I'll roll in a free suit I have a chance against some guy rolling in a 120-140k isk proto fit. They will STILL have an advantage, but I have a chance against them... if I'm a better player. This will keep me wanting to play and progress, so that I can eventually kill the guys that are of equal skill to me. (which I wouldn't be able to kill at the start, because the small advantage that proto gives, is enough to keep them killing me)

If you have Proto gear, it's because you play and you have some skills, with those skills (bad or good), you can use advance or standar weapons and make the same gameplay because in this game, at least you're a good Heavy, you can't go against 3 or 4 guys, because 1 clip of a standar weapon can kill you, so you need to play carrefully and don't get a lot of shoots, and that's ok, but if i don't feel diference between playing an advance/standar gear or a proto gear, why do i need to feel the diference when i die? ISK difference doesn't compensate the advantages of a Proto gear, that's why it's not atractive spend a lot of SP and ISK.

Like i said, it's more atractive the black color.


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mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.12.22 18:51:00 - [1] - Quote The way it is now is better. Proto weapons give an advantage, but it's minimal. If you're good, you still have a fighting chance with militia gear. That's a good balance of FPS and RPG. And I agree with Mavado, the prices of some gear should come down SLIGHTLY.
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.12.23 13:47:00 - [2] - Quote "no investment? hell no. SP plays a big factor so time investment is there but if they can fund some DUST ISK sure why not no risk since they can run trash gear? lol well if the team is THAT bad to allow a team with militia gear run them over when they in proto then yes they should be able to do that because thats showing just how big the skill gap is between those 2 corps. what u want is only a select few corps to actually be able to play in FW and Null because they cant run any proto gear or not backed by any EVE alliance. IF thats the game CCP wants then no competitive clans from any other game will take dust seriously. Any serious corp will run at least advanced gear+ and i think thats fine so i dont see where ur complaints coming from. The corps that try to get into Null and FW with standard can try but prob will get stomped alot unless they are that good which i that case we should say kudos to them for puttin themselves at a disadvantage and still winning. i actually dont like cod btw. just an fyi. Im just speaking from a competitive standpoint ur gear already gives u advantages each tier u go up and gear shouldnt be a decider in who wins a corp v corp match. Huge differences in gear makes avg corps/players look better than they actually are and worse yet if they EVE funded the game is now ez mode for them because they have such a big gap over lower tier players." I have to agree with this. RIght now, there IS an advantage that having proto gear gives you. When you factor in the extra bullets you can eat with your extra shield extenders, the extra damage you can do with your weapon, the faster heal times with regulators, etc etc, the proto fit does have a substantial advantage. Two EQUAL players facing off, the higher gear wins, hands down. If a good player in militia faces a bad player in proto, the good player has a solid chance of winning. Sounds right to me. In old builds, a proto player could literally go againsts a group of 4 militia players and wreck them 9/10 times. No skill necessary. I feel like the argument the Imps are giving is that it has to be all or nothing. It doesn't have to be this way. There SHOULD be differentiation, but at the same time, the fit differences shouldn't be so large that player skill can't overcome a bad player with high end gear.
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.12.23 14:50:00 - [3] - Quote Weapons and suits, etc still are tiered. Proto stuff still gives you an advantage, just not as much. Not sure if you were in early builds Ydubbs, but literally a mediocre proto player could crush groups of 2-3 highly skilled players using militia gear. The militia players didn't stand a chance. Now a proto player can still easily dominate in 1v1 against militia (as long as they are the better player) The problem people have, is that they can no longer 1v3 militia players. (unless the militia players are really bad)
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.12.24 03:16:00 - [4] - Quote You can make the argument that it'll work out well. In high-sec, most will opt for cheap or free suits. Very little at stake. In null-sec, people are fighting for huge contracts, or attacking/defending sov territory. The stakes are high, so even though the proto gear doesn't give a huge advantage, people will use it because there's a lot on the line and they'll want ANY advantage they can get.... regardless of cost. Makes sense to me. Maybe I'm just nuts.
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.12.24 03:50:00 - [5] - Quote Konohamaru Sarutobi wrote: Mavado V Noriega wrote: mikegunnz wrote: You can make the argument that it'll work out well. In high-sec, most will opt for cheap or free suits. Very little at stake. In null-sec, people are fighting for huge contracts, or attacking/defending sov territory. The stakes are high, so even though the proto gear doesn't give a huge advantage, people will use it because there's a lot on the line and they'll want ANY advantage they can get.... regardless of cost. Makes sense to me. Maybe I'm just nuts. someone is thinking. +1 When someone is paying u big bucks to secure a planet for them ur gonna roll in ur best gear anyway so what if X corp best gear is only Adv lvl should they be automatically curb stomped because the difference in gear gives proto 300 more shields than adv? thats gear winning ur fights for u not ur skill As a FPS player thats a big ass crutch and NO srs competitive clan will come to this game and stick around for such an inbalance And guess what? when the proto corp in that scenario wins easily they will continue to get richer and richer and the poorer corps find it almost impossible to make any dent when trying to take their planets because of gear which results in actually LESS competition happening because then only the few top corps who been winning non stop can keep funding more and more proto gear and that puts the top corps with little to no risk at losing unless someone can match their funds 1st and foremost then gotta worry about matching their skill But you both are talking about "corp" battles. That's means as a "random" player, i can't enjoy the game 100% because some things are thinking just for corp battles. Thanks for forcing me to join in a corp. (Sarcasm) This applies to highsec pubs as well. If I'm new to game, I'll roll in a free suit I have a chance against some guy rolling in a 120-140k isk proto fit. They will STILL have an advantage, but I have a chance against them... if I'm a better player. This will keep me wanting to play and progress, so that I can eventually kill the guys that are of equal skill to me. (which I wouldn't be able to kill at the start, because the small advantage that proto gives, is enough to keep them killing me)
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.12.24 04:09:00 - [6] - Quote Konohamaru Sarutobi wrote: mikegunnz wrote: Konohamaru Sarutobi wrote: Mavado V Noriega wrote: mikegunnz wrote: You can make the argument that it'll work out well. In high-sec, most will opt for cheap or free suits. Very little at stake. In null-sec, people are fighting for huge contracts, or attacking/defending sov territory. The stakes are high, so even though the proto gear doesn't give a huge advantage, people will use it because there's a lot on the line and they'll want ANY advantage they can get.... regardless of cost. Makes sense to me. Maybe I'm just nuts. someone is thinking. +1 When someone is paying u big bucks to secure a planet for them ur gonna roll in ur best gear anyway so what if X corp best gear is only Adv lvl should they be automatically curb stomped because the difference in gear gives proto 300 more shields than adv? thats gear winning ur fights for u not ur skill As a FPS player thats a big ass crutch and NO srs competitive clan will come to this game and stick around for such an inbalance And guess what? when the proto corp in that scenario wins easily they will continue to get richer and richer and the poorer corps find it almost impossible to make any dent when trying to take their planets because of gear which results in actually LESS competition happening because then only the few top corps who been winning non stop can keep funding more and more proto gear and that puts the top corps with little to no risk at losing unless someone can match their funds 1st and foremost then gotta worry about matching their skill But you both are talking about "corp" battles. That's means as a "random" player, i can't enjoy the game 100% because some things are thinking just for corp battles. Thanks for forcing me to join in a corp. (Sarcasm) This applies to highsec pubs as well. If I'm new to game, I'll roll in a free suit I have a chance against some guy rolling in a 120-140k isk proto fit. They will STILL have an advantage, but I have a chance against them... if I'm a better player. This will keep me wanting to play and progress, so that I can eventually kill the guys that are of equal skill to me. (which I wouldn't be able to kill at the start, because the small advantage that proto gives, is enough to keep them killing me) If you have Proto gear, it's because you play and you have some skills, with those skills (bad or good), you can use advance or standar weapons and make the same gameplay because in this game, at least you're a good Heavy, you can't go against 3 or 4 guys, because 1 clip of a standar weapon can kill you, so you need to play carrefully and don't get a lot of shoots, and that's ok, but if i don't feel diference between playing an advance/standar gear or a proto gear, why do i need to feel the diference when i die? ISK difference doesn't compensate the advantages of a Proto gear, that's why it's not atractive spend a lot of SP and ISK. Like i said, it's more atractive the black color. Law of diminishing return. A ferrari costs 5-6x more than a more mainstream high-performance luxury sports car. While the ferrari is nicer and performs at a higher level, it does NOT perform 5-6x better than the cheaper car. A 1-carat diamond costs $3-5k (depending on quality) a 2-carat diamond of equal quality costs 3-4x more... not 2x more.
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.12.24 04:36:00 - [7] - Quote Konohamaru Sarutobi wrote: @mikegunnz You don't need to spend SP to unblock a skill to learn how to drive a cheap car and then spend x10 to learn how to drive a Ferrari, you just need more ISK. With your example, give me the option to buy standar and proto gear at the same level, just make it with ISK difference I would agree, except that the SP applies to skills. For suits, yes it's a PITA. For many other skills though, the higher skills give you passive bonuses that apply to you no matter what gear you use. (weapon skills, AR proficiency, shield control, etc)