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Garrett Blacknova
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Posted - 2012.12.03 03:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
DarkShadowFox wrote:no Ive seen higher fit tanks taken out in a matter of minutes.
Minutes.
MINUTES.
If a Heavy suit is being shot at, and doesn't have sufficient cover, his lifespan is measured in SECONDS.
Tanks are fine. Tank weapons are mostly fine (I need more playtime on my Missile Turrets - they seem less broken than they were the first couple of days after the nerf, but Large Railguns turn too slow). Forge Guns are fine.
Also, Railguns can practically operate as sniper weapons against infantry at range. Forge Guns can't even get a splash hit at the kind of range a Railgun tank can line up a headshot. |
Garrett Blacknova
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Posted - 2012.12.03 05:27:00 -
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DarkShadowFox wrote:not when swarms that can avert cover and dont go to your last positon and two of those coupled with a forge gun, yup say bye bye..
I love how tank players keep spamming this argument and ignore the fact that players who use BOTH tanks AND Swarm Launchers, as well as anyone who uses Swarm Launchers, can clearly say that this FAILS far more often than it SUCCEEDS.
When you get into cover, there's a VERY SMALL chance that the missiles will "dodge" the cover or find a way to glitch around/through it and hit. Because you're in cover, you often don't see the missiles that don't find their way through it. Sometimes, you're just moving and don't realise there's a Swarm guy shooting at you because his shots keep getting blocked as you go. When you DO see them coming, and deliberately move for cover, sometimes you're too slow moving, and the missiles come around the cover because they don't always track your current position properly, and instead aim where you were a few seconds earlier, and because they don't turn as sharply as they used to, so if you're making fast or sudden movements, they sometimes won't track as fast and will curve around your cover instead of slamming into it.
There's a FAR LARGER chance that when a Swarm Launcher is being fired, half (or more) of the missiles will go flying off into random terrain and explode without every actually heading in the direction of the locked target. It's entirely possible for a parked LAV to ignore a Swarm Launcher sometimes, because EVERY SINGLE SHOT results in ALL the missiles flying wildly and aiming for buildings, scenery and terrain instead of the LAV that they're SUPPOSED TO BE LOCKED ONTO. |
Garrett Blacknova
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Posted - 2012.12.03 13:19:00 -
[3] - Quote
xMarauder wrote:DarkShadowFox wrote:Ludvig Enraga wrote: on the order of 6 m/sec. so all the forge gunners can sit behind the tank where you cant reach them? it happens alot... literally behind it, with the current HP the Hav's have... yeah.. there not surviving even if you have a nice fit... 10k hp is not enough... Yeah cuz a forge gunner getting in good position to take out a tank is TOTALLY OP. Positioning is extremely important in all cases. If you positioned your tank horribly and a forge gunner got very good positioning then by all means you deserves to lose that tank for your own... Stupidity?
He's not saying a Forge Gun in a good position is OP.
He's saying that making it EASY for a Forge Gunner to STAY in a PERFECT position would be OP.
Tanks are MEANT to be mobile - but nowhere near as fast as LAVs and Dropships.
Taking about 6 m/s from the current speed of tanks? Maybe. But even that doesn't seem like a great idea to me, and I mostly run AV.
Cutting tanks back to only moving at 6 m/s? No way. That's completely ridiculous and wrong. |
Garrett Blacknova
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Posted - 2012.12.04 08:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
Lavirac JR wrote:Sorry 3 Forge Gunners should be able to take out a tank quickly if it does not retreat, that is what they do. Your problem is you want to solo this game in a tank, that should not happen. Get infantry support and those Swarmers die and so do the forge gunners.
BTW some comparisons you forgot with regard to rail guns and forge guns.
1- Rail Guns have infinite ammo (Forge Guns do not).
2- The Best Heavy suits have over 1K HP total, Tanks start at 3K HP for militia I believe...
3- Rail Guns can zoom in, forge guns can not.
4- Hybrid Turret users can use Blasters free of charge no extra training, Heavy users have to train up HMG to get access to anti-infantry weapons.
And as a guy with a shield tank alt, I laugh in my Gunnlogi at swarm missiles with my 7.5K shields (that's without shield adaptation trained yet). In fact Forge gunners only get me when I'm aggressive, stupid, and unsupported by a team.
Just adding to point 3, Forge Guns have a small amount of scatter applied to their shots - they don't fire precisely straight. Railguns do. They're MUCH better able to land direct hits than a Forge Gun can. |
Garrett Blacknova
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Posted - 2012.12.06 12:05:00 -
[5] - Quote
Khal V'Rani wrote:Shijima Kuraimaru wrote:
Yeah. I don't see a kinetic slug three to four time the size of a .50 caliber round, traveling at 7000+ meters per second, only making it 50 meters. Applying realistic physics, It should have an effective range way beyond what the game already limits it too.
I've tried that argument with map size and sniper rifles. Apparently no one cares if they believe there's some sort of injustice done to them and there personal sense of order and play style or strategy. Sniper rifles, per description, state 2500m/s. That means almost zero travel time at 200 meters, 400 meters, 1000 meters. People apparently can't read descriptions and reason things out. A basic militia sniper rifle says 2500m/s, The only argument I can think of is... is that number shown in the descriptions operational distance, planning distance, optimal distance, max distance? And it still really doesn't matter at this point as the map size is small enough to make travel time irrelevant at those speeds. Sorry, had to get it out of my system.
And another example is Railgun turrets on tanks. By DUST standards, those should have practically infinite range and no travel time on their projectiles as well. |
Garrett Blacknova
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Posted - 2012.12.07 09:12:00 -
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Ludvig Enraga wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote:xMarauder wrote:on the order of 6 m/sec. Cutting tanks back to only moving at 6 m/s? No way. That's completely ridiculous and wrong. Why is it wrong? What I see now is that AV are extremely ineffective against tanks - it literaly takes a dumb tank driver to lose one. How can you make it more balanced? -Decrease damage of tank? - No. We saw that happen and now ppl dont want to play with tanks anymore -Decrease HP of a tank? - No. It would not be a tank then. - Increase DMG on FG? - No. Let's not even go there, most ppl would say. So, decreasing tank mobility is the only reasonalbe way. If it takes 2 dings from a FG to take out a tank, that's at least 15 consequtive seconds of FG charge cycling -- oh wait! you gotta reload it cuz it got only 4 rounds - make it 20-25sec. How far would a tank be in half a minute if it started taking dmg? That's right it would be long gone. That's why tanks are relatively risk free save inherent risks of idiot drivers, which grow out of it really fast too btw.
I'm not saying that you can't consider a reasonable nerf to tank mobility.
I'm saying that cutting them back to INFANTRY WALKING SPEED is a terrible idea.
Dropping the current speed BY 6 m/s would be reasonable.
Reducing them to only move at that speed is stupid. |
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