DUST Search - [Suggestion] The Yellow Zone.

Cross Atu wrote:

Garrett Blacknova wrote:

Cross Atu wrote:

I agree that is a short fall, and honestly even the removal of the war points suggested in the OP is a somewhat imperfect solution in that it's something of a violation to the setting (clearly a mechanic being enforced rather than an intuitive part of the world playing out).

And this part of your post gave me another idea.

Make the deployment zone into a deployment zone instead of part of the battlefield.

When you spawn in your deployment area/yellow zone, it's a yellow zone, in which your enemies get no kill credit or WP for killing you, and you get nothing for killing them. From the time you first spawn, there's a countdown timer that starts at 1:30. After spawning, you have a minute and a half before the deployment area becomes a redzone. At that point, you get the redone timer on top of the yellow zone timer, but once it becomes a redzone, you become a valid target, and so do enemies.

Why? Because the HighSec contract specifically instructs you to enter battle promptly. This fits as being the same reason for the otherwise totally arbitrary time limit that kicks you out of the battle for not spawning. You have to enter battle within a reasonable timeframe. That means you have to spawn quickly, AND it means you have to head for the designated battlefield after doing so.

I like it

There are a couple of aspects which we'll have to figure out how to address but I think this is really on the right track.

First issue would be deploying into a redzone (solved if people aren't added to matches already in progress, which I think is a good idea on it's own so I'm going to move on).

Second is a question of map layout, would the new yellow --> red zone cover the current deployment area, be an addition do it, etc If an addition where in relation to the current deployment (or maybe just make that a map by map call?). If placed over the current area what about the instillation already present? (wouldn't they be destroyed once it turns red? and if not what use do they serve?).

Third would be the issue of getting fully redline camped, if your deployment zone becomes dangerous ground after the start of the map that'll be a hard day indeed.

Unless of course I miss read and what you mean is that there would be a countdown timer to turn from yellow to read for each Merc upon each spawn in. If that's what you meant then disregard questions 2 & 3 because in essence they'd no longer apply. (Second could just have a slight alteration in placement of any active installations like blasters so they could still be used once "yellow" expires and third issue simply wouldn't apply).

I think you've really hit on something here, this could address the problems we're encountering in the present system. Add a persistent "yellow" layer around the edge of the map where the red zone is constant (as per the OP) to avoid map edge red line sniping and it seems to cover all our bases.
The other great thing about the idea you propose is that a timer is easily adjustable even via hotfix so honing balance would be much more readily accomplished and the timer could be adjusted to properly account for the unique features of each match and map rather than trying to make a "one size fits all" iteration.

Cheers,
Cross


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Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.11.18 01:10:00 - [1] - Quote I suggested this in a thread before, but I suggested that each team's "red zone" area, where they're safe but the enemy can't travel, should be marked as a "blue zone". While in the blue (or yellow) zone, you're relatively safe, since enemies have to (mostly) keep their distance, but you're also unable to earn WPs OR kills. Obviously, you can still KILL from there, but the game doesn't count those kills, so you can't pad your K/D by redlining yourself. People firing INTO this area should still be rewarded normally, because getting that close to the enemy's red zone should be a difficult task in the first place.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.11.18 09:29:00 - [2] - Quote Was thinking about this after I'd posted, and realised that letting a team farm points from spawn-camping their opponents was a stupid suggestion. But the reason I came up with it was because I didn't think it was any more fair to punish a team for winning. Still trying to come up with a way to balance out the two sides...
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.11.18 11:46:00 - [3] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: I agree that is a short fall, and honestly even the removal of the war points suggested in the OP is a somewhat imperfect solution in that it's something of a violation to the setting (clearly a mechanic being enforced rather than an intuitive part of the world playing out). And this part of your post gave me another idea. Make the deployment zone into a deployment zone instead of part of the battlefield. When you spawn in your deployment area/yellow zone, it's a yellow zone, in which your enemies get no kill credit or WP for killing you, and you get nothing for killing them. From the time you first spawn, there's a countdown timer that starts at 1:30. After spawning, you have a minute and a half before the deployment area becomes a redzone. At that point, you get the redone timer on top of the yellow zone timer, but once it becomes a redzone, you become a valid target, and so do enemies. Why? Because the HighSec contract specifically instructs you to enter battle promptly. This fits as being the same reason for the otherwise totally arbitrary time limit that kicks you out of the battle for not spawning. You have to enter battle within a reasonable timeframe. That means you have to spawn quickly, AND it means you have to head for the designated battlefield after doing so.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.11.18 11:56:00 - [4] - Quote Laurent Cazaderon wrote: Honestly, i like the idea of force fielded area better. Some sort of installation that would be added around the starting CRU of every team. This installation would create a force field of say a 100m radius. No shots would enter\get out of this. Everything coming out of it couldnt get back in. No WP could be earned inside it (avoid exploit). 1) It would make very smaller "red zone" avoiding staying in a "safe" area and sniping\spamming the map 2) It would finally give a justification for those safe areas. At the moment, nothing explains this red zone and clones dying in it after a few seconds...... 3) This force field installation would probably be an interesting player directed installation in the future. That sounds good, until you see the ways people could REALLY easily exploit that. Spawning inside an impenetrable shield is a potentially game-breakingly bad idea, EVEN with those restrictions. It's pretty much throwing down the best-designed terrain possible for tanks to play hide-and-seek with the rest of the map.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.11.18 13:06:00 - [5] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Garrett Blacknova wrote: Cross Atu wrote: I agree that is a short fall, and honestly even the removal of the war points suggested in the OP is a somewhat imperfect solution in that it's something of a violation to the setting (clearly a mechanic being enforced rather than an intuitive part of the world playing out). And this part of your post gave me another idea. Make the deployment zone into a deployment zone instead of part of the battlefield. When you spawn in your deployment area/yellow zone, it's a yellow zone, in which your enemies get no kill credit or WP for killing you, and you get nothing for killing them. From the time you first spawn, there's a countdown timer that starts at 1:30. After spawning, you have a minute and a half before the deployment area becomes a redzone. At that point, you get the redone timer on top of the yellow zone timer, but once it becomes a redzone, you become a valid target, and so do enemies. Why? Because the HighSec contract specifically instructs you to enter battle promptly. This fits as being the same reason for the otherwise totally arbitrary time limit that kicks you out of the battle for not spawning. You have to enter battle within a reasonable timeframe. That means you have to spawn quickly, AND it means you have to head for the designated battlefield after doing so. I like it There are a couple of aspects which we'll have to figure out how to address but I think this is really on the right track. First issue would be deploying into a redzone (solved if people aren't added to matches already in progress, which I think is a good idea on it's own so I'm going to move on). Second is a question of map layout, would the new yellow --> red zone cover the current deployment area, be an addition do it, etc If an addition where in relation to the current deployment (or maybe just make that a map by map call?). If placed over the current area what about the instillation already present? (wouldn't they be destroyed once it turns red? and if not what use do they serve?). Third would be the issue of getting fully redline camped, if your deployment zone becomes dangerous ground after the start of the map that'll be a hard day indeed. Unless of course I miss read and what you mean is that there would be a countdown timer to turn from yellow to read for each Merc upon each spawn in. If that's what you meant then disregard questions 2 & 3 because in essence they'd no longer apply. (Second could just have a slight alteration in placement of any active installations like blasters so they could still be used once "yellow" expires and third issue simply wouldn't apply). I think you've really hit on something here, this could address the problems we're encountering in the present system. Add a persistent "yellow" layer around the edge of the map where the red zone is constant (as per the OP) to avoid map edge red line sniping and it seems to cover all our bases. The other great thing about the idea you propose is that a timer is easily adjustable even via hotfix so honing balance would be much more readily accomplished and the timer could be adjusted to properly account for the unique features of each match and map rather than trying to make a "one size fits all" iteration. Cheers, Cross I was meaning it for each individual on spawn, not as a map-wide timer at the beginning of the match. And that addresses ALL the questions, not just the second and third. 1. You don't deploy into a redzone. Just like you can't do that now. You deploy into a yellow zone. When you spawn there, EVERY time you spawn there, you get the yellow zone timer giving you a minute and a half before the redzone timer kicks in. 2. That would have to be looked at on a case-by-case basis. On Manus Peak, for example, I think bringing the yellow zone further down the hill would help, so people have to come further forward before they're safe and able to collect WP and kills. 3. The yellow zone will be a safe area for about 2 minutes if you include the redzone timer, giving you time to see where the enemy is, what they're doing, and find a way around them.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.11.29 11:21:00 - [6] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Noc Tempre wrote: Makes babysitting not only boring, but fruitless? No thank you. I'd prefer a slaughter rule and abandonment of the redline. Elaborate and define? (also why is this, in your view, not an appropriate mechanic for the High Sec starter areas of D514?) Slaughter rule and no redline would be great for Nullsec, and MAYBE LowSec, but not so good in HighSec. A slaughter rule is where the mission ends when one side has obviously already lost. For Skirmish, this would mean that the mission would end if the other team held all the Null Cannons for a certain period, because that shows your team is being spawn-camped and can't break out. In Ambush, a similar mechanic could be introduced where your team will lose if they have a certain amount of consecutive deaths without any kills. Basically, this acts as a way to cut an obvious failure short and potentially save both sides a lot of money by allowing the losers to just run away when it becomes clear they can't win.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.12.16 21:03:00 - [7] - Quote Noc Tempre wrote: Makes babysitting not only boring, but fruitless? No thank you. I'd prefer a slaughter rule and abandonment of the redline. Just thought of something else here... What is there to "babysit" behind the redline anyway?