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Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2012.11.14 12:01:00 -
[1] - Quote
Edit/Written before missile nerf, but still good idea/Edit
With the QQ about vehicles (especially missile turrets) being a huge issue, perhaps it's time for a semi-quick fix until you get some more stuff in the game to counter them. A single or dual shot homing AV turret or something similar would do the trick I think. Basically an alt form of the missile turret.
Take your LAV with an AV turret and hunt down all of those pesky dropships and tanks that have been raining hell down on the field.
Throw an AV turret on one of your tank slots to pop those dropships and LAV's that keep popping you and running away at the last second.
Use one of your dropship turrets to focus on taking out those pesky missile tanks that keep launching volleys at you and those LAVs that always shoot you and speed away.
Put some FEAR into those vehicle drivers. Make the vehicles focus on each other a little more and the AV units should have a somewhat easier time sneaking up on them to do their job. Vehicles will focus on other vehicles more since they don't know whether or not that vehicle can lock onto them and hit them with some major damage. (I am aware that vehicles already focus on vehicles. This would just increase that.)
Every vehicle gains from this in some way, and the infantry gain as well since one turret on each vehicle will likely be an AV turret, thereby increasing their survival rate by the equivalent of one missing turret. |
Ty 'SweetCheeks' Borg
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
192
|
Posted - 2012.11.14 12:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
I'd honestly quite like some sort of AA variant tbh, it makes sense and would really help the whines against tanks. If people saw tank drivers pulling tanks to specifically take out the gunships, they might actually help support them instead of just ignoring them or complaining about them.
Might, being the key word there. With the current standard of blueberry play, I doubt they'd even realise. |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2012.11.14 12:19:00 -
[3] - Quote
Honestly I'm imagining 3 AV units in an AV LAV rushing in and blasting tanks, jumping out right before the vehicle blows and finishing it off. ^^ Epic Rambo moment for the AV units. xDD Not to mention it would give AV units a reason to spec slightly into vehicles in order to have more AV tactics at their disposal. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
|
Posted - 2012.11.14 14:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ty 'SweetCheeks' Borg wrote:I'd honestly quite like some sort of AA variant tbh, it makes sense and would really help the whines against tanks. If people saw tank drivers pulling tanks to specifically take out the gunships, they might actually help support them instead of just ignoring them or complaining about them.
Might, being the key word there. With the current standard of blueberry play, I doubt they'd even realise. Blueberry: "Haha that tank's such a noob! I'm down here! Why you shooting into the sky?"
*friendly dropship crash lands and kills Blueberry*
Blueberry: "Kittening OP Dropships squashing me! It's like the E3 build all over again! NERF DROPSHIPS!"
...
It's sad, because I can see that happening. |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2012.11.17 01:20:00 -
[5] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Ty 'SweetCheeks' Borg wrote:I'd honestly quite like some sort of AA variant tbh, it makes sense and would really help the whines against tanks. If people saw tank drivers pulling tanks to specifically take out the gunships, they might actually help support them instead of just ignoring them or complaining about them.
Might, being the key word there. With the current standard of blueberry play, I doubt they'd even realise. Blueberry: "Haha that tank's such a noob! I'm down here! Why you shooting into the sky?" *friendly dropship crash lands and kills Blueberry* Blueberry: "Kittening OP Dropships squashing me! It's like the E3 build all over again! NERF DROPSHIPS!" ... It's sad, because I can see that happening. OP because it falls on them? No... I don't see anything beyond a troll thread doing such a thing. |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1170
|
Posted - 2012.11.17 03:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
So your idea of a "quick fix" is introduce an entirely new item that is by design likely to be severely overpowered and takes no skill to use? |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2012.11.20 00:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:So your idea of a "quick fix" is introduce an entirely new item that is by design likely to be severely overpowered and takes no skill to use? No, my idea is to introduce an alternative turret that will jazz things up. I could just as easily say missile turrets require no skill since with proto turrets (yes, I have them, and know how well they work) merely require you hit near someone in order to kill them. 2 shots with a proto turrets splash damage will kill just about anything on 2 legs, 1 shot if you hit within a few inches (since hit detection is weird on missile turrets).
Yes, they would be OP. Against vehicles. Unlike regular missiles which are OP against everything. But would be virtually useless against ground troops. You don't like getting blown up by AV turrets? Quit hiding in a vehicle. Isn't that the argument the vehicle drivers give us when we complain about missile turrets? "you don't like it, get a forge gun"? Then they say "but I'm only specced for vehicles, what am I supposed to do?". I say in return ""Get some AV turrets and shoot back, or skill into something else". If they can tell me to skill into a forge or quit complaining, I can tell them to skill into a dropsuit. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2012.11.20 01:58:00 -
[8] - Quote
I'd love to see anti-air, turrets, but only as something that has to be purchased, if it just lands in the battle for free, then it should be weak to serve to only scare away dropships. Something free should not be able to easily take out something as expensive as a dropship. |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2012.11.20 02:03:00 -
[9] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:I'd love to see anti-air, turrets, but only as something that has to be purchased, if it just lands in the battle for free, then it should be weak to serve to only scare away dropships. Something free should not be able to easily take out something as expensive as a dropship. Agreed, I was referring to turrets you have to skill up to get and that have to be purchased and take up one of your turret slots on your vehicle. |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1170
|
Posted - 2012.11.20 05:06:00 -
[10] - Quote
Sorry, but even jesus missiles require a modicum of skill to get in the vicinity. You want a ******* locking weapon that is stronger than any other AV weapon? You're out of your mind thinking that's balanced. |
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Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
33
|
Posted - 2012.11.20 05:16:00 -
[11] - Quote
The specialized AV turret is just a way to kill vehicles without investing SP or isk into a heavy suit with a forge gun. Someone else does all the investing for their LAV and with no investment on my part I can destroy tanks... |
Valmar Shadereaver
Lost-Legion
18
|
Posted - 2012.11.20 05:25:00 -
[12] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:Sorry, but even jesus missiles require a modicum of skill to get in the vicinity. You want a ******* locking weapon that is stronger than any other AV weapon? You're out of your mind thinking that's balanced. whine's the dropship pilot in wat kind of war theme dont you have AA turet's? so they take your troop transport out cause its weak and a troop transport your not a gunship pieced together whit premium armore or shield's like a gunship probaly will have so they make a AV turet specificly against vechical's sure itwl be less fun losing you stuf but you shud know you only take out what your wiling to lose if your not whiling to lose it dont take it out and stop whining about ppl wanting to add a realisticly usable game mechanic so your woried theyl make the AA/AV turret overpowerd i only say look at misile launcher atm and expet the same for probaly the artilery turet its a beta theyl add alot of stuf and change stuf to balance it after a build or a few depending on the urgency
doesent give you dropship/tank pilots a reazon to deny a posible request wanne give you opinoin good thats very good but dont give a baised opinoin cause it otherwise might afect your eazy 0hk
just buy a ton of dropship's at the 50% of event and get a fair opinoin that isent baised bye your use of vechical's
im just sad some new players quit cause there furst game is against 2-3 dropship's and a tank we want to atract more active player's not push them all away cause some ppl love being lame whit equipment and make it near imposible to kill
for one id love seeing the old wp system for vechicals return cause killing vechical's atm just isent worth it you get 150wp max if you destroy it you used to get wp for damaging it 1/3th sure it wasent much but i prefer geting 30wp for damaging a vechical then dieing like 10 time's and geting 0 wp then again it cuild be abused bye having a ally on oposing team leting you damage its vechical to farm wp so thats probaly why they removed the wp on damage (look's at you know who and hes gang) |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1170
|
Posted - 2012.11.20 05:44:00 -
[13] - Quote
Valmar Shadereaver wrote:Noc Tempre wrote:Sorry, but even jesus missiles require a modicum of skill to get in the vicinity. You want a ******* locking weapon that is stronger than any other AV weapon? You're out of your mind thinking that's balanced. whine's the dropship pilot in wat kind of war theme dont you have AA turet's? so they take your troop transport out cause its weak and a troop transport your not a gunship pieced together whit premium armore or shield's like a gunship probaly will have so they make a AV turet specificly against vechical's sure itwl be less fun losing you stuf but you shud know you only take out what your wiling to lose if your not whiling to lose it dont take it out and stop whining about ppl wanting to add a realisticly usable game mechanic so your woried theyl make the AA/AV turret overpowerd i only say look at misile launcher atm and expet the same for probaly the artilery turet its a beta theyl add alot of stuf and change stuf to balance it after a build or a few depending on the urgency doesent give you dropship/tank pilots a reazon to deny a posible request wanne give you opinoin good thats very good but dont give a baised opinoin cause it otherwise might afect your eazy 0hk just buy a ton of dropship's at the 50% of event and get a fair opinoin that isent baised bye your use of vechical's im just sad some new players quit cause there furst game is against 2-3 dropship's and a tank we want to atract more active player's not push them all away cause some ppl love being lame whit equipment and make it near imposible to kill for one id love seeing the old wp system for vechicals return cause killing vechical's atm just isent worth it you get 150wp max if you destroy it you used to get wp for damaging it 1/3th sure it wasent much but i prefer geting 30wp for damaging a vechical then dieing like 10 time's and geting 0 wp then again it cuild be abused bye having a ally on oposing team leting you damage its vechical to farm wp so thats probaly why they removed the wp on damage (look's at you know who and hes gang)
You're an idiot putting your stupid words in my mouth. This is how vehicles should be https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=44816&find=unread. Autocannons (flak) are not yet in the game. Rails are brutal at anti-dropship already honestly. If people balance around pubs we might as well go buy black ops 2, because that game is fun as is while these proposed "fixes" that just traslate to "waaaaaa make vehicles cry too because I don't know how to aim without a lock function" would just leave a lot of militia shotguns running around an empty server.
Yes I'm very pissy today but I'm tired of defending this game from people who want to "balance" it into the ground. Fix the maps, fix the turrets, stop promoting "I win" mechanics.
+1 for recognizing the AV is thankless for the lack of WP and ISK. That does need fixed. |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2012.11.22 01:34:00 -
[14] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:You're an idiot putting your stupid words in my mouth. This is how vehicles should be https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=44816&find=unread. Autocannons (flak) are not yet in the game. Rails are brutal at anti-dropship already honestly. If people balance around pubs we might as well go buy black ops 2, because that game is fun as is while these proposed "fixes" that just traslate to "waaaaaa make vehicles cry too because I don't know how to aim without a lock function" would just leave a lot of militia shotguns running around an empty server. Yes I'm very pissy today but I'm tired of defending this game from people who want to "balance" it into the ground. Fix the maps, fix the turrets, stop promoting "I win" mechanics. +1 for recognizing the AV is thankless for the lack of WP and ISK. That does need fixed. I never whined for a thing. Investing in a high level turret costs a lot of money, as I'm sure you know Noc. 115,000 for each proto turret. Not to mention having to shell out for the ship and modules. Not to mention the SP investment.
However, you forget the other side of it. A dropship with AV turrets would be a bigger danger to ground vehicles and installations than ground units, installations and vehicles could ever be to it, simply because of it's ability to traverse the whole map unimpeded. And rail guns are NOT easy to aim at dropships, and wouldn't be even if they doubled the turn speed and gave it the ability to look all the way straight up.
Also, no one is going to throw a highly expensive turret on a vehicle that will go boom with a couple AV grenades or splash damage from a few proto missiles. They will have to skill into the vehicle as well as the turrets and modules in order to keep from being blown to bits by the other vehicles out there. If their vehicle trumps yours, so be it. If yours trumps theirs, so be it. You both skilled up into your chosen vehicle, so you should both have a fair shot at eachother.
Also, I never said it had to be "home in 'till it hits", simply letting the missile correct it's own trajectory slightly as it flys at high speed until it hits or misses would be enough. Also, I never said it had to be high damage, there could also be low damage but high ROF ones. Or slower flying but better homing. Or lower ROF, but higher damage.
Please don't think I'm just trying to shrug you off like you don't know of what you speak, I know well how good you are. I was hasty and in a foul mood myself earlier when I responded. I'm not asking for an unfair advantage, just another tool. And since there is no way this would be implemented before flack and flares and such, I don't fully follow your concern that this would be OP. |
Jason Pearson
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
742
|
Posted - 2012.11.22 02:40:00 -
[15] - Quote
tl;dr
Basically, what you're looking for is a Railgun. |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2012.11.22 03:26:00 -
[16] - Quote
Jason Pearson wrote:tl;dr
Basically, what you're looking for is a Railgun. Actually, no. I'm not. Have you used a railgun turret recently? I've used railgun turrets quite a bit to give them a chance. Useless, utterly useless. I shot a tank with around 3000 shields 4 times with an advanced level rail gun (low ROF high damage one, I forget the name), I could barely see that the damage had registered on it's health bar. Also, no tracking. None. At. All. Also, no flight time to correct angle.
Large rail gun installations and large turrets are great, but also not AV ready. If they could see almost straight up and turn 10-20% faster, I'd give them a pass. These do great against vehicles, but somehow firing the small turret at a tank is like spitting on Brock Sampson and giving him the finger. |
Jason Pearson
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
742
|
Posted - 2012.11.22 09:41:00 -
[17] - Quote
Overlord Zero wrote:Jason Pearson wrote:tl;dr
Basically, what you're looking for is a Railgun. Actually, no. I'm not. Have you used a railgun turret recently? I've used railgun turrets quite a bit to give them a chance. Useless, utterly useless. I shot a tank with around 3000 shields 4 times with an advanced level rail gun (low ROF high damage one, I forget the name), I could barely see that the damage had registered on it's health bar. Also, no tracking. None. At. All. Also, no flight time to correct angle. Large rail gun installations and large turrets are great, but also not AV ready. If they could see almost straight up and turn 10-20% faster, I'd give them a pass. These do great against vehicles, but somehow firing the small turret at a tank is like spitting on Brock Sampson and giving him the finger.
Yes, Yes I have. Hybrid Turrets are amazing, I 3shot RDVs with the large Railgun. Small Railguns are for hitting SMALL vehicles, they'll work fine against a lot of LAVs, even Dropships. Large Turrets are for Tanks, RDVs and installations. |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2012.11.22 10:19:00 -
[18] - Quote
Jason Pearson wrote:Overlord Zero wrote:Jason Pearson wrote:tl;dr
Basically, what you're looking for is a Railgun. Actually, no. I'm not. Have you used a railgun turret recently? I've used railgun turrets quite a bit to give them a chance. Useless, utterly useless. I shot a tank with around 3000 shields 4 times with an advanced level rail gun (low ROF high damage one, I forget the name), I could barely see that the damage had registered on it's health bar. Also, no tracking. None. At. All. Also, no flight time to correct angle. Large rail gun installations and large turrets are great, but also not AV ready. If they could see almost straight up and turn 10-20% faster, I'd give them a pass. These do great against vehicles, but somehow firing the small turret at a tank is like spitting on Brock Sampson and giving him the finger. Yes, Yes I have. Hybrid Turrets are amazing, I 3shot RDVs with the large Railgun. Small Railguns are for hitting SMALL vehicles, they'll work fine against a lot of LAVs, even Dropships. Large Turrets are for Tanks, RDVs and installations. I'll give them another go, I decided to quit on them after trying my hand at tank hunting with them (the whole point of having them on my LAV was for when they pulled a tank).
However that does not mean that is what I'm wanting either. I am wanting AV missile turrets, not an AA/ALAV turret. Also, it needs to lock onto vehicles and guide itself toward them (unlike the rail gun). Lastly, it should not be able to be shot at people (like the railgun can) unless the shot misses entirely and hit's someone. Basically it would be a usage placed between the railgun and missile as far as functionality goes. Something good for fighting all vehicles due to light homing and moderate damage, but not able to dumbfire on infantry OR vehicles, thereby giving vehicles time to maneuver out of the way during lock on.
Also, as I have suggested several times in the past, I would like to request a warning when ever you are being locked onto. Usually I request this for swarms, but I would require it for this as well. Any time you are in the recticule of a weapon that has started to lock onto you, you should have a warning alarm come from your vehicle to alert you. |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 05:05:00 -
[19] - Quote
^bump
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Bojo The Mighty
Bojo's School of the Trades
435
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 05:11:00 -
[20] - Quote
Sorry to rain on your parade but I just wrote this thread https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=50183&find=unread Which explains how the maps are very Dropship unfriendly via turret installations and supply depots. |
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Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 05:15:00 -
[21] - Quote
Sorry to rain on YOUR parade, but this is a months old post that has been revived and isn't up to date. However, AV turrets are still a good idea so it's been bumped.
Also, AV turrets on a dropship would be perfect for taking out installations and vehicles from the air. In fact, they may well make dropships relevant again since they would be perfect for hunting tanks. |
Bojo The Mighty
Bojo's School of the Trades
435
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 05:23:00 -
[22] - Quote
No I can't even get close enough to an installation, I've put rails on my DS once or twice and went HAV huntin, I really have, but the installations are really too commanding. Supply depots as well, in a flash someone can turn to Forge Wielding Willy but my DS can't transform back into an Autobot. |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 05:31:00 -
[23] - Quote
If only xDD But AV turrets would allow you to sit a good distance from installations and fire semi-homing missiles at them. If it's a railgun turret, keep enough distance to make it hard to aim at you while you fly around letting your gunners lock on and take it out. Same with supply depots AND CRU's, you can take them out from the air. Of course there will always be some people who will drop you from time to time, but AV turrets would definitely work well for all vehicles. Dropships especially, but definitely the rest as well.
Edit: Also, small rails suck against any vehicle but DS's. I know from experience, they are virtually worthless unless your aim is good enough to snipe players with them. |
Bojo The Mighty
Bojo's School of the Trades
435
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 05:40:00 -
[24] - Quote
Overlord Zero wrote:If only xDD But AV turrets would allow you to sit a good distance from installations and fire semi-homing missiles at them. If it's a railgun turret, keep enough distance to make it hard to aim at you while you fly around letting your gunners lock on and take it out. Same with supply depots AND CRU's, you can take them out from the air. Of course there will always be some people who will drop you from time to time, but AV turrets would definitely work well for all vehicles. Dropships especially, but definitely the rest as well.
Edit: Also, small rails suck against any vehicle but DS's. I know from experience, they are virtually worthless unless your aim is good enough to snipe players with them.
Pinky Swear me that they shouldn't be on the turret installations that already scatter the maps |
Overlord Zero
Doomheim
75
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 05:44:00 -
[25] - Quote
There is already a missile installation, and there is only one variant of installation for each turret type, so I think you're safe |
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