lol

Look, a lot of people have been throwing out a lot of ideas for balancing the current one-man tanks against AV weapons. I've been a proponent of separate seats for driver and gunner for a while, and rather than insist on a 4-man tank, I even conceded to the idea of giving the driver the front turret.

Obviously people have really strong opinion on this, and I'd just like to say that I think the separate positions should be tested. We've already had changes to game mechanics that were reverted based on negative feedback, and I'm sure this would follow the same path if it was found to be more detrimental than helpful.

I'm not trying to say that our (the separation proponents) way is the best or only way. I just think we should give it a shot, see if it works or not.

Huh, that was faster than I expected.
Anything more constructive to add?

I feel the seperation idea is the most sound of them. Doesn't change the numbers side of the debate, and it gives the driver more control over modules, which will be very important if cap comes in.

Plus it brings it into line with like, every other vehicle in the game. Until a one-man fighter comes out, there doesn't seem to be much planned for single-man vehicles, unless you call an MTAC one.

fighters, gunships and mtac all one manned
ppl need to stop ******* comparing a tank to a transport vehicle like a derpship
this is why we get a bunch of dumb changes to the game then CCP has to go and undo said dumb changes wasting time.

as i told my good friend mobius what ppl gonna do when MTACs and Fighters and gunships come into play? QQ about making them need more than 1?
make 1 person use the legs of the MTAC and walk while another fires?

and an FYI to the ppl out there ever thought that maybe.....JUST MAYBE tankin takes some decent skill to hav to operate the movment, main turret and module management?

ppl think its sooo easy with these glass tanks to just wtfpwn ppl........no its not , not unless u have...guess what....infantry support or gunners in ur tank backin u up.

Solo tanks almost always go down if faced with DECENT AV players , either that or hes forced back to being a non factor in the game.

make 1 person use the legs of the MTAC and walk while another fires?

Y do nerfs or "balances" always have to be proposed in the form of changing the damage of something or changing the way something works. We have a skill system ppl rather than change the damage or the HP or who drives and who shoots, change the skill reqs by making it harder and more exclusive to have a tank. Honestly I don't understand y there isn't MAVs (medium attack vehicles) this would balance HAVs (tanks) better than anything. Cus u make mav skill require the lav skill at 3 and then the hav skill requires the mav skill to 3. Thus rewarding the dedicated few who decide to go for hav.

Someone is going to make this game and it will be awesome. Unless they **** it up. Chicken fights at the local swimming pool in August when you were a kid? Kibasen on sports day? People say they want fun, what more could you ask for?

Someone is going to make this game and it will be awesome. Unless they **** it up. Chicken fights at the local swimming pool in August when you were a kid? Kibasen on sports day? People say they want fun, what more could you ask for?

Mobius testing this is a bad idea because of the limited timeline this game is on to launch. Obviously we don't know for sure wat the timeline is but so far all evidence tht I have seen points to December 4th (this is just my speculation) this would coincide with Eve's winter update. Two months thts not a lot of time, we haven't even really tested the eve/dust link yet which is supposed to be a highlight of the game. So it comes down to do you want the limited developer resources working on new tank mechanics or do u want them fixing bugs on current and future PLANNED content so tht we don't have a broken game on launch? I for one would like a not broken game.

I haven't once compared the HAV to the Dropship. One is a transport and the other is an attack vehicle. Despite what you might think, the necessity of a gunner is the only disadvantage of this system, and it has a very significant advantage of giving the HAV even greater ability to control the battlefield, while eliminating the main source of anti-tank complaints, that being that it takes several people to kill a vehicle that can be operated by only one. With all the player-made Corps we have cropping up all over the place, it shouldn't be too hard to find competent gunners.

I had another idea, though: a Vehicle Commander position that inherits module control no matter what seat you choose. Thus, the owner of the tank could control the modules and gun, while leaving someone else to focus on the driving. I mean, in reality the tank commander has backup systems that allow him to operate the main gun from his position if the gunner is killed, for instance. Why not have a similar system for tanks in Dust?

I've got a thread on turrets and AV and damage types and how they interact in feedback that covers my opinions nicely.

Not sure how to link that thread as I get yelled at by the board every time I try to do so.

I haven't once compared the HAV to the Dropship. One is a transport and the other is an attack vehicle. Despite what you might think, the necessity of a gunner is the only disadvantage of this system, and it has a very significant advantage of giving the HAV even greater ability to control the battlefield, while eliminating the main source of anti-tank complaints, that being that it takes several people to kill a vehicle that can be operated by only one. With all the player-made Corps we have cropping up all over the place, it shouldn't be too hard to find competent gunners.

I had another idea, though: a Vehicle Commander position that inherits module control no matter what seat you choose. Thus, the owner of the tank could control the modules and gun, while leaving someone else to focus on the driving. I mean, in reality the tank commander has backup systems that allow him to operate the main gun from his position if the gunner is killed, for instance. Why not have a similar system for tanks in Dust?

I am not a tanker but a good friend of mine is a tanker. He is pretty good not to say he is the best but as far as a tank goes your mainly as good as the tanks support be it gunners or infantry support. My point is that yes he is afraid of forge guns, by all means he should be they hurt a lot, a whole lot to be exact but, he only uses a Lv 1 tank he does not use a marauder. Let everyone fear the days when marauders are running the field on the reg. As much work that it takes for a forge to drop a tank now I could only imagine the work it will be going against a marauder or black ops.

I think that it is hard to drop a HAV but it is a HAV a three maned death machine on tracks. My only fear is for the balancing that comes into play later for high level HAVs and gear.

As far as the BF3 no I didn't play a lot of it. Those tanks are extremely easy to drop by one man. I remember in bad company 2 that you could take down a tank with no problem by yourself with a little bit of anti tank skill. My main point here is that this is a different game. So it is going to be different and it will be fun as long as it is balanced.

Due to us moving to the main server being a huge ordeal they will have to make it coincide with a large eve patch to try to minimize downtime (doing otherwise would be bad business) so I'm pretty sure December 4th - 11th is a safe bet for us going into open beta because we will need to be on a much larger server for open beta player numbers. If not in early December then the second week of January. Ccp has held off a patch for like a month before but normally its a matter of a few days if they have to hold it back. We have ppl complaining now tht the game feels lifeless due to a lack of options, it'll be a lot worse if we go into open beta lacking planned features. So eventhough its speculation its looks like a pretty safe bet. And yet ur proposing something tht could take a month to code. Then it has to go through the whole Sony QA process. It just seems impossible in the amount of time.

Are you trying to use the hyperlink function, or just pasting it?

Look, a lot of people have been throwing out a lot of ideas for balancing the current one-man tanks against AV weapons. I've been a proponent of separate seats for driver and gunner for a while, and rather than insist on a 4-man tank, I even conceded to the idea of giving the driver the front turret.

Obviously people have really strong opinion on this, and I'd just like to say that I think the separate positions should be tested. We've already had changes to game mechanics that were reverted based on negative feedback, and I'm sure this would follow the same path if it was found to be more detrimental than helpful.

I'm not trying to say that our (the separation proponents) way is the best or only way. I just think we should give it a shot, see if it works or not.

I actually like this.
Vehicles need to be a threat, but to be a threat it should require effort and teamwork. Mavado can complain "THIS IS NOT A DROPSHIP NRGGGHHHARAGE." As much as the guy wants, but tbh I don't think I'd be nearly as effective if I didn't have separate guns (blahblah a Dropship isn't a gunship but let's face it, they pretty much are right now).

As this game is a beta, we should try the following, bring in new 3 man tanks with the gunner controlling a small turret and then bring in some 4 man tanks with the Driver/Gunners being separate. A Tank Driver will still get SP from kills and doesn't always have to be moving. Can always switch from Driver to Gunner if you want to be a sitting duck, OR, get a crew together. Same with Gunships. I plan on being a Gunship Pilot and I hope I do require a gunner.

Also, DUST isn't ready for release. We're in a Closed beta, next step is an Open Beta, okay lads? Release is probably sometime next year.