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Olav Grey-Mane
The Exemplars
58
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:19:00 -
[1] - Quote
So I remember, what was it E3? Gamescom? any ways something like that were the director said that Dust is a free to play but NOT a pay to win game, so every one is still on equal terms weather they buy the augur or not.... well I go on the PSN and see you can spend 100 bucks to get a wack load of isk and agur or what ever, your telling me that the people who buy that won't be super over powered and wooping the other teams?
this looks like a pay to win situation to me.
Thoughts? |
SoTa PoP
Internal Error.
Negative-Feedback
1772
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:24:00 -
[2] - Quote
Sure, here's a thought. You paid 100 bucks to get where a few hours of play got me. Whose really the winner here? |
R F Gyro
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
315
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
"Pay to win" means you can spend real cash to get something that it is not possible to get with in-game currency, and that gives a material advantage. That is not the case with Dust.
Advantages you can buy with real cash in Dust are...
- Fancy coloured items
- Less grinding for isk
- Ability to voice chat in non-combat situations
You're 100 bucks guy can still get his butt handed to him on a plate by someone who has never spent a single penny on the game, but that has bought equivalent items with ISK, made through grinding.
That's why Dust is not play-to-win. |
Aighun
Zumari Force Projection
Caldari State
666
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:28:00 -
[4] - Quote
I think I am experiencing something like, deja vu? I just have a funny feeling I've read this thread before somewhere... |
Lonewolf514
79
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
with sp caps he's got a point to an extent, some players that are willing to spend lots of cash will be able to use higher tier items a lot sooner thus making them more competative ie gives them a definate advantage. |
Tony Calif
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
2002
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:31:00 -
[6] - Quote
Yeah. Bottom line it's free to play & pay to win. Always will be. Because who's going to spend $$$ on stuff that is exactly the same as ISK stuff. Get over it. |
Lonewolf514
79
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:33:00 -
[7] - Quote
Tony Calif wrote:Yeah. Bottom line it's free to play & pay to win. Always will be. Because who's going to spend $$$ on stuff that is exactly the same as ISK stuff. Get over it.
last time i checked aur items gave people who didnt have enough time to play the ability to stay competative. put in a skillpoint cap and it makes them items P2W
remove the skill point advantages the aur items give.  or it's pay 2 win. |
Logi Bro
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
836
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:34:00 -
[8] - Quote
R F Gyro wrote:"Pay to win" means you can spend real cash to get something that it is not possible to get with in-game currency, and that gives a material advantage. That is not the case with Dust. Advantages you can buy with real cash in Dust are...
- Fancy coloured items
- Less grinding for isk
- Ability to voice chat in non-combat situations
You're 100 bucks guy can still get his butt handed to him on a plate by someone who has never spent a single penny on the game, but that has bought equivalent items with ISK, made through grinding. That's why Dust is not play-to-win.
Actually, you also can get items that have lower CPU/PG requirements, which can then in turn allow you to equip better modules, so there are benefits, just not enough to call it P2W. |
Rorek IronBlood
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
746
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:38:00 -
[9] - Quote
One thing to say honestly -- player market.
[ISK > AUR] |
Lonewolf514
79
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Posted - 2012.10.21 17:42:00 -
[10] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:R F Gyro wrote:"Pay to win" means you can spend real cash to get something that it is not possible to get with in-game currency, and that gives a material advantage. That is not the case with Dust. Advantages you can buy with real cash in Dust are...
- Fancy coloured items
- Less grinding for isk
- Ability to voice chat in non-combat situations
You're 100 bucks guy can still get his butt handed to him on a plate by someone who has never spent a single penny on the game, but that has bought equivalent items with ISK, made through grinding. That's why Dust is not play-to-win. Actually, you also can get items that have lower CPU/PG requirements, which can then in turn allow you to equip better modules, so there are benefits, just not enough to call it P2W.
dont forget the skillpoint requirements of the items are lower. that's the biggest imbalance.
this is what they get for listening to morons in IRC and U turning the whole game on a whim with little or no thought or considerations at all. |
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ugg reset
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
234
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Posted - 2012.10.21 18:05:00 -
[11] - Quote
When the market is opens we will be able to pay other players ISK for AUR weapon that they bought. So, if you have the Captal; be it ISK or cold hard ca$h, you will be able to use anything your opponent can use (barring things you don't have the skills to use).
Here is the way i see it; Dust corps with wealthy EVE benefactors will rely solely on ISK to get the job done as there is lots of it out there. Corps and lone wolf Mercs without these connections will use AUR to skill up (use AUR to get ISK ) and/or expensive Hardware. This is because for the price of a combo meal at Mc'Donalds you can buy hours of decent equipment.
Right now is the best time to buy and test AUR because CCP is refunding us each time they release a new build. Once the game is set in motion and AUR is truly consumed I think it will be a rarity to see this Equipment. Then Again I could be horribly wrong. Some people really care about their internet Spaceship Games.
I'm looking at you GOONS. |
Lonewolf514
79
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Posted - 2012.10.21 18:18:00 -
[12] - Quote
im guessing that aur tems will be bound to account. not tradable. |
Zekain Kade
BetaMax.
931
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Posted - 2012.10.21 18:26:00 -
[13] - Quote
R F Gyro wrote:"Pay to win" means you can spend real cash to get something that it is not possible to get with in-game currency, and that gives a material advantage. That is not the case with Dust. Advantages you can buy with real cash in Dust are...
- Fancy coloured items
- Less grinding for isk
- Ability to voice chat in non-combat situations
You're 100 bucks guy can still get his butt handed to him on a plate by someone who has never spent a single penny on the game, but that has bought equivalent items with ISK, made through grinding. That's why Dust is not play-to-win. you forgot boosters/ less grinding for SP.
This game honestly isn't in a bad spot with hoe AUR, and ISK items are managed. Every item has a counter ISK variant that is either equal, or greater then it's AUR version.
the merc pack items are really the only special items, but these items are also nearly equal to their isk versions. |
ugg reset
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
234
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Posted - 2012.10.21 18:39:00 -
[14] - Quote
Lonewolf514 wrote:im guessing that aur tems will be bound to account. not tradable.
what makes you say that? tradable micro transactions aren't unprecedented. This is already happening in EVE.
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Fivetimes Infinity
Immobile Infantry
1086
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Posted - 2012.10.21 18:55:00 -
[15] - Quote
First of all, it's aurum, not augur.
You can buy things in the game that save your time and whatever, but not things that give you a clear advantage over other players in the game. Getting +50% SP for a game doesn't make you more likely to win a given fight against a given player. Having a BPO militia-quality item won't make you more likely to win against someone using a 400 ISK militia item. Being able to voice chat in a corp channel won't help you win either.
So it isn't pay-to-win. You don't get actual combat advantages over other players by paying AUR. |
Maken Tosch
Planetary Response Organisation
Test Friends Please Ignore
1591
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Posted - 2012.10.21 20:04:00 -
[16] - Quote
You get the aurum items just one skill level sooner and thus help a cash filled player get ahead. But that item can easily be matched by another player who has no life (which is most of us) and gained equivalent item with just ISK and has gun game. |
Lonewolf514
79
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Posted - 2012.10.21 20:06:00 -
[17] - Quote
i checked earlier they changed it , no advantage now. sure i checked about a week ago and there were advantages, i posted about it. probably didnt like me pointing out it was p2w. |
Ten-Sidhe
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
414
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Posted - 2012.10.21 20:06:00 -
[18] - Quote
EvE allowed trading plex bought in real money for isk, this was to prevent(somewhat) the third party sites selling in game items for cash. If you could buy a plex and sell it for isk to buy the items you what there is never a reason to use third party re-seller. This prevents bans from violating the eula and gives the profit to the game company instead of some macro farmers.
Once launched some people will start months or years behind, the aur items don't cause any where near as much gap as will just happen from start times.
Only thing I could see becoming pay to win are adv and proto bpo, this would destroy the risk reward and let the users gain isk rapidly. They would be okay as a annual or semi annual tournament reward, but selling them on market for aur would cause problems. I think ccp are aware of this, so I think there is little danger |
Lonewolf514
79
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Posted - 2012.10.21 20:11:00 -
[19] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:You get the aurum items just one skill level sooner and thus help a cash filled player get ahead. But that item can easily be matched by another player who has no life (which is most of us) and gained equivalent item with just ISK and has gun game.
the problem would have come about with players that maxed out skill cap then used aur items also. anyway they nerfed it and shot themselves in the foot, less sales now. they are defo forging ahead with skill caps then and are balancing the whole game around it. seems that way anyway. |
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