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Fivetimes Infinity
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Posted - 2012.10.11 16:32:00 -
[1] - Quote
Once again, World of Tanks has an excellent system to emulate for this. If you damage/kill a friendly, you are fined ISK from your winnings and you have to compensate the victim monetarily as well. In effect, you get a big ISK fine at the end of the game, and the person you killed gets a portion of that fine added to their own wallet. If you inflict too much damage against your own team, you become designated as a team killer, and anyone on your own team is able to kill you as much as they want without repercussion. If you get designated as a team killer too much, you get suspended from the game temporarily. I think you can even be banned if you keep team killing.
The exception to this would be if the person you damage has joined a squad with you or is on your corp. People in your squad/corp can be shot/killed without penalty, the idea being that you're friends and the TK'ing is either in good fun, part of the plan, or if it is malicious, something you can avoid by leaving the squad/corp.
What's interesting is that, in WoT, the penalty for team damage/killing is actually fairly intelligent. That is, if you shoot a friendly one time, in close proximity to an enemy, the penalty is less than if you were to shoot a friendly repeatedly in an area where no enemies are. The system actually distinguishes between deliberate and accidental team killing, and gives harsher penalties for blatantly malicious team killing, while being a bit more lenient on one accidental hit from a missed shot.
I like the idea of people having to watch their fire, but as the OP demonstrates, if you simply turn FF on and wash your hands of the result it'd be the end of Dust. Having strong negatives for teamkilling in the Instant Battle "highsec" games we're currently playing would be a required step. |
Fivetimes Infinity
Immobile Infantry
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Posted - 2012.10.11 19:30:00 -
[2] - Quote
Ridgeway Semper Fi wrote:They won't do an ISK fine for team killing, because in EVE there is nothing to stop me from killing corpmates, or groupmates other than the fact that I don't do it. Remember that a big part of this game is espoinage and spying. Some of the most well known people in EVE are ones that destroyed entire corps and alliances. If you can do it in EVE you'll be able to do it in DUST. I can't wait to see all the whining and bitching and complaining once they flip the Friendly Fire switch. The only repercussion may be that you'll lose some Security Status if they have something like that. However, they don't track kills in EVE except on Killboards, there is no stats page for that kind of stuff and I don't think there will be in DUST. So ya'll can keep all the wishful thinking going. It's gonna be alot of TKing, and backstabbing in this game, so you might as well brace yourself for it.
Just as you helpfully pointed out this ain't World of Tanks, nor is it EVE. It's a F2P FPS game designed to be appealing to casual FPS fans and hardcore EVE players alike. Having unrestricted friendly fire where nothing happens to you for killing your erstwhile friends is not compatible with the first part. That said, you'll recall I wrote that a sensible exception to the rule of friendly fire fines is if the person is either in your corp or your squad.
And if you need a way for fines/etc to work within the context of the game, it's easy. You're a mercenary. Instant Battles are actually contracts you sign up to fight for. Clearly there is some sort of mercenary agency serving as a middleman between the empires which want mercs fighting for them, and the mercs themselves. It would be a simple thing to conclude that this middleman finding your contracts for you would impose sanctions on you for violating the terms of your contract (that is, "don't kill your friends"). If you repeatedly violate your contract, your contract gets revoked and you're a rogue merc on the field, fair game for any of your former team mates who want to settle the score. If you repeatedly have your contract revoked, you're prohibited from acquiring new contracts until X time has elapsed.
Honestly, it makes perfect sense, and it works amazingly well in WoT. The only question is whether CCP wants to put the work in to create such a friendly fire system, or whether they'd rather just skip the verisimilitude factor and just disable FF except for corp wars.
Quote:This ain't World of Tanks either so that penalty system isn't going to apply either.
Dust is nonetheless a game trying to do things relatively realistically, as WoT does. Not having FF at all would be a bit odd, but letting people get away with TK'ing would be disastrous. An automated, very intelligent system for punishing friendly fire is a good compromise between having FF for the sake of "realism", let's call it, and not having FF for the sake of people not idly ruining the games of other people. |
Fivetimes Infinity
Immobile Infantry
1086
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Posted - 2012.10.12 04:22:00 -
[3] - Quote
Crimson Moon V wrote:Griefing is to much a part of the eve universe. I thought new eden was harsh? We need FF.
Nullsec is harsh, the rest isn't so much, which is why most players are in the fairly safe empire areas. EVE has CONCORD and security status to restrict killing friendly targets. Dust needs something similar.
This is the bit you don't seem to grasp. In EVE, if you want to play in relative safety and not worry about another player killing you, you can do that quite easily most of the time. Avoid warring corps, avoid lowsec, don't fly something someone might want to suicide-gank. The bottom line is that people can opt out of the backstabbing, the murder, the politics, the bubble camps, and just play a game about flying a space ship.
In Dust, people need to be able to just play a game about shooting people with guns. Indulging your fantasy of making strangers on the Internet angry by shooting them in the back repeatedly isn't worth more than giving people who just want to play a good, fun FPS game what they're after. |
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