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Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.10.05 10:26:00 - [1] - Quote Can't even think of a game that doesn't have it, so I'm bringing it up again. Movement feels stiff and awkward without it, and it would improve the gameplay by a large portion. I really don't know why you folks at CCP are neglecting it, the human body bends and twists, it isn't made out of steel. Edit: Apparently I have not made myself clear, or some of you simply want to argue because you can. I am not suggesting that we be able to sprint sideways. What I am suggesting however, is that while sprinting, you be able to twist your hips/torso to allow for slightly diagonal movement, while still looking forward. This allows you to keep your eyes on whatever/wherever you are running towards. Go play MAG, Blacklight: Retribution, CoD, Battlefield, or any other FPS game you can think of, and try sprinting. Are you only able to run directly forward, and in order to mildly change direction do you have to change where you are looking? Or does your character begin to move slightly diagonal if you move your control stick slightly to the side (or for KBM players, sprint with Shift+W+A/D)? Edit: Go running some day, and try turning your head to look around without changing direction. It works, I promise; you aren't going to "blue screen" or anything. To make myself clear about how this applies to my suggestion - diagonal sprinting means sprinting diagonally from your line of sight. Essentially I am saying that you should be able to turn your head and mildly your torso while running.
Avenger 245 Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 477	Posted - 2012.10.05 12:10:00 - [2] - Quote No
Laurent Cazaderon Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 1155	Posted - 2012.10.05 12:16:00 - [3] - Quote Avenger 245 wrote: No whoah, that's a constructive post.... To the OP, could you be more clear about your suggestion ? I 'm having trouble seeing what you mean exactly.
Seran Jinkar Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 214	Posted - 2012.10.05 12:38:00 - [4] - Quote The human body isn't made of steel .. while dropsuits are .. somehow ^^
Tony Calif Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 2002	Posted - 2012.10.05 12:59:00 - [5] - Quote Agreed. Movement is crap.
Ranger SnakeBlood OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 126	Posted - 2012.10.05 13:35:00 - [6] - Quote I disagree and see movement now as a massive stepin theright direction even if it was a tad over done but its far better than the joke that was last build, now it take being good at it to be able to dodge bullets yes it is still do able its just not as easy get some practic at the new movement and you will find its still usable its just not the end all as it was in last build
GOLD LEAD3R Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 22	Posted - 2012.10.05 14:43:00 - [7] - Quote Ranger SnakeBlood wrote: I disagree and see movement now as a massive stepin theright direction even if it was a tad over done but its far better than the joke that was last build, now it take being good at it to be able to dodge bullets yes it is still do able its just not as easy get some practic at the new movement and you will find its still usable its just not the end all as it was in last build What people don't seem to grasp is that last build was a joke because of hit detection, not because of movement. Hit detection has been vastly improved now, while movement has been nerfed. The movement nerf was not needed.
Khortez D Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 51	Posted - 2012.10.05 14:58:00 - [8] - Quote GOLD LEAD3R wrote: Ranger SnakeBlood wrote: I disagree and see movement now as a massive stepin theright direction even if it was a tad over done but its far better than the joke that was last build, now it take being good at it to be able to dodge bullets yes it is still do able its just not as easy get some practic at the new movement and you will find its still usable its just not the end all as it was in last build What people don't seem to grasp is that last build was a joke because of hit detection, not because of movement. Hit detection has been vastly improved now, while movement has been nerfed. The movement nerf was not needed. last time i said this, i was ignored every time i swear
Ranger SnakeBlood OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 126	Posted - 2012.10.05 16:04:00 - [9] - Quote GOLD LEAD3R wrote: Ranger SnakeBlood wrote: I disagree and see movement now as a massive stepin theright direction even if it was a tad over done but its far better than the joke that was last build, now it take being good at it to be able to dodge bullets yes it is still do able its just not as easy get some practic at the new movement and you will find its still usable its just not the end all as it was in last build What people don't seem to grasp is that last build was a joke because of hit detection, not because of movement. Hit detection has been vastly improved now, while movement has been nerfed. The movement nerf was not needed. Yes but what i suspect it was the strain that the movement at CQC was putting on the system was most likly causing that same with frame rate drops when does it happen when in a CQC fight i dont know if it is what cause hit detection but if i have to choose between hit detection and strafe speed or the way it is now ill vote for this build every time, besides the strafe was too fast in last build and needed to be reduced for all suits to make the game feel more weighted it just felt like unreal turny last build which died very fast on concole, but it was over don i think a 5 to 10 % increase would probably be enough not back to last build
Goric Rumis Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 80	Posted - 2012.10.05 16:53:00 - [10] - Quote I don't think this is a good idea, if you're saying what I think you're saying. You can change the direction you're sprinting by turning. It doesn't really make much sense to sprint diagonally. Have you ever tried (in real life)? The reasoning behind diagonal and lateral movement in a game is that you can't move in one direction and face another without making the controls really awkward. So in real life, you could be running from cover to cover, spraying bullets at your attackers to distract them (you wouldn't hit anything, but you could spray bullets). In a game, you can't run one direction and shoot in another, so they introduced strafing. But since you can't shoot while sprinting anyway, there's really no need for this. GOLD LEAD3R wrote: What people don't seem to grasp is that last build was a joke because of hit detection, not because of movement. Hit detection has been vastly improved now, while movement has been nerfed. The movement nerf was not needed. Thing is, I'm not convinced they're separate issues. The patch notes suggest they reduced strafe speed as part of the hit detection fix. Which means they might not be able to bring it back up to the previous level without creating hit detection problems again. Maybe we'll see improvements in the next build that allow them to bring the strafe speed back up.

Wakko03 Better Hide R Die 134	Posted - 2012.10.05 17:15:00 - [11] - Quote Actually, with my Move in a Sharpshooter and my bounding boxes set up just right I could run left and shoot right IF I was fast enough..... sadly the move is more of an after-thought for this game just like the others it is in.... still have yet to see a DEV or even a GM post about the MOVE. How has someone never run diagonally in real life.... I guess football players (both American and World [soccer]) players are wizards and are in league with lucifer. I still want the ability to throw a grenade like a man, and not have to come to a complete stop in order to chuck it.... would love to be able to throw it while on the run.
Ten-Sidhe Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 414	Posted - 2012.10.05 17:18:00 - [12] - Quote I don't see the need to strafe while sprinting, the forward movement without sprint is already a good running pace. A scouts movement is just under record marathon pace, and its sprint is near Olympic sprint, and those athletes are not carrying gear. Using sprint button while strafing to speed up a little(still able to fire) at cost of stamina would be good, I don't see need to strafe while sprinting, turning works fine. I have tried to sprint to side, you trip on own legs in few feet, it's much easier to sprint backwards. Very tiring to do though, and so easy to run in to things.
Goric Rumis Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 80	Posted - 2012.10.05 17:37:00 - [13] - Quote Wakko03 wrote: How has someone never run diagonally in real life.... I guess football players (both American and World [soccer]) players are wizards and are in league with lucifer. Not just run, sprint. If you're running diagonally you're sacrificing speed. The body just isn't built to do it, there's too much foot-over-foot action, it ends up looking like a dance. I've never seen football players sprint diagonally, they always turn and run forward (which we are perfectly capable of doing in this game). Perhaps more importantly, I don't see how it would add anything to the game.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.10.06 01:34:00 - [14] - Quote Maybe you guys sprint with a back brace on or something, but I know that when I run around a bend, I tilt and twist slightly. I'm not talking about sprinting sideways, just being able to run slightly diagonally. Edit: I also want to point out I'm not suggesting any type of speed increase.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.10.09 21:05:00 - [15] - Quote Bump.
Mira Adari Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 79	Posted - 2012.10.09 21:18:00 - [16] - Quote No need to bump this pointless thread. It is not possible to sprint sideways, in game or real life. You would stumble over your own feet. To sprint you need muscles in your legs and butt that you cannot efficiently use in a sideways movement. These muscles are made for forward propulsion. I don't care what you think you are doing when you are running sideways, but it is not sprinting.
Orin the Freak Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 334	Posted - 2012.10.09 21:27:00 - [17] - Quote I agree, They need to un-nerf strafing. It feels like i'm trying to strafe through tar. it overpowers heavies, and nerfs the hell out of scout suits, who's main defense in previous builds was their speed tanking ability. Now they just ... die. a lot. Your only chance in a scout suit now is to hope you can either get transversal on them and somehow find cover, or try to get them at a distance (sniping). Scout suits are no longer nearly as effective at close range. you're better off in an assault suit. Bring back strafing, keep hit detection the way it is, and everyone will be happy, except the heavies with no gun game. (or the suckers with no gun game anyway) FYI: Gun Game = the ability to dodge bullets whilst still hitting your target. currently dodging bullets is almost out of the question. I prefer dancing over ... whatever the hell you call the crap people are doing now (duck and covering?)
CaDaVeR 85 KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 15	Posted - 2012.10.09 21:35:00 - [18] - Quote Orin the Freak wrote: I agree, They need to un-nerf strafing. It feels like i'm trying to strafe through tar. it overpowers heavies, and nerfs the hell out of scout suits, who's main defense in previous builds was their speed tanking ability. Now they just ... die. a lot. Your only chance in a scout suit now is to hope you can either get transversal on them and somehow find cover, or try to get them at a distance (sniping). Scout suits are no longer nearly as effective at close range. you're better off in an assault suit. Bring back strafing, keep hit detection the way it is, and everyone will be happy, except the heavies with no gun game. (or the suckers with no gun game anyway) FYI: Gun Game = the ability to dodge bullets whilst still hitting your target. currently dodging bullets is almost out of the question. I prefer dancing over ... whatever the hell you call the crap people are doing now (duck and covering?) THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS ^^^^^^^ (Sounds like you play the same way I do... DID) Why did CCP break my lovely Scout suits? And just as you add the cool Valor suit as well. It's useless. UTTERLY USELESS I SAY!
CaDaVeR 85 KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 15	Posted - 2012.10.09 21:39:00 - [19] - Quote Mira Adari wrote: No need to bump this pointless thread. It is not possible to sprint sideways, in game or real life. You would stumble over your own feet. To sprint you need muscles in your legs and butt that you cannot efficiently use in a sideways movement. These muscles are made for forward propulsion. I don't care what you think you are doing when you are running sideways, but it is not sprinting. I agree with this entirely. But the fact is Scouts got nerfed. And are now useless. Unless you're going to snipe. But then you might as well use an Assault suit anyway (and sniping sucks ). I want my speedy sidestep back. Having the same strafe speed as Assault is ridiculous.
Mira Adari Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 79	Posted - 2012.10.09 21:53:00 - [20] - Quote CaDaVeR 85 wrote: Mira Adari wrote: No need to bump this pointless thread. It is not possible to sprint sideways, in game or real life. You would stumble over your own feet. To sprint you need muscles in your legs and butt that you cannot efficiently use in a sideways movement. These muscles are made for forward propulsion. I don't care what you think you are doing when you are running sideways, but it is not sprinting. I agree with this entirely. But the fact is Scouts got nerfed. And are now useless. Unless you're going to snipe. But then you might as well use an Assault suit anyway (and sniping sucks ). I want my speedy sidestep back. Having the same strafe speed as Assault is ridiculous. My scout uses a shotgun and is far from useless...

ridhiem L.L.A.M.A. Relativity Alliance 6	Posted - 2012.10.09 23:53:00 - [21] - Quote Orin the Freak wrote: I agree, They need to un-nerf strafing. It feels like i'm trying to strafe through tar. it overpowers heavies, and nerfs the hell out of scout suits, who's main defense in previous builds was their speed tanking ability. Now they just ... die. a lot. Your only chance in a scout suit now is to hope you can either get transversal on them and somehow find cover, or try to get them at a distance (sniping). Scout suits are no longer nearly as effective at close range. you're better off in an assault suit. Bring back strafing, keep hit detection the way it is, and everyone will be happy, except the heavies with no gun game. (or the suckers with no gun game anyway) FYI: Gun Game = the ability to dodge bullets whilst still hitting your target. currently dodging bullets is almost out of the question. I prefer dancing over ... whatever the hell you call the crap people are doing now (duck and covering?) Scout suits can hide fairly well now with higher dropsuit command and profile dampening skills. in fact, get those up high enough with endurance, mobility, and vigor skills, and you can pretty much be a literal speedy ninja on dust and just sneak up and melee folks constantly while planting remote explosives near objective hack points ahead of your team in case reds try to take it over. In general i don't think they were meant to be the close range champions anyways..or even be considered effective for close range roles. other options were developed for that. I can have most of my skills pumped in to assault rifles & light weapons, and still die horribly to some light footed $%$ with a militia assault rifle or militia scrambler pistol without even hitting them once when they are dancing around in circles and hopping about. ESPECIALLY with heavy dropsuits who cant turn fast enough to face whoever is spinning in circles behind you. More HP, stronger version of the same class of weapon, better support skills, and you can still die easily to someone with simple light assault or scout setups. Its got little to do with "gun game" or a lack of personal ability and more to do with just a really slow turning suit that cant cope with the element of surprise. Or the element of surprise period. Dodging bullets is still very alive and active and the only real skill it takes is spawning behind someone or sneaking about with the new signature profile stuffs where you can get the first hits off and just spin around as soon as you get your first shot going. By the time your target can even react or fire back, they are more then half way dead. As is, the folks with the highest kill counts are precision strike spammers, the human dreidels with militia assault rifles or shotguns, and sneaky tanks when they are actually out and about. Well, from what I have seen anyways. Could be nice if we could see some stats or a page on the most commonly used weapons all around and let the numbers speak for themselves.
KEROSIINI-TERO Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 248	Posted - 2012.10.10 00:01:00 - [22] - Quote The sprint is such a powerful action already. No need to buff it anymore.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.10.10 02:53:00 - [23] - Quote I am talking about slight diagonal movement while sprinting, not sprinting sideways. So sad that you guys somehow don't understand this, considering the "never played a game that doesn't have this" part. Honestly, have you ever played a game in which you could sprint sideways?
Goric Rumis Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 80	Posted - 2012.10.10 05:07:00 - [24] - Quote Veigar Mordekaiser wrote: I am talking about slight diagonal movement while sprinting, not sprinting sideways. So sad that you guys somehow don't understand this, considering the "never played a game that doesn't have this" part. Honestly, have you ever played a game in which you could sprint sideways? Honestly, I don't see what the problem is. If it's only slight, why not just turn slightly? Since we can turn while sprinting. And also, I don't know what games you have or haven't played. I honestly haven't tried to sprint diagonally in a game. Never really occurred to me since I don't do it in real life. Sorry your thread got hijacked into another strafing thread, though. People tried to do that to mine, before it died.
Velvet Overkill Seraphim Auxiliaries CRONOS. 104	Posted - 2012.10.10 05:28:00 - [25] - Quote Goric Rumis wrote: Veigar Mordekaiser wrote: I am talking about slight diagonal movement while sprinting, not sprinting sideways. So sad that you guys somehow don't understand this, considering the "never played a game that doesn't have this" part. Honestly, have you ever played a game in which you could sprint sideways? Honestly, I don't see what the problem is. If it's only slight, why not just turn slightly? Since we can turn while sprinting. And also, I don't know what games you have or haven't played. I honestly haven't tried to sprint diagonally in a game. Never really occurred to me since I don't do it in real life. Sorry your thread got hijacked into another strafing thread, though. People tried to do that to mine, before it died. He's not talking about sprinting fully diagonally, what he's proposing is a slightt diagonal movement while sprinting. For the record I want to say that I can run diagonally by having my legs cross and it does look like a dance. Sprinting takes more concentration and effort though and increases the chance of me tripping over my legs if I do it for too long. Anyway what I'm trying to say is that there should be slight diagonal running, as in when you sprint slightly diagonal, it turns from sprinting to running since its harder to do. Also he's right about a ton of FPS games having it.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.10.10 05:31:00 - [26] - Quote +1 for slightly diagonal sprinting.
Velvet Overkill Seraphim Auxiliaries CRONOS. 104	Posted - 2012.10.10 05:32:00 - [27] - Quote Also with that said I want the nerf to strafing reverted since people can strafe and even not every1 does so at the same speed and efficiency. Skinnier people do it better than heavies so assaults and scouts shouldn't share the same slow strafing speed as a heavy. Heavies aren't even designed for mobility.
Velvet Overkill Seraphim Auxiliaries CRONOS. 104	Posted - 2012.10.10 05:39:00 - [28] - Quote For those that never tried running sideways, try walking forward and turn it slowly into sideway walking, you'll need to eventually have one leg cross the other every other step. Using your arms for balancing may help you.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.10.10 08:03:00 - [29] - Quote Goric Rumis wrote: Honestly, I don't see what the problem is. If it's only slight, why not just turn slightly? Since we can turn while sprinting. And also, I don't know what games you have or haven't played. I honestly haven't tried to sprint diagonally in a game. Never really occurred to me since I don't do it in real life. Sorry your thread got hijacked into another strafing thread, though. People tried to do that to mine, before it died. I guaranty you do this when sprinting, unless of course, you look where you're going -after- you're on your way. I myself, have never been sprinting north, turned to sprint north east, and then realized "hey, there is something over there that I should run towards". Generally, I would be sprinting north, and I would turn my head to look north east and see something of interest, and only then would I begin to sprint north east. The diagonal sprinting I am talking about is simply so that you can either A) be aware of your surroundings without changing your direction, or B) run around small obstacles that get in your way without taking your eyes off your target location. Velvet Overkill wrote: Also with that said I want the nerf to strafing reverted since people can strafe and even not every1 does so at the same speed and efficiency. Skinnier people do it better than heavies so assaults and scouts shouldn't share the same slow strafing speed as a heavy. Heavies aren't even designed for mobility. This thread is not about the strafe nerf, so please take it elsewhere.


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