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Ambush : Making it fun again

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Nova Knife Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 789	Posted - 2012.10.04 21:04:00 - [1] - Quote When infestation mode was being discussed on IRC, CCP Jian said something that got me thinking. The quote was along the lines of "Being CCP, we wanted to do something a little cooler than just 'defend x location for y amount of time' so we came up with ways to make survival mode more interesting" I think that's what needs to be done with Ambush. Making it a little more interesting than just "KILL ALL THE THINGS!!!" Let's look at what ambush offers currently: The Good: Fast paced, hectic action that skirmish cannot deliver usually Smaller maps for less travel and more pew pew Smaller clone count and match timer for quicker matches That's not really a whole lot to go for making ambush fun. But wait... There's more! The bad Smaller maps means condensed spawn areas. Less areas to spawn means the chances of dying as soon as you spawn are very high, and this is very common in ambush Drop uplinks and vehicle CRU's are the only way to join up with your team after you die. No choice whatsoever of a general area to spawn, further increasing the chances of dying as soon as or shortly after you spawn. Lack of installation availability (On most maps, until we can deploy them ourselves at least) Did I mention people die a lot as soon as they spawn? With current precision strike mechanics once one team starts to chain them, the other team has almost assuredly lost If the timer runs out and the clone count is even the round will never end until someone dies. This presents a whole host of potential iffy situations. So.. Yeah. Ambush isn't really in a good place right now. But it could be, with some tweaks. The thing is, fans of ambush don't really want it to become some super complicated mutant offspring of team deathmatch. I've been mulling over how to make Ambush awesome and address the things that make it unfun without ruining the spirit of team deathmatch. This is what I came up with. Zone Control With the upcoming addition of a grid to the overhead map.. I think that this could be used to great advantage to help make ambush awesome, and combat many of the problems with the mode in one fell swoop. Think of it like an optional 'king of the hill' mini-game embedded in ambush. Controlling zones would not affect who wins or loses directly. (Except maybe if the time runs out and the clone count is even?) Instead, Zone control allows someone to choose an area they can spawn in. A player could spawn on any zone on the grid his team controls, giving them a choice of the general area they spawn in but keeping it random. Additionally, it could be made so that vehicles cannot be delivered in a hostile zone. This gives incentives to 'control the map' beyond denying a team spawn points. Capturing zones would be fairly straightforward. At any time your team has more players on a certain map grid than the opposing team, the zone becomes contested and starts to change ownership. Each zone could have a 'control level' or something. (I suck at naming things) Having more players in a zone than the opposition starts shifting the control level from one team to the other, equivalent to a 30s timer or so.. Maybe even shorter to keep the action flowing as much as possible with less sitting around waiting for a zone capture. Killing enemies in a contested zone moves the control level more in favor of the team who scores the kill. So, fighting in contested zones would transfer control quicker, and capturing nearby zones would allow them to get back into the fight quickly if they die. I thought about the possibility of passive bonuses (faster shield recharge, better sensors, etc) based on zone control, but after mulling that over I couldn't think of a way to make that balanced and goes against the whole point of making zones a secondary goal in Ambush. Edit: Important to point out that if a team controlled 0 zones, they would be left with the random spawn point option again. Controlling a zone would not prevent a hostile from spawning there, it would prevent them from being able to -choose- to spawn there unless they had a drop uplink there.
Mira Adari Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 79	Posted - 2012.10.04 21:27:00 - [2] - Quote Is anyone actually still playing ambush?
Necrodermis GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 460	Posted - 2012.10.04 21:30:00 - [3] - Quote Mira Adari wrote: Is anyone actually still playing ambush? yes, because skirmish is always full no one wants to play ambush because you just spawn and die 90% of the time. even with drop uplinks people just immediately camp it when people spawn. ambush is not fun because of the immediate death for anyone who specs into anything but assault rifles, shotguns or HMG.
ugg reset ZionTCD Legacy Rising 234	Posted - 2012.10.04 21:32:00 - [4] - Quote i am. they added more maps
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.10.04 21:52:00 - [5] - Quote +1 I would like Ambush to have optional objectives that increase one team's clone count. I find Ambush battles too short usually. It would be cool if there were crashed dropships spread all over the map with their CRUs hackable. Capturing a crashed dropship CRU would add 10 clones to a team's clone count. Once the 10 more clones are added, the crashed dropship is no longer usable.
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming 2283	Posted - 2012.10.07 07:46:00 - [6] - Quote +1 this zone control idea would fix alot of the ambush spawn problems and have u spawn near ur teammates for a change
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:17:00 - [7] - Quote Ambush being a boring standard TDM with no twist is kind of a waste of potential.
Skihids Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising 969	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:27:00 - [8] - Quote Ambush is boring, but right now it's the only place to go to avoid SP farmers who screw up the only decent match mode because they can hide in the safe zone. If you are on the opposing side you risk loosing ISK to constant OB spam, and on "thier" side you are left out to dry against the opposing team by yourself. Either way you lose when the FarmVille players are out.
Tyrus Four 128	Posted - 2012.10.11 07:53:00 - [9] - Quote the only thing needed to make Ambush fun again is a fix for the default spawning. my suggestion is either to make it so that you spawn near a squad member, or make it so that we can select our spawning point and air-drop into the battlefield. for the latter, don't allow us to drop too close to objectives, maybe set a perimeter on the outskirts of battle and allow us to select anywhere along the perimeter line.
Free Beers Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 1041	Posted - 2012.10.16 02:51:00 - [10] - Quote Agree with OP. Ambush needs to be more exciting. My biggest issue now is that I have using drop uplinks a ton since ambush is all I play now. They get destoryed to often to be useful or i have to drop them far a way which makes them useless. That means most of the time its random spawning because no way in hell will i spawn and be farmed at cru. spawning is broke and I use uplinks every match and CCP they aren't the solution.

Darth Tyrannnus Citadel Mercantile Exchange Amarr-Caldari Mercantile Exchange 26	Posted - 2012.10.16 02:57:00 - [11] - Quote skirmish is really begining to suck, so im focusing more and more on ambush, so +1 to OP. respawning to a red screen saying you're dead is never fun
Cyn Bruin Imperfects Negative-Feedback 653	Posted - 2012.10.16 20:03:00 - [12] - Quote Quote: Instead, Zone control allows someone to choose an area they can spawn in. A player could spawn on any zone on the grid his team controls, giving them a choice of the general area they spawn in but keeping it random. Very good idea. Most of the spawning areas in Ambush atm are known, people watch for them.
Tiel Syysch Imperfects Negative-Feedback 634	Posted - 2012.10.16 20:07:00 - [13] - Quote Ambush could definitely use some kind of point to it all, but I just want to point out that passively capturing sections of the map will highlight where snipers are. I can't think of anything right now that would keep TDM and make it feel fresh, though. TDM is kinda always TDM it feels. If killing the other team is the only goal, that's what most of the pub players will exclusively do, regardless of whatever special extra stuff you throw in there for them to do.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.10.18 00:26:00 - [14] - Quote What if there were destroyed vehicles with powerful turrets that could be taken and manned by players. The crashed vehicles would be located througout the course of the battle, and announced. The turrets would be like heavy weapons, and have limited ammo that is NOT REPLENISHABLE. It would still be TDM, but desire for control of the powerful turrets would add some sort of order.
Andius Fidelitas Algintal Core Gallente Federation 51	Posted - 2012.10.18 01:52:00 - [15] - Quote Mira Adari wrote: Is anyone actually still playing ambush? I still do at least. WHenever I am not in the mood of something complicated, ambush is my cup of tea. But yeah, it is in poor shape, and the above suggestions by the honorable OP are actually good things to implement.
xjumpman23 Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 262	Posted - 2012.10.18 06:40:00 - [16] - Quote I want a flat square map without any type of elevation.
Dzark Kill Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 115	Posted - 2012.10.18 12:57:00 - [17] - Quote Why not make it an actual ambush. Defending team all spawn nere some objective or other in the center of the map, when they die the have to spawn nere the objective again unless they have uplinks etc. Attacking team choose their approximate spawn point around the perimeter of the map so teams can spawn in a general area of each other and the set about "Ambushing" the defenders. The attacking team need to gain control of the spawn point while depleting the enemy clone count. Defending team need to deplete the enemy clone count while maintaning control of the point. Control of the point adds 1 extra clone per X amount of time. This would fix spawning issue and give the game a bit more of an ambush feel and giving more option that just look for enemy and shoot.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3064	Posted - 2012.11.22 19:59:00 - [18] - Quote Spicing up Ambush would really be nice still.
Fivetimes Infinity Immobile Infantry 1086	Posted - 2012.11.22 23:58:00 - [19] - Quote I would really like it if they made Ambush into a round-based game mode, where everyone spawns together, with one life, and the round ends when one team dies or the objective is captured. I always found that game mode much more interesting than boring, old school team death match. On the other hand, the OP's suggestion really sounds like it would make the game play very much the same as Skirmish.
J'Jor Da'Wg KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 648	Posted - 2012.11.23 00:19:00 - [20] - Quote Yeah, I would rather have a TDM focused mode with a objective addon. Honestly a fix to the spawning system would be the best thing for it, but spicing up Ambush would be fun also. Now that I think back to it, the whole wave spawning mechanic MAG had was pretty nice, especially with how there was very little "spawnkilling". Spawncamping was the issue, but redlining is present anyways so what does it matter. A lot of the challenge of a game is breaking out of a redline. Tbh I think DUST would be better off with spawning areas being a specific building that is unenterable by enemies, similar to the middle building in MAG's Domination matches. I kind of imagined CRU's being like MAG's bunkers, where you spawn into the bunker and look around, then exit it in the selected direction. I never really had an issue with spawning and getting killed in MAG before I even had a chance. Dust could learn a few things from MAG. Not copy it, but learn from it.

Jotun Hiem Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 412	Posted - 2012.11.23 00:31:00 - [21] - Quote 80% of Ambush's problems can be solved by squadding up. Or at least that's how it works for me.
Reimus Klinsman BetaMax. 320	Posted - 2012.11.23 06:29:00 - [22] - Quote Mira Adari wrote: Is anyone actually still playing ambush? Yes, because ambush is the only fun mode (when you get the installation drops.).


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