DUST Search - We (desperately) need electronic warfare!

Mauler McCoy wrote:

Average Joe81 wrote:

tanks are not OP u just suck
REASONS WHY U SUCK:

1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily

2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK

3.ur a faggit

4.half ur ideas are terrible

5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship

6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges

Personally, I think the OP has some pretty good things. I really like the idea of things that will cause problems that aren't health loss... After all, a complacent tank driver is used to being able to maneuver and keep constant speeds, so why not introduce something that takes it away. After all, it would promote teamwork between players because one person sets up the EW trap, and someone ELSE has to take it out. Or it opens up the idea that you can lock up a tank before it can move out and beat the snot out of some fireteam on a nearby point. After all, spending a pile of ISK on a vehicle that's not taking out the enemy is kinda like wasting ISK, right?

There's also the fact that things are still evolving. I wouldn't be surprised if we start to see Anti-Aircraft tanks start coming in as a way to keep dropships from hogging all the glory... after all, it doesn't take much to make an AA turret. Someone else has already pointed out that tanks also seldom work unsupported in an efficient group. I know from my time with CoD: WaW the tank was the secondary problem, your primary was the guy the tank was covering.

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Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2012.08.27 14:38:00 - [1] - Quote It has come to one of my attentions that the disparity between infantry and vehicles and of course all the balance issues are stemming from the missing third wheel Electronic Warfare. Electronic Warfare in a nutshell is a debuff system, which you may declare "That's too much RPG in my fps!" But the thing is it does belong in this environment after all EW does exist currently on our modern battlefields. Jammers would block out the minimap and shutdown the tacnet tot hose in range making ambushes more possible. ECM bursts would break locks of hostile targets and scramble up their ability to re-lock anytime soon excellent from breaking up spider tanks or rescue those being targeted by hostile systems. Turret disruptor in an FPS environment should screw with aiming controls of vehicle weapons (such as rotating and inverting the controls every time is applied.) Webifiers to slow down vehicles and severely decrease their velocity. Capacitor Drainers that reduces vehicle 'stamina' responsible for activation of any module and firing guns. The bottom line the argument tanks are OP is very awkward at the moment because without these tools they really are, its not only until we get these tools in to see the whole picture of how OP tanks are or are not. Of course tanks are not going to be entirely vulnerable they will be able to equip modules to 'tank' against these electronic warfare which inversely improves base performance in some cases (such as tracking computer makes turrets spin faster) but the problem is you see the amount of possible warfare and you will notice they tend to almost outnumber the number of slots some tanks have it will not be possible to guard against everything or doing so makes it impossible to guard against 'traditional' damage. Muraders are likely to be extremely vulnerable (as in EW will have a bonus against them) where the black ops HAVs are more resilitant.
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2012.08.27 14:42:00 - [2] - Quote Yes EWar is missing, but some of your examples of how it would translate in game are bizarre.
EnglishSnake Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 1012	Posted - 2012.08.27 14:48:00 - [3] - Quote If cap is involved which tbh it should be then i would like to see energy vamps/neuts
Drake Gro'Dar 19	Posted - 2012.08.27 14:51:00 - [4] - Quote I'd love to have EW in the game and I'm sure it's coming but I wish we could see it now. Do you think they need to make an EW suit or would logi and scout be the main user of EW mods and equipment?
Tony Calif Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 2002	Posted - 2012.08.27 14:57:00 - [5] - Quote Agreed, and I'm afraid if CCP don't release the counters to specific problems, that's their fault. We can't do a lot about it. Tbh I want tanks to be big and scary like they are now. But not immortal like the spider tankers I've found (never enough AV nades... Even with 2 hives)
DUST Fiend Immobile Infantry 1903	Posted - 2012.08.27 15:13:00 - [6] - Quote Praying for EWAR and capacitors, make these tank drivers have some skill, not just skill points ;)
Martin0 Brancaleone Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 191	Posted - 2012.08.27 15:46:00 - [7] - Quote More stuff for the logi suits is good
Traynor Youngs Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 287	Posted - 2012.08.27 22:29:00 - [8] - Quote I posted a more comprehensive EWAR discussion here.
The Warbot Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 85	Posted - 2012.08.27 22:34:00 - [9] - Quote Yes I agree. EW in general is just needed. Good points Iron.
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2012.08.27 22:39:00 - [10] - Quote Well according to current sisi build there is more on the way mostly sensor based maybe next build will have the rest.

GOLD LEAD3R Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 22	Posted - 2012.08.28 00:54:00 - [11] - Quote Love the OP. Completely agree.
Average Joe81 57	Posted - 2012.08.28 01:11:00 - [12] - Quote tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges
Cpl Quartz 127	Posted - 2012.08.28 01:16:00 - [13] - Quote Average Joe81 wrote: tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges tanks dont run around alone, at leasnt not the the games i play in. feels like t2 classic clusterfuck tbh. and compared to real tribes 2 base play its a sad place to be. yuo called him a faggit, his bf is gunning for you:P
Randrii Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 121	Posted - 2012.08.28 01:19:00 - [14] - Quote Average Joe81 wrote: tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges 1. Depends how well fit the tank is and the weapons and skills of the AV are. 2. How do you know he refuses AT. 3. Your a moron if you think thats a good reason. 4. More ad hominem? ok, Your an immature child who can't spell 5. Who ever see's a drop ship? How did that enter this discussion? 6. Only a stupid tank driver lets a AV guy get that close
Mauler McCoy Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 6	Posted - 2012.08.28 01:29:00 - [15] - Quote Average Joe81 wrote: tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges Personally, I think the OP has some pretty good things. I really like the idea of things that will cause problems that aren't health loss... After all, a complacent tank driver is used to being able to maneuver and keep constant speeds, so why not introduce something that takes it away. After all, it would promote teamwork between players because one person sets up the EW trap, and someone ELSE has to take it out. Or it opens up the idea that you can lock up a tank before it can move out and beat the snot out of some fireteam on a nearby point. After all, spending a pile of ISK on a vehicle that's not taking out the enemy is kinda like wasting ISK, right? There's also the fact that things are still evolving. I wouldn't be surprised if we start to see Anti-Aircraft tanks start coming in as a way to keep dropships from hogging all the glory... after all, it doesn't take much to make an AA turret. Someone else has already pointed out that tanks also seldom work unsupported in an efficient group. I know from my time with CoD: WaW the tank was the secondary problem, your primary was the guy the tank was covering.
Song Soulfire Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 44	Posted - 2012.08.28 01:33:00 - [16] - Quote Average Joe81 wrote: tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges that a terribad player like this gets kills is reason enough to bring in ewar... i want to suckle on his tears :)
Average Joe81 57	Posted - 2012.08.28 01:46:00 - [17] - Quote Randrii wrote: Average Joe81 wrote: tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges 1. Depends how well fit the tank is and the weapons and skills of the AV are. 2. How do you know he refuses AT. 3. Your a moron if you think thats a good reason. 4. More ad hominem? ok, Your an immature child who can't spell 5. Who ever see's a drop ship? How did that enter this discussion? 6. Only a stupid tank driver lets a AV guy get that close 1.half a million vs. malitia 2.thats why i said if 3.so what are you his bf coming to defend him 4.really u just notice that rather than saying your im saying ur. if thats ur excuse then u could use that for everything i said 5. ive seen plenty once i ignored one because it was out of my reach(most of them are) and in thirty seconds which was how long it took me to cross the map to find cover i was on 5% then an AT grenade guy shows up and finishes me. 6.im not talking about the new sniper only map im talking about on communications in the building area
Average Joe81 57	Posted - 2012.08.28 01:55:00 - [18] - Quote Mauler McCoy wrote: Average Joe81 wrote: tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges Personally, I think the OP has some pretty good things. I really like the idea of things that will cause problems that aren't health loss... After all, a complacent tank driver is used to being able to maneuver and keep constant speeds, so why not introduce something that takes it away. After all, it would promote teamwork between players because one person sets up the EW trap, and someone ELSE has to take it out. Or it opens up the idea that you can lock up a tank before it can move out and beat the snot out of some fireteam on a nearby point. After all, spending a pile of ISK on a vehicle that's not taking out the enemy is kinda like wasting ISK, right? There's also the fact that things are still evolving. I wouldn't be surprised if we start to see Anti-Aircraft tanks start coming in as a way to keep dropships from hogging all the glory... after all, it doesn't take much to make an AA turret. Someone else has already pointed out that tanks also seldom work unsupported in an efficient group. I know from my time with CoD: WaW the tank was the secondary problem, your primary was the guy the tank was covering. SOME of his stuff is good but the crap about tanks makes no sense. we have tons of AT weapos already is it that u want to see the pretty explosions or do u actually have a problem with them because when i use infantry(because i cant aford to buy a new tank every few matches) i have no problem with tanks. infact i get equal WP as a infantry as i do as a tank.(no im not alwase last on the leader boards imusualy in the top 3)
Mauler McCoy Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 6	Posted - 2012.08.28 02:27:00 - [19] - Quote Average Joe81 wrote: SOME of his stuff is good but the crap about tanks makes no sense. we have tons of AT weapos already is it that u want to see the pretty explosions or do u actually have a problem with them because when i use infantry(because i cant aford to buy a new tank every few matches) i have no problem with tanks. infact i get equal WP as a infantry as i do as a tank.(no im not alwase last on the leader boards imusualy in the top 3) Personally, I'm indifferent to tanks. Once again, my experience with tanks from WaW just made me regard them to be something different than your usual opponent. I know there's more than enough Anti-Tank weaponry, but it's all the same standard stuff of just blowing up the victim. I have to say that I like the idea of something that just jams up the tanks controls or gets that fast-moving LAV to stop dead. It's still a problem for anyone who has a clear line of sight to the vehicle's turret until a friendly repairman can get it moving again. Tanks are something I actually like to take out. Never seen a tank last the whole match in any fight I've played in, so I have no complaints about the tanks.... I just ask for a way to disable tanks quickly, tie them up rather than only blowing them up. It's always fun to get hate mail when you don't kill a player but make it VERY hard to do their job. :)
STB Vermaak Doe 558	Posted - 2012.08.28 02:29:00 - [20] - Quote Average Joe81 wrote: Randrii wrote: Average Joe81 wrote: tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges 1. Depends how well fit the tank is and the weapons and skills of the AV are. 2. How do you know he refuses AT. 3. Your a moron if you think thats a good reason. 4. More ad hominem? ok, Your an immature child who can't spell 5. Who ever see's a drop ship? How did that enter this discussion? 6. Only a stupid tank driver lets a AV guy get that close 1.half a million vs. malitia 2.thats why i said if 3.so what are you his bf coming to defend him 4.really u just notice that rather than saying your im saying ur. if thats ur excuse then u could use that for everything i said 5. ive seen plenty once i ignored one because it was out of my reach(most of them are) and in thirty seconds which was how long it took me to cross the map to find cover i was on 5% then an AT grenade guy shows up and finishes me. 6.im not talking about the new sniper only map im talking about on communications in the building area This guy only uses tanks because of the forge nerf, pussies(cats) always switch to something made op by them qqing

Average Joe81 57	Posted - 2012.08.28 02:35:00 - [21] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Average Joe81 wrote: Randrii wrote: Average Joe81 wrote: tanks are not OP u just suck REASONS WHY U SUCK: 1.two ATs ambushing an advanced tank (gunnlogy/madrugar) will kill it easily 2.if u refuse to use an AT then AVOID THE TANK 3.ur a faggit 4.half ur ideas are terrible 5.tanks cant shoot dropships so fly a dropship 6.tanks cant turn down enough to shoot ATs at close ranges 1. Depends how well fit the tank is and the weapons and skills of the AV are. 2. How do you know he refuses AT. 3. Your a moron if you think thats a good reason. 4. More ad hominem? ok, Your an immature child who can't spell 5. Who ever see's a drop ship? How did that enter this discussion? 6. Only a stupid tank driver lets a AV guy get that close 1.half a million vs. malitia 2.thats why i said if 3.so what are you his bf coming to defend him 4.really u just notice that rather than saying your im saying ur. if thats ur excuse then u could use that for everything i said 5. ive seen plenty once i ignored one because it was out of my reach(most of them are) and in thirty seconds which was how long it took me to cross the map to find cover i was on 5% then an AT grenade guy shows up and finishes me. 6.im not talking about the new sniper only map im talking about on communications in the building area This guy only uses tanks because of the forge nerf, pussies(cats) always switch to something made op by them qqing bra i used tanks before update too and reason im not going full out infantry is because of black ops tank
STB Vermaak Doe 558	Posted - 2012.08.28 02:45:00 - [22] - Quote You have to admit that the only things that makes tanks good are the nerf to 2 av weapons
Ten-Sidhe Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 414	Posted - 2012.08.28 02:58:00 - [23] - Quote Did you notice the black ops is the ewar hav? Entering the tight areas of communication and biomass in unsupported tank would be a bad driving, it's asking for ambush with av grenades. Scouts and logi will probably be main user of ewar. Probably not at same time as they do current roles. In EvE, ewar is done by specialists that may not even have weapons equipped. A variant of lav and dropship for ewar have been mentioned before by devs. Ewar emplacements seem probable as well. I would guess at least some of the ewar will affect dropsuits to.
Average Joe81 57	Posted - 2012.08.28 03:24:00 - [24] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: You have to admit that the only things that makes tanks good are the nerf to 2 av weapons THEY NEVER NERFED AV WEAPONS and also the thing about tanks not moving or shooting till someone heals it is rediculusly unfair on the tank's behalf
STB Vermaak Doe 558	Posted - 2012.08.28 03:27:00 - [25] - Quote Average Joe81 wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: You have to admit that the only things that makes tanks good are the nerf to 2 av weapons THEY NEVER NERFED AV WEAPONS and also the thing about tanks not moving or shooting till someone heals it is rediculusly unfair on the tank's behalf Explain why my swarms slam into a wall twenty feet to my right and couldn't track a sloth. Along with my forge gun losing range
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming 2283	Posted - 2012.08.28 03:29:00 - [26] - Quote kinda shocked we havent gotten caps and ewar yet tbh..........................
Average Joe81 57	Posted - 2012.08.28 03:53:00 - [27] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Average Joe81 wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: You have to admit that the only things that makes tanks good are the nerf to 2 av weapons THEY NEVER NERFED AV WEAPONS and also the thing about tanks not moving or shooting till someone heals it is rediculusly unfair on the tank's behalf Explain why my swarms slam into a wall twenty feet to my right and couldn't track a sloth. Along with my forge gun losing range all of that is your fault: swarms do track, swarms dont hit the wall if after you locked o u fire away from the things it could hit, and ive been tower camped by a forge gun so that last one was a lie
Grenwal Hiesenberg Shadow Company HQ 226	Posted - 2012.08.28 23:33:00 - [28] - Quote Bump
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2012.08.28 23:56:00 - [29] - Quote Why was the forge gun range reduced from 1200 meters to about 175 effective.
STB Vermaak Doe 558	Posted - 2012.08.29 00:03:00 - [30] - Quote Average Joe81 wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Average Joe81 wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: You have to admit that the only things that makes tanks good are the nerf to 2 av weapons THEY NEVER NERFED AV WEAPONS and also the thing about tanks not moving or shooting till someone heals it is rediculusly unfair on the tank's behalf Explain why my swarms slam into a wall twenty feet to my right and couldn't track a sloth. Along with my forge gun losing range all of that is your fault: swarms do track, swarms dont hit the wall if after you locked o u fire away from the things it could hit, and ive been tower camped by a forge gun so that last one was a lie I fired aiming directly at the lav and the missiles still slamed into a wall that was hardly in my field of view, and the forge's range was highly decreased



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