DUST Search - Replace KDR with PDR (Point/Death Ratio)

Naustradamus Oracle wrote:

Arramakaian Eka wrote:

Although B died more, he was a more productive team player. Even if he died 25 times, that meant 25 times an enemy was busy killing him instead of capping an objective, while A was just sitting on his thumbs doing nothing useful for the rest of the map.

No system is perfect, but I'm not sure bringing # of deaths or kills into rankings is a useful metric in an objectives-based game.

Not really when you think about it ... some games have a limit on clone spawns ... if the players is attacking, then he just used up 25 clones and was infective with them. In a situation like this, rather then front line attack, the player should have chose another role such as staying back to hold the line, or if he has the skills, repair role, pilot vehicle, snipe, etc.

It might sound harsh, but you need to have some sort of point value per life ... I agree k/d ration shouldn't really be used cause there's lots of support actions you can do, but by being a ineffective player, your not helping your team ... if there's a time limit or spawn limit, you can actually hurt your team indirectly.


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Traynor Youngs Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 287	Posted - 2012.08.06 18:08:00 - [1] - Quote You get points for killing others, but also for assists, hacks, repairs, nano-s, uplinks, etc. The KDR measures how many people died to you per your death. Your PDR would measure how much you contribute for each death. IF all you do is shoot people and nothing else, your PDR will be roughly equal to 50X what your KDR is now, plus some for the assists you will inevitably get. If you don't just shoot people, and instead do other things as well, your PDR will reflect this. Allow the stats to be broken down inside the PDR by a percentage of each contributing factor, so you can see that your total points are say 54% from killing people, 38% from hacks, 8% from assists, etc. Then, if your team/corp/GF etc cares only about KDR, then you can figure that out all you want and if your team/corp cares about team work and other contributions, they can look at that as well. Either way, it puts the tools in the hands of the players instead of in the hands of the guy writing the code for the stats screen. Over time, players will learn what an acceptable/unacceptable/stellar PDR looks like without the need for a long drawn out philosophical discussion about what makes a good FPS player.
Traynor Youngs Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 287	Posted - 2012.08.06 18:42:00 - [2] - Quote Arramakaian Eka wrote: Why make it a ratio at all? How does the # of deaths matter? Just make it # of points per match, or per minute. Which of these is a better player? Player A: Receives 100 points for a successful hack. This is the only source of points the entire game. He hacks, succeeds, then guards the objective and no one ever comes to attack it. He never dies. PDR=100 Player B: Receives 100 points for a successful hack. This is the only source of points the entire game. He hacks, succeeds, then runs for the front lines of the battle and dies, over and over and over again for a total of 25 deaths during the match. PDR=4 If you do it by total points or points per minute, these two players look the same on paper.
Traynor Youngs Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 287	Posted - 2012.08.06 21:03:00 - [3] - Quote Naustradamus Oracle wrote: Arramakaian Eka wrote: Although B died more, he was a more productive team player. Even if he died 25 times, that meant 25 times an enemy was busy killing him instead of capping an objective, while A was just sitting on his thumbs doing nothing useful for the rest of the map. No system is perfect, but I'm not sure bringing # of deaths or kills into rankings is a useful metric in an objectives-based game. Not really when you think about it ... some games have a limit on clone spawns ... if the players is attacking, then he just used up 25 clones and was infective with them. In a situation like this, rather then front line attack, the player should have chose another role such as staying back to hold the line, or if he has the skills, repair role, pilot vehicle, snipe, etc. It might sound harsh, but you need to have some sort of point value per life ... I agree k/d ration shouldn't really be used cause there's lots of support actions you can do, but by being a ineffective player, your not helping your team ... if there's a time limit or spawn limit, you can actually hurt your team indirectly. Furthermore, if a Point/Death ratio were implemented instead of a Kill/Death ratio, then when adjustments are made to the point system (points for various forms of assistance) then the ratio doesn't need any additional tweaking. For instance, if there is a slow tick of points for defending an objective, then player A would get more points and have fewer deaths and there would be a point incentive for defending an objective. Or if a dropship pilot gets points each time someone deploys from the dropship. Of course this might also call into question if you should get the deaths of your passengers against your ratio... Which I think might be a good idea. In that case, having your dropship shutdown with all hands could cost you 7 deaths in your ratio stats. Again, all of the accumulated points should be able to be broken down by type and examined so as to better hone in on what you actually do well and what you don't do well.
Traynor Youngs Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 287	Posted - 2012.08.07 17:46:00 - [4] - Quote In response to putting ISK in the mix, I say that the stats for each match, and in your character info could include ISK lost in a match (a sum of the market values of everything you lost in the match). A summary of the ISK you made (contract reward, salvage when added, etc) Then you can see a profitability profile by showing ISK lost vs ISK gained. If you want to measure that in relation to PDR, then just take your PDR and divide by your ISK lost. That would give you the ratio of (Points per death) per ISK. IF you care.
Traynor Youngs Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 287	Posted - 2012.08.07 18:04:00 - [5] - Quote SGT Garrisson wrote: i like the idea of PDR but like some one said some peeps like to see the KDR so instead of removing the KDR leave it and just add the PDR system the OP suggests in another column this way everyones happy clicking on the PDR brings up the breakdown of how those points was erned (think this was mentioned by the OP too) id would like to see how meny hacks assists i get per match or atleast how i got the majoity of the sp i made Like I said in the OP, allow the PDR to be filtered by type, then you can show just the points due to kills, and thats your KDRx50. People can still see it.