DUST Search - Eve/Dust cashflow

Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote:

Tony Calif wrote:

Not if you are producing it. Then we work for you, no choice if we want good gear. I'm only playing devils advocate here.

Let me put it another way. EVE is very capitalistic, as Milk Supreme is pointing out. Everyone is also at war with everyone at all times, in all senses of the word.

See: Eve is serious business

Attacking someone and gaining an advantage in the market is a form of PvP. If I think I can gear up my industrial corps and gain a foothold in the market by undercutting everyone else selling 4 million isk suits, imagine the blow I can do by selling my suits for a mere 100,000 ISK.

Suddenly the competition is sitting on entire warehouses of useless suits that are not selling, I gain a reputation for selling suits at dirtcheap prices, and everyone has to scramble to compensate, leaving serious corporations quickly adapting to my prices and leaving the casuals being cut completely out of the market game until they notice. So the other corporations adapt by offering competitive prices, but I already have another price drop in effect and in 24 hours my suits are now down to a mere 50,000 isk due to preplanning.

Very quickly this will devolve into people offering very similar prices in the manufacturing cost in the major trade hubs, and heavy price wars in other regions where the suits are much more rare due to a lack of manufacturers or being more exotic. The Navy Issue Scorpion is a perfect example of this. In Jita (the main trade hub) Every Caldari Scorp' is priced at about 322 million, with variances in only a few thousand ISK from each other, but only in places like Minmatar space (less demand due to less people knowing how to fly it, and it being more exotic, and less manufacturers, and knowing people will pay extra money to save trips so far by buying a Caldary BS in Minny space), it can range to about 400Million.

Nobody prices things at insane levels in EVE, as that is a great way to shoot yourself in the foot by wasting resources and sitting on a now-useless stockpile of garbage.

No EVE players are going to "band together" and pricehike, when it is every alliance/corp/player for his/herself trying to get an edge. Money is a massive motivator.

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Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. 1216	Posted - 2012.07.23 18:31:00 - [1] - Quote Tony Calif wrote: In short, EvE players will decide prices and who gets what. Tbh? Way to ruin the game. Give all EvE players prototype access while everyone who isn't in EvE pays 4 billion per protosuit. Yay for live markets. Oh and that's 4 billion IF you are fighting for them. Fighting against them? Gtfo. Tbh EvE players screwing with pricing will totally screw the game, and CCP need to figure out a way to deal with this. EvE players can totally ruin dust if they do choose basically, they earn billions of ISK. A good miner will earn more ISK than all of us beta testers put together. So yeah, money will flow bak to EvE and probably never return. Why would we choose to? Speaking as a member of an alliance with a fairly robust industrial base, most of us are intending to try and make a profit from the addition of new ways of destroying things, which will be completely impossible if we overprice everything and leave Dust players with nothing to buy. Just step back for a minute and look at the bigger picture. To screw you guys, we'd have to screw ourselves in the process.
Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. 1216	Posted - 2012.07.23 18:42:00 - [2] - Quote Tony Calif wrote: Not if you are producing it. Then we work for you, no choice if we want good gear. I'm only playing devils advocate here. While that is a good point, its still missing some of the factors in play. Among others is the fact that we, as a playerbase, do -not- cooperate. I think the Jita Riots was one of the few examples of all of us agreeing on something. We may only have 400k players, compared to other MMOs, but the market system among other factors means that we all have our own agendas and we'll all do whatever it takes to further them. So, as in EVE, you -will- find people selling Prototype gear for 1 million ISK. And you will also find people selling it for 9-12k. You're going to start to see that the gear you buy will vary in price dramatically based on location. If War Barges are going to function like Jump Freighters, aka be gate capable, then I wouldn't be surprised to see those joining the population of Jita looking to get a good deal on hardware. For every person that over-inflates a price, there will be someone else to undercut them to make a profit. The market tends to balance itself out fairly nicely. Just make sure you -NEVER- buy -ANYTHING- from Contracts. Don't ever trust a single one of them.
Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. 1216	Posted - 2012.07.23 18:52:00 - [3] - Quote Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: Tony Calif wrote: Not if you are producing it. Then we work for you, no choice if we want good gear. I'm only playing devils advocate here. Let me put it another way. EVE is very capitalistic, as Milk Supreme is pointing out. Everyone is also at war with everyone at all times, in all senses of the word. See: Eve is serious business Attacking someone and gaining an advantage in the market is a form of PvP. If I think I can gear up my industrial corps and gain a foothold in the market by undercutting everyone else selling 4 million isk suits, imagine the blow I can do by selling my suits for a mere 100,000 ISK. Suddenly the competition is sitting on entire warehouses of useless suits that are not selling, I gain a reputation for selling suits at dirtcheap prices, and everyone has to scramble to compensate, leaving serious corporations quickly adapting to my prices and leaving the casuals being cut completely out of the market game until they notice. So the other corporations adapt by offering competitive prices, but I already have another price drop in effect and in 24 hours my suits are now down to a mere 50,000 isk due to preplanning. Very quickly this will devolve into people offering very similar prices in the manufacturing cost in the major trade hubs, and heavy price wars in other regions where the suits are much more rare due to a lack of manufacturers or being more exotic. The Navy Issue Scorpion is a perfect example of this. In Jita (the main trade hub) Every Caldari Scorp' is priced at about 322 million, with variances in only a few thousand ISK from each other, but only in places like Minmatar space (less demand due to less people knowing how to fly it, and it being more exotic, and less manufacturers, and knowing people will pay extra money to save trips so far by buying a Caldary BS in Minny space), it can range to about 400Million. Nobody prices things at insane levels in EVE, as that is a great way to shoot yourself in the foot by wasting resources and sitting on a now-useless stockpile of garbage. No EVE players are going to "band together" and pricehike, when it is every alliance/corp/player for his/herself trying to get an edge. Money is a massive motivator. In point of fact, a -lot- of people price things at insane levels in EVE. They just do it because every now and then someone will buy the item without looking, thus giving them a windfall of ISK for something not worth nearly that much. Which is also why, as I said, you should never buy from contracts.
Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. 1216	Posted - 2012.07.23 19:06:00 - [4] - Quote Drake Lyons wrote: Milk Supreme wrote: :Apple Computers: Now don't you start... Yes, and such people certainly don't form the majority. Personally, I plan to dust off (shut up) my long-unused Planetary Interaction skill and start setting up some more colonies. I'm still interested to see how those colonies are going to fit into the conquest system, since I'm pretty sure they stated that planets cap out at 20 districts, and right now the max number of colonies you can have per player is 6.