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Cless Vallein Teknomen 37	Posted - 2012.07.15 15:17:00 - [1] - Quote Just got in the ass end of a game and almost immediately left it. Entire team was held at the spawn zone on the outpost side being held back by, you guessed it, sagaris tanks. Only 2 were on the ground and one was on the giant ass buildings near C with direct shots into the Spawn zone... no cover to get behind because of the unique angle the guy had with his rockets. Ridiculous! Just though I'd share and hope for an implementation of instant vehicle destruction when spawned upon buildings
daniel philp Algintal Core Gallente Federation 158	Posted - 2012.07.15 15:23:00 - [2] - Quote Welcome to eve online
Valklear Leosude 20	Posted - 2012.07.15 15:27:00 - [3] - Quote Cless Vallein wrote: Just got in the ass end of a game and almost immediately left it. Entire team was held at the spawn zone on the outpost side being held back by, you guessed it, sagaris tanks. Only 2 were on the ground and one was on the giant ass buildings near C with direct shots into the Spawn zone... no cover to get behind because of the unique angle the guy had with his rockets. Ridiculous! Just though I'd share and hope for an implementation of instant vehicle destruction when spawned upon buildings Sounds like they did a good job then. Someone should have put down some mobile uplinks ahead of time.
Chihiro Itto 66	Posted - 2012.07.15 15:31:00 - [4] - Quote It sucks to be in that position but a team that allows all their spawn points to be destroyed are asking for this result. Teams need to keep a close eye on their spawns and ensure if they start to be attacked they start opening up new ones. Waiting until you are pinned in a single point means it's usually too late. Players need to be carrying uplinks or have uplinks equipped on an available fitting (and use them!) to ensure this kind of thing doesn't happen, because you're in a world of hurt if it goes this far.
Runny Stool Algintal Core Gallente Federation 52	Posted - 2012.07.15 15:33:00 - [5] - Quote Valklear Leosude wrote: Cless Vallein wrote: Just got in the ass end of a game and almost immediately left it. Entire team was held at the spawn zone on the outpost side being held back by, you guessed it, sagaris tanks. Only 2 were on the ground and one was on the giant ass buildings near C with direct shots into the Spawn zone... no cover to get behind because of the unique angle the guy had with his rockets. Ridiculous! Just though I'd share and hope for an implementation of instant vehicle destruction when spawned upon buildings Sounds like they did a good job then. Someone should have put down some mobile uplinks ahead of time. This. There are three cap points on the map, and what-- four clone arrays when the match starts? Seven spawn points, and 12 mercs couldn't manage to hold one. I'd say they got what they deserved.
tribal wyvern ZionTCD Legacy Rising 673	Posted - 2012.07.15 15:35:00 - [6] - Quote That's the name of the game. Sometimes ya win sometimes you get butt f***ed. quit your belly aching. Being spawn camped is a pain in the ass sometimes but for every attack.....there's a counter
Norbar Recturus Algintal Core Gallente Federation 119	Posted - 2012.07.15 15:42:00 - [7] - Quote On top of that, not one of your 12 players had the bare-bones requirements to fit a heavy suit with a Forge Gun. I'd say that your team lost that game because you let it happen. Everyone above me has been talking about using mobile drop uplinks and personally I can't agree more. Learn to wear a Heavy Suit and train Forge Gun 1 for the inevitable tank-crush. Make it a cheap fitting and only use it when the other team is trying to abuse vehicles. Swarm Launchers are good but mostly for taking out aerial threats: there's simply too much clutter on the ground for SL rockets to find their target with any level of dependability.
Chihiro Itto 66	Posted - 2012.07.15 15:50:00 - [8] - Quote To be fair the OP did say he only got in at the end of the match. He can hardly be blamed for the moves of a poor team he didn't play with anyway. I've been in a few fights with teams not paying attention to spawns and in that situation I've jumped in with a logi suit and done the best I can. Even one player working for the team dropping a few uplinks can make a difference, especially if other players take the hint and do the same. Lead by example is a good philosophy sometimes, especially for new players who might not understand the capabilites available to them.
Cless Vallein Teknomen 37	Posted - 2012.07.15 16:26:00 - [9] - Quote Chihiro Itto wrote: To be fair the OP did say he only got in at the end of the match. He can hardly be blamed for the moves of a poor team he didn't play with anyway. I've been in a few fights with teams not paying attention to spawns and in that situation I've jumped in with a logi suit and done the best I can. Even one player working for the team dropping a few uplinks can make a difference, especially if other players take the hint and do the same. Lead by example is a good philosophy sometimes, especially for new players who might not understand the capabilites available to them. Thank you sir. A little civility goes a long way. And I only run heavies and yes I had my forge gun. Was the only one mind you that would make that Sagaris on top retreat so he could repair but with the other two pinning down the game was really a lost cause at that point.
Zeran Haggai Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 196	Posted - 2012.07.15 16:36:00 - [10] - Quote Also of note, i'm fairly certain that CCP has stated that vehicles aren't supposed to be able to be called in on top of buildings. So at some point in the future Tank on a building shouldn't be an issue.

STB-TedNugent EV 159	Posted - 2012.07.15 16:43:00 - [11] - Quote I have been on both sides of this. When they push us back to the redline its usually because we had to many snipers in the first place all trying to get to an elevated area to snipe from. Which would be ok but when you have 7 out of 12 guys sniping it makes it difficult. So when I run into matches like these I have invested time into a Sagaris of my own. Which is freaking awesome and I hate tanks. LOL. I am still upgrading it but as of now it's a beast and only has more potential to get better. It does stink however to be in that position. About all you can do is try and call in a dropship and fly away and put down an uplink or try to run around the attackers/defenders and do your best to flank the hell out of em. Overall it sounds like your enemies that match did there job well and had your team pinned down. Skirmish in a nutshell... capture letters blow up spawns force them to spawn from one place
Johnny Guilt Algintal Core Gallente Federation 50	Posted - 2012.07.15 17:29:00 - [12] - Quote daniel philp wrote: Welcome to eve online Welcome to bad design
Steve Renuken BetaMax. 23	Posted - 2012.07.15 17:30:00 - [13] - Quote A wall would fix this problem. As will the updated spawn points (They're going to be going from a number of points, not just the same one) The wall would just stop direct fire onto the spawn point. You'd still have to escape from the kill zone, but it wouldn't be 'spawn then die immediately'
Runny Stool Algintal Core Gallente Federation 52	Posted - 2012.07.15 17:34:00 - [14] - Quote Johnny Guilt wrote: daniel philp wrote: Welcome to eve online Welcome to bad design WELCOME TO THE JUNGLE air guitar
Chihiro Itto 66	Posted - 2012.07.15 17:36:00 - [15] - Quote Johnny Guilt wrote: daniel philp wrote: Welcome to eve online Welcome to bad design Well, there are two issues. 1) vehicles in places they shouldn't really be (although if a tank is being dropped from aircraft, I see no intrinsic reason why it shouldn't be able to sit on top of a building), and 2) a loss of spawn points leading to a full team being pinnable in a lone spawn point. 1) is debatable, but may be a bug which will be fixed or altered. Alternatively it may stay in. The real issue is 2) because if you have multiple spawns you can't be pinned no matter what attacks the enemy can bring to bear. Anyone who has experienced this situation should rapidly comprehend that multiple spawns are vital and work to make sure they don't end up in that situation again. At which point anyone with a tank sat on a building is going to find they're more of a liability than an asset.
Kcobra Rod Foxhound Corporation 55	Posted - 2012.07.15 17:38:00 - [16] - Quote Runny Stool wrote: Valklear Leosude wrote: Cless Vallein wrote: Just got in the ass end of a game and almost immediately left it. Entire team was held at the spawn zone on the outpost side being held back by, you guessed it, sagaris tanks. Only 2 were on the ground and one was on the giant ass buildings near C with direct shots into the Spawn zone... no cover to get behind because of the unique angle the guy had with his rockets. Ridiculous! Just though I'd share and hope for an implementation of instant vehicle destruction when spawned upon buildings Sounds like they did a good job then. Someone should have put down some mobile uplinks ahead of time. This. There are three cap points on the map, and what-- four clone arrays when the match starts? Seven spawn points, and 12 mercs couldn't manage to hold one. I'd say they got what they deserved. Agreed. It was the sorry ass teams fault
RolyatDerTeufel D3ath D3alers RISE of LEGION 1648	Posted - 2012.07.15 17:44:00 - [17] - Quote Those damn tanks killed my closest Supply Depot by your attackers redline. :( Well was fun jumping around while no one made an attempt to get out.
gangsta nachos Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 377	Posted - 2012.07.15 17:56:00 - [18] - Quote Nerf tanks
RolyatDerTeufel D3ath D3alers RISE of LEGION 1648	Posted - 2012.07.15 17:57:00 - [19] - Quote gangsta nachos wrote: Nerf tanks No. they are HAV's. Get more AV buffs
Pezz IsDank Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 171	Posted - 2012.07.15 18:05:00 - [20] - Quote RolyatDerTeufel wrote: gangsta nachos wrote: Nerf tanks No. they are HAV's. Get more AV buffs Yah, that or at least limit a team to 1 sagaris at a time (at least while they're still uber cheap). Being against 2 or 3 of them is too much, without a grouping system at least. I usually never quit out of matches but lately I have due to sagaris spam, just get sick and tired of running into insta-death and not having a team that's helping to try to take them out. If they won't switch to AV fits then they can lose on their own tbh. Once they allow me to group with friends then teamwork can come into play and it won't be so bad. One could attempt to be a smartass and to say use your mic, work with your team, but if you've played online FPS games as long as I have then you know the success rate of that. Sometimes sure, most of the time, lol, talking to a brick wall buddy, grab out ur lube and bend over for the sagaris.

Dasyu Asura GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 57	Posted - 2012.07.15 18:06:00 - [21] - Quote Runny Stool wrote: Valklear Leosude wrote: Cless Vallein wrote: Just got in the ass end of a game and almost immediately left it. Entire team was held at the spawn zone on the outpost side being held back by, you guessed it, sagaris tanks. Only 2 were on the ground and one was on the giant ass buildings near C with direct shots into the Spawn zone... no cover to get behind because of the unique angle the guy had with his rockets. Ridiculous! Just though I'd share and hope for an implementation of instant vehicle destruction when spawned upon buildings Sounds like they did a good job then. Someone should have put down some mobile uplinks ahead of time. This. There are three cap points on the map, and what-- four clone arrays when the match starts? Seven spawn points, and 12 mercs couldn't manage to hold one. I'd say they got what they deserved. 8. Remember, they default spawn point where they got beaten back to. Also, to those tankers. Have you tried rolling directly into the spawn point to unleash some hell before running back to the safe zone? I've been in a couple of matches with a tank driver who does just this. Pretty fun!
gangsta nachos Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 377	Posted - 2012.07.15 18:08:00 - [22] - Quote They would prob be fine if it wasn't for the gunners in them remove the gunners or nerf their splash damage, lower the rate of fire and lower the gun turn speed
Sojuro Ryo Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 189	Posted - 2012.07.15 18:13:00 - [23] - Quote Johnny Guilt wrote: daniel philp wrote: Welcome to eve online Welcome to bad design Depends in Isle 12 and you're leaking some brown stuff down your leg. That's just disgusting.
xeto rak Epidemic. Space Immigration 23	Posted - 2012.07.15 18:39:00 - [24] - Quote Given the fact that moving losing a battle can have major impact on the wider context, it is fair that every dirty little tactic is acceptable. War is cruel and unfair. I think this is what you get here too. I love it.
Teddy Yohanson Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2012.07.15 18:44:00 - [25] - Quote Cless Vallein wrote: Just got in the ass end of a game and almost immediately left it. Entire team was held at the spawn zone on the outpost side being held back by, you guessed it, sagaris tanks. Only 2 were on the ground and one was on the giant ass buildings near C with direct shots into the Spawn zone... no cover to get behind because of the unique angle the guy had with his rockets. Ridiculous! Just though I'd share and hope for an implementation of instant vehicle destruction when spawned upon buildings LOL THIS GAME. in the begin its easy, take out all turrets cloners and supply just for ***** and gigs then your team magically wins. dropship ontop of NE building with my sagaris, position at a downward 9:00 angle.... own spawn. haha i went 73-1 that game. please send hatemail to me i enjoy it hehe. PS: i had no gunners due to them killstealing the hell outta me. so i troll and put blasters and noone likes those ha.
Mafty Navilles Erin Legitimate Businessman's Club 8	Posted - 2012.07.15 19:05:00 - [26] - Quote A simple preview of the scoreboard (progress) of the battle will alleviate such a problem. CCP should list the individual battles, along with the scoreboard, rather than just bundling up all the same game type/maps. As it stands, it's just click join and wait and see where you'er thrown into. Now, for a team to end up miserably like that...that's another story, and let's just say that team deserved to be destroyed like that.
Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 808	Posted - 2012.07.15 19:06:00 - [27] - Quote i love reading these posts man, its great. you can tell who the butthurt players are and how they got raped by the whining and what needs to be nerfed.
Th3rdSun L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 323	Posted - 2012.07.15 19:24:00 - [28] - Quote This could end up being a very sticky situation for us all.Sure it's a harsh cruel game,and that's the way that it's supposed to be,but there's things to consider. 1)I'm sure the winning team was beating up on mostly noobs,so there's no way that they weren't going to get there sh!t pushed in,and in all honestly,they probably should get what they deserve,but... 2)Gameplay like this,while appealing to those on the winning side,is very demoralizing to the losers,with the end result being that some of those people won't ever come back to the game.Let's face it,this game is going to need as many players as possible,but at what expense. So the main question is how does CCP balance the game to achieve and maintain player count without compromising their vision.I honestly don't know if it can be done,and unfortunately,that could spell disaster for the game. My only suggestion is that when a team is redlined(which always seems to be the defending team),those of us that have them pinned down should have some sort of sympathy and at least let one dropship out.I find it to be extremely boring just redlining a team,and I try to discourage it. Now when we get corp battles,that's a whole other story.
Hellhammer Tactical Algintal Core Gallente Federation 45	Posted - 2012.07.15 19:31:00 - [29] - Quote having been on both sides of this situation, all i can say is PTFO, teams find themselves in this situation when they play lone wolf and dont think "dropship = behind enemy lines" its bad players that LET themselves get spawn camped. look after your heavys and your heavys will look after you.
Angel Vicious Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 2	Posted - 2012.07.15 19:53:00 - [30] - Quote I've been on the recieving end of this situation more than I've been on the giving side. A few times I have been dropped in to a redlined team also. But I still love it. This is the way it should be. If your team was not paying attention and got pushed back to a single spot, then tough ****. That is why we are on teams. If you want to play a game where this won't happen to you then play ambush. Alternatively play a logi and help your team avoid this situation by being proactive.

Jack McReady 46	Posted - 2012.07.15 20:00:00 - [31] - Quote Hellhammer Tactical wrote: having been on both sides of this situation, all i can say is PTFO, teams find themselves in this situation when they play lone wolf and dont think "dropship = behind enemy lines" its bad players that LET themselves get spawn camped. look after your heavys and your heavys will look after you. being spammed with sagaris tanks that have 15k effective shield hp has nothing to do with being bad but with unbalanced AV weaponry. sagaris tank can outrun swarms due to alot of obstacles on the map and pathetic fly path of the missiles, and proto swarm deals like 10-15% dmg to his shield when it actually hits, its not much. and then the sagaris can drive away heal up and come back, no infantry can keep up with the tanks speed, they are really fast. forge guns are decent but a heavy also cant keep up with the tanks speed. the shields are strong enough thus you can ignore a dropship shooting you, before you get to 50% it gets shot down by assault rifle fire. eventually you might kill a single PROPERLY fit sagaris (those shitfits dont count) with alot of effort BUT what do you do when you face more then one sagaris tank? only think you can do is to have dedicated tank drivers on your team too which is not really balanced.
Rhadiem Algintal Core Gallente Federation 496	Posted - 2012.07.15 20:10:00 - [32] - Quote I joined a game like this yesterday, and they were spamming spawn so bad that I didn't get a chance out of 6 attempts to run out of spawn with my scout suit and drop an uplink. Then, finally, I realized the team I joined had only militia swarm launchers and failed to shut down the 2 marauders and I just shrugged and waited to cash in my free ISK on the spawn screen. Sometimes it's good to face the consequences of sucking, and if a late comer can't help then they just have to wait and let the others learn the lesson. (and cash in a hundred thousand isk for the trouble)
Peter Hanther Dead Six Initiative 39	Posted - 2012.07.15 20:41:00 - [33] - Quote daniel philp wrote: Welcome to eve online That is not really the answer all to any problem you know. Sometimes its welcome to bad game design. Then again perhaps that is what you meant.
Cless Vallein Teknomen 37	Posted - 2012.07.15 21:05:00 - [34] - Quote Rhadiem wrote: I joined a game like this yesterday, and they were spamming spawn so bad that I didn't get a chance out of 6 attempts to run out of spawn with my scout suit and drop an uplink. Then, finally, I realized the team I joined had only militia swarm launchers and failed to shut down the 2 marauders and I just shrugged and waited to cash in my free ISK on the spawn screen. Sometimes it's good to face the consequences of sucking, and if a late comer can't help then they just have to wait and let the others learn the lesson. (and cash in a hundred thousand isk for the trouble) tis pretty much what I did. The HAVs are bad ass, don't get me wrong I love them when my team has them, hate them when the enemy does. I've made them run away and i've taken a few down. I've been on both sides of the redline, but never really the one shooting into their zone... No, i usually watch where they're getting out to go somewhere and kill them before they can get a foothold.
AMARRKIS BetaMax. 71	Posted - 2012.07.15 21:12:00 - [35] - Quote Cless Vallein wrote: Just got in the ass end of a game and almost immediately left it. Entire team was held at the spawn zone on the outpost side being held back by, you guessed it, sagaris tanks. Only 2 were on the ground and one was on the giant ass buildings near C with direct shots into the Spawn zone... no cover to get behind because of the unique angle the guy had with his rockets. Ridiculous! Just though I'd share and hope for an implementation of instant vehicle destruction when spawned upon buildings well supposedly when the map start using everything thing it wont be like that anymore cause of the size of the battle field and since everyone wont be making money as quickly
Chihiro Itto 66	Posted - 2012.07.15 21:15:00 - [36] - Quote It's tough to consider because we don't know how play will work in the future, but at this point I'd suggest there be two basic spawn points at the rear, not one. That way one team can still pin the other down but it isn't quite so near-impossible to escape the trap. As others have said though, it's a harsh lesson, but if you learn it and make sure you don't go down to minimum spawns then you won't have the same problem. Protect your spawns and use logis to open new ones.
WT Sherman Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 63	Posted - 2012.07.15 22:01:00 - [37] - Quote I only saw one mention of something that should have been obvious. This is a weekend of new players, IGN, and that was probably a team made up of mostly noobs and of course they were slaughtered. I may make a thread to suggest that when a team is obviously outclassed that they don't be redlined or spawn camped. All it does is make players quit playing the game before they ever learn what it is all about. Your k/d ratio doesn't mean **** during the beta so why run it up against noobs. With that being said, once the game goes live and we are fighting as a corp, all bets are off, and as in EVE, there is no such thing as an unfair advantage.
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.07.15 22:31:00 - [38] - Quote Someone weren't doing their job then. That Sagaris on the roof is extremely vulnerable to Swarm launchers and forge guns. Start shooting at it, and it'll HAVE to retreat to recharge its shields. That is the opening you need to break out of the spawn zone, and possibly plant some new uplinks. That said, I think dropping a tank or LAV on the roof of buildings should be nerfed.
Raynor Ragna 266	Posted - 2012.07.15 22:35:00 - [39] - Quote Get a build with a drop uplink. Spread them out and your team will improve.. Plus you get points when people use them.
Osiris Greywolf Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 80	Posted - 2012.07.15 23:02:00 - [40] - Quote The spawn points in the last build were way better than the ones in the last build, and the only good one in that build (beside CRUs) were the Attackers FOBs, which was virtually impossible To Spawn camp, due to it being behind a mountain, but also as I said before, the whole purpose of this build is to test vehicles, so I don't really mid, as long as they improve the spawn points in the next build.

Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 808	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:56:00 - [41] - Quote Osiris Greywolf wrote: The spawn points in the last build were way better than the ones in the last build huh
Encharrion L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 104	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:16:00 - [42] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: Osiris Greywolf wrote: The spawn points in the last build were way better than the ones in the last build huh
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:17:00 - [43] - Quote I posted a fitting that's designed specifically for this situation in the Scout thread. All-BPO Scout fitting with Uplinks and AR. I've used it when I joined a game in progress and my team was being camped by 3 HAVs, after breaking the spawn-camping, I got to kill a Surya, and I know one of the other 2 had been a Sagaris (I died to it on my first spawn).
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:23:00 - [44] - Quote http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqyjOc3EpT4 ----------- ----------- Just sayin.


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