DUST Search - [Feedback] Logistics Dropships aren't really worth it.

EVICER wrote:

General Funguy wrote:

I have been saving SP for days just to be able to upgrade to the Logistics Dropship, namely the Prometheus. Upon accruing enough points and blowing a fair chunk of ISK, I realize that it has significantly less PG & CPU than the Grimsnes and even the Gorgon. Now I realize that is has a built in CRU, which I am assuming is why it has less fitting capacity. But after doing the math I've realized that these numbers have been lowered past the cost of a CRU. So, while it may be true that you are getting an an extra 200HP on your armor and an extra High Power Slot, You really can't use it for much.

It's really better to just use the standard ships since you have more fitting capacity AFTER equiping the Militia CRU than you start with when you use the Logistics Ship. True, you don't get the extra High Power slot, but you CAN equip better modules.

I don't know if this is the case with the Caldari ships, and I don't care to waste more SP finding out.

So uh, can I have my 1,000,000+ SP back? I would have been 100x better off spending that on a Marauder. Or maybe you could just not nerf the PG and CPU so much.

Man thanks for the thread...I started down this path but the more I look at it the less and less appealing it gets.I thought the mobil cru would kinda be a bonus but if the trade off is relatively the same.I was looking at that the last time I was playing and was thinking about that but hadnt broken it down mathematically to see if it was worth it....ouch bro


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General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 03:31:00 - [1] - Quote I have been saving SP for days just to be able to upgrade to the Logistics Dropship, namely the Prometheus. Upon accruing enough points and blowing a fair chunk of ISK, I realize that it has significantly less PG & CPU than the Grimsnes and even the Gorgon. Now I realize that is has a built in CRU, which I am assuming is why it has less fitting capacity. But after doing the math I've realized that these numbers have been lowered past the cost of a CRU. So, while it may be true that you are getting an an extra 200HP on your armor and an extra High Power Slot, You really can't use it for much. It's really better to just use the standard ships since you have more fitting capacity AFTER equiping the Militia CRU than you start with when you use the Logistics Ship. True, you don't get the extra High Power slot, but you CAN equip better modules. I don't know if this is the case with the Caldari ships, and I don't care to waste more SP finding out. So uh, can I have my 1,000,000+ SP back? I would have been 100x better off spending that on a Marauder. Or maybe you could just not nerf the PG and CPU so much. [Edited so fewer people take some of my comments too seriously] I realize I'm not actually getting my points back.
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 03:58:00 - [2] - Quote EVICER wrote: General Funguy wrote: I have been saving SP for days just to be able to upgrade to the Logistics Dropship, namely the Prometheus. Upon accruing enough points and blowing a fair chunk of ISK, I realize that it has significantly less PG & CPU than the Grimsnes and even the Gorgon. Now I realize that is has a built in CRU, which I am assuming is why it has less fitting capacity. But after doing the math I've realized that these numbers have been lowered past the cost of a CRU. So, while it may be true that you are getting an an extra 200HP on your armor and an extra High Power Slot, You really can't use it for much. It's really better to just use the standard ships since you have more fitting capacity AFTER equiping the Militia CRU than you start with when you use the Logistics Ship. True, you don't get the extra High Power slot, but you CAN equip better modules. I don't know if this is the case with the Caldari ships, and I don't care to waste more SP finding out. So uh, can I have my 1,000,000+ SP back? I would have been 100x better off spending that on a Marauder. Or maybe you could just not nerf the PG and CPU so much. Man thanks for the thread...I started down this path but the more I look at it the less and less appealing it gets.I thought the mobil cru would kinda be a bonus but if the trade off is relatively the same.I was looking at that the last time I was playing and was thinking about that but hadnt broken it down mathematically to see if it was worth it....ouch bro Yeah, I just looked at it again. I can equip the Grimsnes with a Militia CRU, a Converse Shield Booster, 2 ST-1 Missile launchers, a Polarized Armor Regenerator, Energized Nanite Plating, and 60mm Nanofibre Plates, if I use the Powergrid Expansion Unit 1. In order to equip the EXACT SAME modules (without the Militia CRU of course) on the Prometheus, I have to use a Type-G Powergrid Expansion System(which costs alot more), AND THAT'S IF I LEAVE ONE OF THE HIGH POWER SLOTS BLANK! I really hope a DEV sees this and chimes in at some point, because I feel like I just got screwed. I think someone should have at least bought me dinner first. [EDIT] This setup can be done on the Standard Dropship (Grimsnes) for FAR cheaper and you only lose 200 armor HP!
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 04:22:00 - [3] - Quote Longshot Ravenwood wrote: Does it have any other role bonuses you may have overlooked or differences in speed/mobility? Not according to the stats. The only differences I can see are far less PG&CPU than the standard ships (even less than the militia ship), +200 Armor HP, and supposedly it has a built in Mobile CRU. And really, no amount of extra speed is going to help when it comes to swarm missiles. Especially protos, considering you get less fitting capability and only 200 more HP. Even if it were used to provide support for ground vehicles, there isn't enough power to easily use remote repair units, and it would be a sitting duck for swarms. Really, for the SP cost and the added ISK cost of the ship, the Logistics dropships should be just as feared on the battlefield as a Sagaris. Id be willing to pay more just to have better fittings. I don't know what they were thinking when they decided to nerf the crap out of this thing.
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 04:36:00 - [4] - Quote Longshot Ravenwood wrote: Weak. Maybe they'll get some specific modules that are class specific. That would have been cool if it happened BEFORE I spent over a million SP on it. Maybe some people can save some of their SP now because of my mistake. I really should have considered the numbers a little more before I invested in this. I'll be taking it out for a spin anyway just to see if maybe I missed something but I really don't see what advantages this would have over the previous ship. Especially not for the investment.
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 05:09:00 - [5] - Quote I want to add that after using it in battle it has no advantage whatsoever over the Standard ship, unless you want an extra High Power slot that you can't use for anything good. A couple of swarm launchers lock on and it goes down like a house of cards. This would be an excellent ship if it had the same PG&CPU as the standard ship. A fix to make this ship worth it would be sweet, especially if I don't have to wait until the next patch to get it. An apology from the developers would be nice too. I'm probably going to have to make a new character or quit playing otherwise, since I have used close to 30% of my total SP getting this ship. [Edited, to reduce troll food]
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 06:48:00 - [6] - Quote Buzzwords wrote: i dunno about being as feared as a sagaris.. i think you're misunderstanding what a logistics anything is supposed to do... but i agree that, as reported, it's ******. maybe give them a pair of built in racial reps (armor for gallente shield for caldari) and enough total hitpoints to hang. alternately, just a heavy PG/CPU and maybe even slot layout buff, balanced out by a negative damage modifier. (sort of the opposite of what the marauders get) because again, logistics means support... not combat. edit: also, on a more personal note. it would make no sense to start over on a new character. there's no skillpoint cap. nothing you have now will hold you back from learning anything else in the future. if anything SOME of the skill training you have now is bound to trickle down into other roles and help you out. example, i started this build as a heavy. realized it sucked and trained for other suits. but my heavies mechanics skill still gave my assault suit an armor buff. so even with the million skillpoint "waste" i'm better off than a new character. I'm not going to make a new character, some of the stuff I have unlocked can be used for dropsuit modules and they may still fix this ship. Those are some decent ideas you have though. And I'm not misunderstanding anything, I intended to use this for vehicle support as well as combat, the fitting output is just too low to be effective in this role. Even if it's not primarily for combat, it needs to be able to take/tank damage because swarm missiles are hard to dodge.
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 06:59:00 - [7] - Quote carl von oppenheimer wrote: Idea with that ship is that you fly it around the objectives or hover high high above the sky while people spawn on it and drop to take objectives. Also try fitting repair modules on that drop ship, leave the guns and you should have plenty of room for tank. drop ships aren't meant to be attack vessels but this smallish map turns them to a one, that larger map (crater lake) provided a lot better use for drop ships then this current map which favors tanks more. That's the exact point I am making actually, it should be able to be used as a mobile spawnpoint, support for vehicles, and be able to take a hit. Without adequate fittings it's less effective in this role than the standard ship with a Militia CRU. You are telling me stuff I already know. The first thing I put on a Gallente dropship is an armor rep. And if you have ever used a dropship you would know that you CAN'T remove the weapons on the ship and replacing them with missle turrets REDUCES the PG requirements over the militia weapons it comes with. Not to mention that hovering over an objective is a good way to not only get shot down, but it's also a great way to not make any points. Decent fittings are the difference between having an effective role in the battle and flying around the map dodging swarm missiles the whole match. It takes a lot of work and practice to keep a dropship in the air, if your fitting isn't up to the task it's not going to work out.
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 07:23:00 - [8] - Quote onlyelisha wrote: General Funguy wrote: A fix to make this ship worth it would be sweet, especially if I don't have to wait until the next patch to get it. An apology from the developers would be nice too Why do you need an apology? We're in beta, it's our jobs to find bugs and to test out equipment and make suggestions on how to make it better. You should have expected things like this to happen. The game is far from being complete so there's obviously going to be things that need to be buffed/nerfed etc. Go throw away a million SP on something worthless and maybe you will understand. It costs almost as much to unlock this ship as it does to unlock the Sagaris. Those points don't benefit any other abilities or equipment. They only count for that ship. I worked for days to build that up since dropship pilots generally don't make a lot of points to begin with. I could see this being unique and worth it if there was no Militia CRU. But if that option is there on all vehicles, this one should be a distinct upgrade over the previous tier. So yeah, kinda got ripped off, so an apology would be nice. I would consider more power for the ship an excellent apology.
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 07:35:00 - [9] - Quote Hawk Von Draum wrote: General Funguy wrote: ISo uh, can I have my 1,000,000+ SP back? erm no its a beta, your supposed to test stuff and see if it works that our jobs and in that regards well done hopefully ccp will look into this and buff the ship or they might be nerfing the other ships god knows Yeah, I'm sure a lot of people will be testing this underpowered vehicle. That was why I posted this in the first place, they need to see the feedback, both good and bad. I am testing, I'm not one of the people who treat it like a demo. And don't take everything so seriously, I am well aware that I'm not getting the points back. I'm just trying to make a point. Buzzwords wrote: yah, good find but you're not getting your skillpoints back. in fact you're pretty much GUARANTEED to LOSE all your skillpoints when the game goes live anyway. sorry to be the party shitter :\ We'll have to start over probably several times. I've already done it once since I joined the BETA when the 2.0 patch was released. It was the same with the MAG beta. I'm just making a point, I guess I should have pointed out the sarcasm a little better.
General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.12 07:56:00 - [10] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I have seen a drop ship outfly swarm missiles before extra speed can be worth it except you're usless as an attack craft then. I have outflown them, it's easier said than done, and you usually still get hit when you try. Added mobility and acceleration(like with the weight reduction modules which lower your armor) is nice but even still about all you can do is try to run until your armor/shield reps recharge so you can take the next hit. The logistics ship isn't any faster though. But you hit the nail on the head when you said that it makes you useless. If you are running the whole game it doesn't do any good. And you don't make any points. Iron Wolf Saber wrote: From what I understand its supposed to fit a Cloaking device as well. which is why it doesnt need as much defense in theory. But electronic warfare isnt out yet. That would be really sweet, but the way it's fitted now, that cloaking device would still be better suited on the standard ship. Unless the cloaking device is only for logistics ships. That would make it a little more worth it.

General Funguy Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 58	Posted - 2012.07.14 03:04:00 - [11] - Quote All it would take to make this ship completely worth it would be to give it the same CPU/PG as the one before it and keep the built in Mobile CRU.