CAN YOU PLZ NERF SWARMS LIKE REALLY!!!! OR CAN YOU ACTUALLY BUFF THE ADS!!! Im not sure if your considering more than 1 set of swarms but its something to consider. If I pull out and ADS then they with pull out AV. I don't have a problem with that other than swarms and rail guns. PLZ fix.

My usual fit it 1 com light shield regen, Complex shield hardener, Complex light shield ext, XT missiles, and Enhanced missile amo.

Believe it or not they tried that by making the turning circles wider.

Guess what . . . .

Dropships still got hit, but now tanks couldn't get hit at all in urban environments, the rockets just piled into the ground.

My usual fit it 1 com light shield regen, Complex shield hardener, Complex light shield ext, XT missiles, and Enhanced missile amo.

Heavy plate used to be good but anti armor AV does so much damage now you're better off with a light plate and a hardener so you can AB out as soon as you hear AV.

I've been flying for 4 years, preaching to the choir ;) I don't run Missile bus anymore because there just isn't enough resist unless like you say, you run dual hardener and I HATE that fit because I hate downtime. I prefer to constantly bring the fight even if I die because I prefer excitement and fun over not losing ISK. Plus, what's the point of flying if you aren't constantly challenging yourself against superior odds?

I have vehicles maxed 100% and wouldn't have it any other way.

On the rare occasions I play it's almost always the same. I play solo so it changes my tactics, however I always spawn AV incubus, clear turrets and try to deny vehicles, then if there isn't much vehicle pressence I switch to Python to harass infantry and be a glorified street sweeper.

Unable to backtrack invisible swarms

I'm notorious for arguing for the sake of argument :p I will always be a bit butthurt about swarms just because of how they function, and how we get stuck without ADV or PRO hulls, but it is what it is.

If I can fly solo against full stacked proto AV squads and not die or only die once, then it's certainly possible. Out of every role in this game, ADS benefits hands down the MOST from having a squad to back you up. Being able to drop people on tower nests or to call out AV that's hiding in cover is invaluable, and not to mention having scans on the ground.

I hate having to run the second I hear AV but honestly, that's how it should be. Good ADS pilots can clean house on infantry if left alone, which is why I LOVE AV incubus. Nothing makes me happier than giving AI Pythons hell

I'll probably test out dual rep again at some point, I just like having the extra tank because I always seem to get one shot by damage stacked rail tanks when I least expect it lol.

I agree with most everything you've said before but I have to partially disagree here.

Commandos hopping around can easily survive if you don't land direct hits and the impact from their swarms make it really difficult to land that direct shot sometimes. Also as I'm certain you're plenty familiar with, infantry often don't render till around the 150 meter mark. If you know where the nest is you can blindly shoot down into it, but a lot of times it's just not practical to engage a heavy / commando swarmer.

Which is fine, you're spot on that the moment you hear / are hit by AV you need to burn out and reassess. Sometimes it's just as simple as leaving their nest alone and harassing other points on the map till they try to chase you, then you just go to the other side of the map lol.

More people need to run rail LAV with two AV in it, easily the most frustrating thing to deal with as a pilot other than another skilled AV incubus.

Yeah, vehicles are so OP that when PC teams se a lot of them they don't get vehicles to counter... they all go AV...

They know that they got a better chance with AV and turrets than they do grabbing a tank themselves against good tankers or dropship pilots, period! Also, the AV cost 10x less!

Drop missle extneder lol use pg upgrade then just use enhanced hvy shields pro burner and enhanced hardner. Learn to rotate your mods and engage accordingly that fit is complete garbage. No disrespect intended. You can also use a burner complex hvy extrender and basic hardner increasing survivability but decreasing engagement and reengagement time. You can replace your hardner with a booster if you like but it really just isn't as good. There are a couple other good fits and I can even give you ones with multi turrets and the same survivability.

Engage with hardner on after first swarm hitn your burner and leave while identifying where the threat is. Turn hardner off before you are completely away and the burner when you're safe. You can now reengage knowing where the threat is and hit him from where he can't lock then land and place a link securing the overwatch. This is the basics. There is no way they can take you n out short of three perfectly timed calmandos using beacons and at that point you've pulled enough away from the real fight to still be doing your job. Call for your teammates at that point to wipe them and retake overwatch. Team play is op you know? Till then you can help on another objective. There is no large balance issue. As I said before ALL I do I pc is ads.

This is why people think ads is weak and others strong. There just aren't enough experienced pilots anymore in the game. People find the very rare good ones and can't ever kill them because we know our advantage and disadvantage. The ones that aren't as experienced lose tons of isk and think av needs nerfed.

Thank you for your "advice" but . . . .

1) I was one of the experienced pilots in the game, not particularly note worthy, but I could easily force a team to pack 4-5 swarms to try and get me.

2) Cover? In mid-air? Kind of defeats the point of gunship don't you think. The turning circle Nerf was supposed to allow Dropships with experienced pilots to physically dodge swarms. Instead they got it wrong and you ended up with swarms that couldn't get round corners, but would do a 180 5m from your Dropships to hit your weak point.

There is nothing you can "git gud" for against 4 volleys of officer swarms. I'm not even a dropship pilot. You want to know why I'm posting here then? Because I know what dropship pilots have to deal with. One of my corpmates is a dropship pilot and he only complains about two things. Swarms, and installations.

Thats why theyre officer swarms... should they not be able to bring it down? they cant bring down a grim or myron nearly as easy and ads is less survivable sounds like working as intended.

It's a dropship, not a gunship.

90% of your survivability is derived from your mobility.

I wasn't around in EB for those battles you refer to, but i'm sure what you say is true. That doesn't change the facts about the financial comparisons of vehicle v AV though.

We have as good of ads pilots as i'm looking for, and they do what I ask. Being praised by your 20 man circle isn't praise

I'm not arguing the skill of the pilot from pilot to pilot, that's a moot point. I'm arguing the fact that AV is indeed proto while ADS not so much. AV yields insane points, and a monkey can do it, ADS not so much. I haven't really went in depth, or added tanks to the equation yet?!

Even the best pilot's die once, and lose half their PC earnings. AV guy can die once, and isn't even phased financially.

One more thing!

I humbly request that any vet stop bringing up unbalanced PC hay days if they're going to keep ending every statement with "but we don't play this game anymore"

Well that's helpful?! You guys were outclassing 85% of the playerbase in experience and SP, but want to do a comparison of greatness? I don't get that mentality. Half the playerbase just recently realized what SSD cards were, but you wanna say that they all suck lol! Well, ofcourse they sucked back then! You guys were the equivalent of armored mechs vs primative rock throwers?!

If you still play by all means have at it, but if you're "retired" do us all a favor and STFU! Also, if you're playing with a titan one, or any of the other performance enhancing modifications please DO NOT tell us how great your 1v1 skills are?! Seriously?!

Not directly aimed at you Moores, but there's been a large amount of this behavior lately here in the forums, and some of these guys were second string at best by today's standards?! Trying to compare themselves to guys who didn't rock mods who really played well with the team is an insult that I won't tolerate. There were some really good players back then that really were doing it! They deserve their credit, but some of them were simply on the PC team?! Not tactical at all, and couldn't lead 3 little girls out of a wet paper bag?!

Some of them I've never even seen in PC, or heard of, but he slapping on the vet tag saying "well "WE" stop playing this game a while ago cuz everyone sucks but "US"?! I'm reading this sh*t like "who the f*ck is this guy?"

I'm the last guy to ever claim i'm better than anyone else at a role, and enjoy learning from friend and foe alike. These arrogant *sshholes are annoying, and forget how bad the game was back when they were whoever they say they were?! The game is still horribly balanced at best, and there has been FOTM the entire time that guys have taken advantage of. Try that heavy/logi sh*t nowadays and see where it gets you lol!

My hat goes off to any merc willing to fly these skies at any point in this games history because frankly the dropship clearly has been on the back burner on CCP's list for a very long time. Hell i'm a tanker when it comes to vehicles, and can't fly a lick, but I feel their pain trying to do a role that isn't even complete yet?!

Currently, playing PC with almost every merc on the field capable of the same versatility is much harder in my opinion than back in the day when mercs still had skill points all over the place. Back then how many mercs were you guys killing that had 20 mil SP in all their dropsuit upgrades maxed out? How many were prof 5 in every weapon they had, with year's of experience using them? How many had endless versatility in dropsuits and vehicles alike? How many of those teams you faced had a worth while FC? What was the FOTM then lol?

You get what I mean? Some of those vets still play, and if they're honest can vouch for the improved gameplay of yesterday's rookies. I myself, at that time would've been barely at 15 mil SP?! Who was I gonna rock at that level when guys in PC were closing on 80+ mil SP lol? The idea is absurd lol!

Today, literally every merc I face is prof 5, upgrades maxed, year's of experience, and old school knife tricks ain't working on them no more lol! These guys transition fast, adapt quickly, and can do almost everything at the drop of a dime!

I wouldn't compare stack teams of vets killing noobs to the teams of today. Currently EB has beaten every team fighting currently in PC. They aren't the same EB from the past. I wouldn't be here if they were! We don't beat any drums, and raise any flags. We grind away, argue like cats and dogs over tactics, (win or lose lol), and we are still training new players everyday. Some can hack it, and some can't.

I'm positive if the old OH, FA, and others got together and played again they'd be a force to be reckoned with, and frankly we'd appreciate the help since the spanish now outnumber us 3 to 1?! However, we're what's left of the american playerbase holding it down as best we can, and I'd appreciate a tad bit of credit where it is due. Thank you o7

As I already mentioned I already know how to fly a Dropships, I did it when it was suicide. When the accepted way was to afterburner out as soon as someone launched a volley. I did it without the afterburner. Still went positive.

But as I said when I first commented on this thread this no real place for DS and ADS. The maps are too small and to open.

Seems paradoxical hug?
P.S you missed a end of quote tag.

Yeahhh... But..

When those 2x hard incubi sprint as far deep as they can in the redline...

Sometimes I have to choose... Lose the ds but kill them? Or spare them and wait.

... Tbh those fits are annoying... There's waves of opportunity sure... But please; do not Air to Air in "waves."

Those are the people who I realize are scared, only coming out when they know they won't die... Just to run away when they realize they aren't killing you. One hardener, sure... I don't care. But 2? Come on :/ we'll be looking at each other for 40+ seconds... Then you go away for almost a minute...

Meh, it's nice when i let them get shots though... Triple rep is beautiful for air to air

Tbh a fit is up to the user IMHO.

It's like evolving... In 1.7 when i first took out a python I remember the fit...

3 MT missiles, a shield booster, a basic light extend, and a mlt scanner.

It was stupid. But over time I've learned and adapted. I found out what I was good with (AV with rail) and stuck with it.

Right now, i reached the apex of my fitting ability. I have fits made from observations and fits I've experimented on alone.

If i have a gunner:

Python
Particle Accel (front)
AT (gunner)

2 comp shield boosts
1 enhanced heavy.

People would tell me that's a terrible fit, depending on shield boost which fails you sometimes... But, it fits me.. So what can I do? I actually do well with it because being a gunning platform means one thing to me... I just need to fly safe. Simply my play style.

Very few run 2x hards on their incubi... But I have run into one, and that incubus was doing exactly what I said, running in and out their redline.

Hell yeah easy to take down once soft... Low rep and base eHP. But double hardended? Not so easy.

There's a reason why I don't question people's fits... Unless it can be optimized... People run what they want... Unless it's a really questionable fit (mCru on inky for example). Sometimes I recommend a fit (my typical pub incubus for example:

Particle Accel
Enhanced AB
Basic heavy rep x2
Mlt armor plate)

Some might say what the hell is that, others might say goddamn that's effective for it's price!

Hell, my Air to Air incubus is triple rep. Who the hell runs triple rep other than me? Almost no one.

Some people Inky 4.2k (comp plate, comp pg, comp light rep), and I personally cannot use that fit... The low rep just doesn't satisfy me.

People throw a missile on their incubus. I will only rail with it, no ifs ands or buts. If I'm using missiles, it'll be with a python.

Some people are badass with missiles... After 2 years of ADS piloting, I can't even use them as well as I can use a rail, i even think I'm a novice with missiles.. Does that mean I have no experience? Nah, that just means it's not my style (although i use em)

So please, don't question the experience and judge based on fit.

Judge based on their skill and history... I remember the first time I underestimated a pilot... Oddly enough that pilot was Derrith. It was the night before 1.8, gal Lag facility, skirm.

Derrith punished me royally. I thought it was going to be an easy kill cause he had less than 3k aHP.... Big mistake, and I've learned from that.



I treat all pilots the same... I see an ADS, i swing them a "1v1?" message and go.

Tl; dr: fits don't really matter... What matters is how you use that fit to your advantage. Oh and sorry for my storytelling

Incubus w/ mCru isn't as efficient as you think.

Only being able to take 2 people (unless you decide to use turrets), is far more detrimental that you make it appear.

1st, low mobility.

It's only good assuming no AV will be present.. assumptions are bad.
Getting caught in an ugly place (which ALWAYS happens, 100%)... Lacking the mobility can be detrimental.

2nd, people being kicked out ADS.

mCru + full vehicle = drop from where you spawn. The ADS having 2 (or 4 if you want to fill it) seats means whoever else might be spawning... Will get removed.

3rd, must be terminated to use mCru.

That makes sense already. Landing, hopping out, and dropping a link is simply the best thing to do.

For a mCru, i'd shove it into a Grimsnes or Myron... I have a python fit with mCru but I use that only when we lost majority of our uplinks.

In a competitive setting (PC) an AV incubus (the fit I use) is actually excellent at the role; it compliments infantry AV well, and allows me to keep the airspace as safe as possible.

My builds are the builds, it's up to me to make the build assist in winning a fight. E.G: If there are no vehicles, why would I stick with AV?

In pubs, what am I doing? AV. That is important to winning the fight no?

I also end up being the taxi (as my corpmates would call me) anytime I can; quick transportation. Tbh, the ADS does many useful things.

Also,
Fits can only be optimized so far:

E.G: I used to use 300 rep incubus, but I realized the delay on AB was long, i couldn't be as aggressive air to air.

Played around with the fit. Now I use 281 rep + comp AB. I gave up rep to "optimize" my fitting. For my playstyle, nothing beats this fit; it's the epitome of all my Incubus fittings, possibly even all my fittings.

It's like optimizing for cost, you'd want lower suit costs for suits while keeping it just as effective. Basic shield extend vs Mlt shield extend? If you got the resources then.... Might as well.

Anyway, i said it was Air to Air... So that 2x hard fit is more of a waste of time for me, but a serious advantage for the other. If they were able to shoot me down in the "wave of opportunity" their fit was designed for, then, well... That's it.

Gunner fit: point defense, area denial. My gunner lets me know my distance, we can lock off a section of the map until s/he runs out of ammo. That is extremely helpful to the team
We can not only be a force multiplier, we can also be AV and providing uplinks (if someone has them) for the team.

But that's not what I was talking about anyway, I'm saying you can't entirely judge someone's experience based on fit. See? We even had our disagreement in fits but I don't think nothing more or less about your ADS piloting skills.

I can only base someone's skill when I see it in action. That's what I'm trying to say

Dammit! I had the entire reply typed out... To find out there's no draft :(

So I'll make it brief.
-At the same time, building fits that specific leaves the realm of typical fits.. Saying it's only bridge map means one thing, one thing only: Special Fit.

Special fits are fits that define their own role, and goes against the average person's fit / fitting style.

A really good example back when Madrugars had 4000 aHP was this fit I've seen chilling against the redline.
It moved as slow as molasses (all plates and 1 rep) but that redline special fit was not dying.

Another example is my tower attack python.

Mad Syringe seen it in action.... It's beautiful even though i have 1548 sHP.

Mmhm, I've seen 2 rep + hard but there is one reason why I'll never run that fit by this logic.

Either I have everything ready whenever (other than AB) or should I depend on the wait. I've tried it... But the instant gratification that comes from rep > waiting on hards to be at 100%

No one uses 4.2k in air to air anymore.... Rarely.


Lol dw, about blunt or not. I realized it's some (rare) civilized discourse. I like that.

Ugh I'm falling asleep, and I don't trust drafts anymore. I'll end here for now.

some ones been saying this the whole time....