DUST Search - Much scrubbery!

maybe deadcatz wrote:

Alena Asakura wrote:

maybe deadcatz wrote:

Its called being a merc.
Do what it takes to win.

It's called being an idiot.
Do what it takes to lose the benefits of bonuses.

Bonuses that mean death if you are out of proper engagement area?
Why should that assault limit himself to a rail rifle? Maybe he likes the fast regen on sheilds and loves cqc but isn't a fan of armour? Why not combine?

When you fit full racial gear you embody that factions strengthes.
And its weaknesses.

I can do pretty well with a scrambler pistol. But I have level 5 gallente assaults and level 3 amarr assaults. But the scrambler rifle is a smoldering pile of nerfed garbage and the scrambler pistol doesn't benefit from the amarr bonus so chances are I'm putting a scrambler pistol on my gal assualt and a magsec SMG on my amarr assualt to compliment its laser rifle.

Point is when there are endless ways to customize to adapt. The bonuses just make it more enticing to fit racially.

If I'm amarr logi, then I have plenty of armour. Why sit in the back waiting for people to spawn on my links when I can grab an assault rifle and defend my links to avoid a redline?

If I'm a Mk.0 scout with nova knives attempting to shank people but someone pulls a gal logi and permascans my team should I let him farm me because I don't have enough damps to evade his scanners? No I'll simply switch to my gal scout and blow his head off with my breach scrambler pistol.

What if there's an extreme amount of action and I need more sheilds than armour but all the engagements are practilly in nova knife range? So why not grab a caldari assault and rack a shotgun?

Tldr you aren't a scrub,you are a autistic blueberry who purposly limits themselves by fitting full racial and condemning others for adapting to the battlefield.


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Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 227	Posted - 2016.01.03 11:37:00 - [1] - Quote I'm seeing a lot of blatant unadulterated scrubbery lately. Guys in any suit, using any weapons. The suit bonuses mean nothing. They just use whatever they want, in whatever suit they happen to be wearing. I say a Rasetsu today with the State Rail Rifle swapped out for a Killswitch GEK-38 Assault Rifle. No bonuses of course, but that didn't stop him killing me. I must be a pushover. :) Seriously, it's gotten ridiculous. I have no problem with people wearing whatever suit they have trained into or any weapon that works for them, but why use a GEK-38 on anything but a Gallente Assault?...
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 227	Posted - 2016.01.03 11:47:00 - [2] - Quote Reign Omega wrote: Alena Asakura wrote: I'm seeing a lot of blatant unadulterated scrubbery lately. Guys in any suit, using any weapons. The suit bonuses mean nothing. They just use whatever they want, in whatever suit they happen to be wearing. I say a Rasetsu today with the State Rail Rifle swapped out for a Killswitch GEK-38 Assault Rifle. No bonuses of course, but that didn't stop him killing me. I must be a pushover. :) Seriously, it's gotten ridiculous. I have no problem with people wearing whatever suit they have trained into or any weapon that works for them, but why use a GEK-38 on anything but a Gallente Assault?... The GEK-38 is a fabulous rifle, and yes, I'm sure it will work on any suit at all. Are the bonuses that useless as to be basicly irrelevant? I feel like....you may be the scrub for adhering to a combat philosophy then being upset at losing a fight? No we didn't lose the fight. Or are you talking about me dying? Doesn't matter to me - I run BPO MLT fits. I don't care how much I die. And of course, I'm not using an Gal Ass myself when I'm using an assault rifle, although I do when I use a GEK-38, so you could almost say that I'm just as bad as them. And no I don't think that they were doing any better than me for using such a ridiculous fit. If they had taken advantage of the racial bonuses, they might have been even better. No, I just shook my head at them. They could do so much better using the correct fits. Or maybe the bonuses are irrelevant? Are they that weak that noone cares?
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 227	Posted - 2016.01.03 11:48:00 - [3] - Quote maybe deadcatz wrote: Its called being a merc. Do what it takes to win. It's called being an idiot. Do what it takes to lose the benefits of bonuses.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 03:04:00 - [4] - Quote shaman oga wrote: What should he fit? Another RR? sniper rifle? Swarm? It's not that easy to find a suitable weapon which also benefit from the bonus. An ARR is the logical choice. The problem with the RR is the kick, the slow rate of fire and the ridiculous charge time (half a second, and it feels like a lot more). The ARR has none of these things, is very like the AR really, which I also quite like and use on my Gal alt suits. If you don't like the RR but want the RR bonuses, the ARR is the logical alternative. If you don't like any of the Caldari weapons, you're better off using the suit that fits with the weapon you want. Oh, and yes, I know that sounds ludicrous. But if the bonuses are worth anything (which some are saying they aren't) then it's worth the effort.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 03:07:00 - [5] - Quote maybe deadcatz wrote: Alena Asakura wrote: maybe deadcatz wrote: Its called being a merc. Do what it takes to win. It's called being an idiot. Do what it takes to lose the benefits of bonuses. Bonuses that mean death if you are out of proper engagement area? Why should that assault limit himself to a rail rifle? Maybe he likes the fast regen on sheilds and loves cqc but isn't a fan of armour? Why not combine? When you fit full racial gear you embody that factions strengthes. And its weaknesses. I can do pretty well with a scrambler pistol. But I have level 5 gallente assaults and level 3 amarr assaults. But the scrambler rifle is a smoldering pile of nerfed garbage and the scrambler pistol doesn't benefit from the amarr bonus so chances are I'm putting a scrambler pistol on my gal assualt and a magsec SMG on my amarr assualt to compliment its laser rifle. Point is when there are endless ways to customize to adapt. The bonuses just make it more enticing to fit racially. If I'm amarr logi, then I have plenty of armour. Why sit in the back waiting for people to spawn on my links when I can grab an assault rifle and defend my links to avoid a redline? If I'm a Mk.0 scout with nova knives attempting to shank people but someone pulls a gal logi and permascans my team should I let him farm me because I don't have enough damps to evade his scanners? No I'll simply switch to my gal scout and blow his head off with my breach scrambler pistol. What if there's an extreme amount of action and I need more sheilds than armour but all the engagements are practilly in nova knife range? So why not grab a caldari assault and rack a shotgun? Tldr you aren't a scrub,you are a autistic blueberry who purposly limits themselves by fitting full racial and condemning others for adapting to the battlefield. Some very good points here. I've thought long and hard about the apparent imbalance between the racial suits and weapons. I've come to the conclusion that CCP simply thinks you should use whatever you want to use, despite bonuses. As some people have said, the bonuses aren't really that good, anyway. Just another way they encourage FOTM.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 03:09:00 - [6] - Quote Ahkhomi Cypher wrote: Sometimes the suit bonus doesn't matter for what you want and lolracialpurity Galass w/ARR Amass w/Flaylock Any mando with Swarms or MD Shotgun Bolt Pistol Minscout w/AScR We have options bruh. Its not against the law of the universe to try things I didn't say it was. In fact, the whole thing with CCP is that you can use whatever you like. But they do put bonuses on the suits for particular weapons, and to not take note of those bonuses means you don't get them. Perhaps there are people who have simply NEVER used the right weapons with the right suits and therefore don't understand the benefits. Oh and yeah there are people who say the bonuses are worthless.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 03:20:00 - [7] - Quote Stefan Stahl wrote: I beg to differ, the Caldari Assault with an AR is the original assault loadout, back before the other racial assaults were implemented and when the AR was the only rifle in the game. It's not scrubbery, it's oldschool. My beta-stuff is locked into an alt (that can't trade because I can't buy Aurum for it), but when I run that I generally equip a Skinweave Caldari Medium with a Toxin AR. It's a different playstyle that has certain disadvantages (lack of bonuses) but works well in certain scenarios (in this case: good 1-v-1 capabilities in CQC, quick recovery between encounters, resistance bonus to RR, CRs, HMGs and explosives). Personally I'm still chewing through the racial playstyles. 2 years after release and I haven't even touched the Minmatar suits. Currently working on my GalAss instincts. But I can see that beyond the 16 racial suits and their 'vanilla' playstyles there are a huge number of hybrid fittings that can be both useful and enjoyable. I wouldn't call having fun scrubbery. I've wondered about this sort of thing myself, the benefits of mixing racial stuff against the lack of bonuses. The AR is an amazing weapon. I use it with my Gal alt and it's just phenomenal compared with the RR except for range, and ONLY for range. But there are variants that get range, anyway. The thing for me with the RR is the slow ROF and long charge time. They are death in CQC. The ARR and MAGSEC are great for that, but other than the starter fits, none of the BPOs use the ARR and only the MEDIC uses the MAGSEC. As I primarily use BPOs that's a concern for me. This combination (CalAss/AR) may be "old school" but it's still racially incorrect and sounds like it dates from a time when the game hadn't been developed fully to include such concepts. They go way beyond what suits use what rifles. They actually relate to the EvE universe, where Caldari are experts in "kiting" and sniping, and use shields with negligible armour because they fight at distance, versus Gallente who use extreme close range tactics, with ships that are heavily armoured and use blasters which are devastating at close range. You can see the same sort of thing in Dust. To an extent, there's no place for the typical Caldari fighting style in Dust - everything is close range. But for long distance, Caldari suits and weapons are excellent.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 03:27:00 - [8] - Quote CarlitoX Jojooojo wrote: Ahkhomi Cypher wrote: Galass w/ARR Nowadays this is called FOTM'ing Exactly.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 03:32:00 - [9] - Quote Happy Violentime wrote: Alena Asakura wrote: Reign Omega wrote: Alena Asakura wrote: I'm seeing a lot of blatant unadulterated scrubbery lately. Guys in any suit, using any weapons. The suit bonuses mean nothing. They just use whatever they want, in whatever suit they happen to be wearing. I say a Rasetsu today with the State Rail Rifle swapped out for a Killswitch GEK-38 Assault Rifle. No bonuses of course, but that didn't stop him killing me. I must be a pushover. :) Seriously, it's gotten ridiculous. I have no problem with people wearing whatever suit they have trained into or any weapon that works for them, but why use a GEK-38 on anything but a Gallente Assault?... The GEK-38 is a fabulous rifle, and yes, I'm sure it will work on any suit at all. Are the bonuses that useless as to be basicly irrelevant? I feel like....you may be the scrub for adhering to a combat philosophy then being upset at losing a fight? No we didn't lose the fight. Or are you talking about me dying? Doesn't matter to me - I run BPO MLT fits. I don't care how much I die. And of course, I'm not using an Gal Ass myself when I'm using an assault rifle, although I do when I use a GEK-38, so you could almost say that I'm just as bad as them. And no I don't think that they were doing any better than me for using such a ridiculous fit. If they had taken advantage of the racial bonuses, they might have been even better. No, I just shook my head at them. They could do so much better using the correct fits. Or maybe the bonuses are irrelevant? Are they that weak that noone cares? Runs militia bpo, wonders why he dies. Then calls 'other' people scrubs... Dude. You're the scrub in the crappy mil bpo fit. I run the "crappy mil bpo fit" because I want to learn to deal with its shortcomings. Did you read my post? I didn't complain that I died. I expect to die. I'm commenting on the fact of the combination of the suit and the weapon and the fact there are no bonuses for them. To me, scrubbery is people who will do anything to win, but fail because what they tried to do doesn't work. I don't consider what I'm doing to be scrubbery. But I'm seeing a lot of other people doing what I would consider to be. Most don't by the way. Only a few who kill me are actually using fits that don't match and therefore don't have bonuses. But the proportion is on the rise.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 03:38:00 - [10] - Quote korrah silain wrote: So...you are complaining that someone was using a non optimum weapon/suit combo? Why? It's their choice go run that, and really it makes the game have more variety if people aren't playing the obvious optemized fit combos. Maybe they like the shield regen of the rasetsu assault, but don't like the firing pattern/delay of rail weapons. Get over it. I'm already "over it". It doesn't bother me for myself. They're obviously better than me if they killed me with such fits. I'm not commenting on that at all. The problems with the RR (and to a lesser extent the ARR) are to do with the fact that it's a DISTANCE weapon, for fighting at distance, as are the shield suits. Trying to use shield suits at close range is in itself difficult. Better to use armour. Since noone in this game is restricted to using the one race's suits, just train the right suit and weapon for both bonuses and your play style. Rasetsu is a shield suit, for more distance fighting, which matches the RR that's on it. If you're going to use an AR, you're better to be in a GalAss with good solid armour and fast armour repair.

Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 10:37:00 - [11] - Quote demonkiller 12 wrote: I run my Dragonfly Assault with pretty much every weapon, because i spent like a year when the only assault suit was the Caldari, it basically became my favourite racial suit, and the only weapon you could really use with it was.... an Assault Rifle... It seems that there have been some very strange evolutions in the game over the years. Only two racial MMCs. Only two racial light and heavy vehicles, only two races dropships. There is a lot that has been left out of this game over time, and that has severely warped the possibilities in the game. There are also some strange irregularities in the BPO dropsuits. 'Raven' scouts for instance are G-1, but there is no equivalent C-1, M-1 or A-1. Instead, each one of those is some other type of suit. The clear statement from CCP, right or wrong, is that if you're going to have a BPO scout, it should be Gallente. 'Raven' Assaults however, are Caldari, I believe, perhaps this is related to your point that once the Caldari suit was the only assault?
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 12:09:00 - [12] - Quote Sbundo'D wrote: Caldari suit.. good regen and hit n' run ability w/ AR = good to start an engagement, high accuracy Gallente suit.. can be fit to have a bit more tank.. maybe add a triage hive w/ RR = platform to tank damage, charge rifle and return fire.. It may be outside the bonus, but imo the "wrong" weapons often match better to the function of a suit. Or I see you mention a combo Calass ARR+Magsec.. what makes you think Calass AR+Magsec won't end a fight faster?? regardless of the bonus being "wasted" Before you call people idiots for adapting their suits.. take a step back.. And think.. why are you following a racial doctrine in a game where we lack modules to achieve such fits anyway?? I have stated elsewhere why I follow a racial doctrine - briefly, it's because I wish to see how much can be done sticking with racial doctrine, where FOTM is the order of the day. I believed that it should be possible to max out the skills of one racial doctrine and be better for it. However, I've learnt since then that CCP have not made Dust with the same attention to such detail as they have for EvE. In EvE one can do just this and have a satisfactory outcome. With Dust, I'm starting to believe it's not possible. On another note, I don't see Dust as "just a game". To me it's an intellectual exercise. I'm deliberately isolating the Caldari skills to my Caldari alt and the Gallente skills to my Gallente alt, so I can compare them to see whether they are in any way equal, and I've found they very much are not. The Gallente alt is newer than the Caldari alt, but is much superior in CQC. I owe that to the armour of the Gal suits, where the shields of a Cal suit just don't stand up to the same barrage. But it's early days yet. In time, the Cal alt may turn out to be superior after all. I doubt it though at least for CQC. Lastly, it's not just about sticking with a racial doctrine, or whether a suit/weapon combination is "wrong" - it's about so much more. Shields are not as good as armour for CQC. Slow firing high damage weapons are not as good as fast firing lighter damage weapons for CQC. I don't believe it's just coincidence that the primary weapon for Caldari is one which is good for range, as are the shields on the suit, while the primary weapon for Gallente is one which, like their suits, is good for CQC. I do use my Rasetsu in CQC and find that after swapping out the damage mods for shield extenders, it actually can sport quite a good shield tank. However, it's not as good as even the Frontline - GA fit for CQC. I call people idiots because of what the particular players are. I don't see very experienced players mixing these weapons and suits very much. I believe that to be because they understand that there are some very important benefits to the bonuses. There are two major bonuses for RR on CalAss suits - reload speed and kick. The reload bonus particularly is quite noticable, for instance, between the Rasetsu and the Frontline - CA suits. It's abysmally slow on the Frontline suit but is quite fast on the Rasetsu.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 228	Posted - 2016.01.04 20:19:00 - [13] - Quote Stefan Stahl wrote: I don't think tank type defines combat scenarios as much as you seem to. A shield tanked Caldari suit can work really well in CQC because of it's resistance bonus. Where a Gallente Assault suffers extra damage from grenades and Massdrivers, Combat Rifles, HMGs and Railrifles a Caldari Assault gets damage reductions against those (very common) damage types. That effect can be very large - when making an assault on Mass Driver users the Gallente Assault takes 50% more damage than the Caldari suit. The same goes for weapon choice. The +10% damage bonus of the ARR against armor tends to outperform the raw DPS advantage or the AR when dealing with high-armor targets, even in CQC. On the other hand a scrambler rifle will always be the superior choice against shields, regardless of range. While suit bonuses should entice racially correct fittings to provide orientation, the fact that we can mix and match suits to specific needs is one of the important aspects of Dust. In contrast to Eve online racial mixing is possible and useful in almost any way conceivable. I particularly enjoy equipping my Amarr Assault with a Flaylock pistol as a sidearm. The Scrambler Rifle deals with shields very easily but has a tough time against armor. If engaged with high-armor targets I will try to close the distance and switch to the flaylock after the enemy's shields are gone. Sidearms are an area where racial purity really can hold you back. This is where I think there are a lot of misconceptions fueling the mismatching. Where is the resistance bonus for a CalAss suit? I can't find it. It has a bonus for weapons use, like the RR kick and reload, but the only resistance bonus on a Caldari suit is for the Sent. The Scout has a bonus to profile and cloak use. The CalMando has a bonus to hybrid rail gun (RR, ARR, SR) reload and damage. Only the Sent has a shield resistance bonus, unless we are not being told all the bonuses. I wouldn't be surprised if there are things we're not being told - it wouldn't be the first time - or perhaps there USED to be bonuses, and people still think there are. Unless there are shield bonuses on a shield suit, armour is going to be better in CQC. A CalSent has shield bonuses, a CalAss does not. You need to be aware that the bonuses differ from suit to suit, just because one Caldari suit has a particular bonus, doesn't mean they all do. As for being able to mix and match being one of the "good things" about Dust, yes, it's good that people can do what they want. However, just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD. You're always better off to fit to the bonuses of the suit, unless the suit doesn't have any. If you fit an AR to a CalAss, you are effectively creating a suit/weapon match that has no bonuses at all - the CalAss only has bonuses for the RR, ARR and SR. It does NOT have shield resistances like the CalSent. You might as well use a Caldari Medium Frame ck.0. I note that many people actually do exactly this. A non-specialised suit could have advantages if you aren't going to use the bonuses that come with a CalAss.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 254	Posted - 2016.01.14 21:19:00 - [14] - Quote Shamarskii Simon wrote: Called "special fitting" in my terms. Special fit -- a suit or vehicle which is built specifically for one or two purposes. It excels in this/these specific areas; however, is underpowered for general use. E.G: Python fit for anti-AV. This fit (calAss + AR) used to be the fit. But things changed... That's why it's special fit now. Sucks to be the calAss w/ AR going against a galAss w/ AR or have a ranged battle. But damn under some sweet conditions, you've taken YOUR fit, and made it maximize YOUR style. Hell... I LR + CalAss. I find it better than RR + calAss. Sometimes you just gotta play you. I'm starting to think that generally, Cal suits, weaponry and tactics are simply unsuitable for most of what I do. Cal suits are shield based which is for distance combat, not close range, where armour excels. Yes, you can get shields to do what armour will do but it takes a hell of a lot of shield tank and associated resources to do it. Cal weapons tend to be high ranging, more for sniping type activities - they're high damage, but typically slow ROF and the charge time for the RR and bolt pistol is ridiculous if you are in a heat of CQC. As a result of the above, Cal tactics traditionally are all about distance - "kiting" in ships, sniping on the ground. The development of the ARR is an answer to CQC requirements, but is only a "standard" weapon on the likes of the Frontline and Medic BPOs. The CalLogi, I believe uses a State Assault Rail Rifle, but other than that, all the other Caldari APEX level BPOs with a light weapon use the State Rail Rifle. I focus on the BPO fits because: 1. They are the "standard" and represent a sort of direction and philosophy for the Caldari fits 2. I typically only run BPO fits and am always looking for the best one to do what I need. The result of this is that even though I have APEX level LP Caldari suits - Hawk, Rasetsu, Shogun, Samurai, I find the Frontline and Medic suits more suitable for most CQC. The Medic is actually the most suitable, as I can switch quickly to the MAGSEC, which reloads faster than the MLT ARR and is almost as deadly. I find the Hawk, Rasetsu and Samurai much better at range where my marksmanship with the State Rail Rifle is akin to that with a Sniper Rifle. The Samurai also has a State Sniper Rifle, which I find totally adequate. Balance all the above with the Gal version of everything: 1. Gal runs armour tanks, not shield. Even on the GalScout the armour lasts longer than the CalScout's shields, and survives better in close range encounters, surprise attackes, etc. 2. Gal uses AR, which compared with even the ARR is high ROF, more deadly generally, and still manages to do a fair job at distance using the iron sights. 3. Even the Gal MLT BPOs are better than the Cal versions. On my Gallente alt, whether I use my Raven scout or one of the MLT fits, all using MLT BPOs, my experience is far superior to that of this Cal alt, which has about double the SP of the Gal alt. I'm starting to think that Caldari are the poor relations in Dust. If as I do you stick to BPO fits, and stick to racial lines, it becomes very obvious that Caldari just aren't up to the same sort of close range combat that Gallente just eat. With half the SP and only MLT fits even on the Raven scout, I'm far more successful with my Gal alt than with this Cal alt, against the same sort of opponents. I'm still basicly a noob with both, but I can hold my own pretty well with Gal compared with Cal. I'm rapidly training up the Gal alt to the same SP as the Cal alt, and already the Gal alt is significantly better. I'd like to find a fighting style that suits the Cal way of doing things, but I fear there is none at least not in Dust, if you discount sniping. Any Cal that's highly successful tends to be either running proto gear or something like an AR or shotgun. I yearn for the day when the shield tank on my State Assault ck.0 is good enough to keep me alive long enough for my State Kaalakiota Specialist Rail Rifle to fire its first shot. :) I suspect instead I'll be using the Ishukone ARR...
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 254	Posted - 2016.01.14 21:25:00 - [15] - Quote Cesar Geronimo wrote: I use a Quafe CR and a Quafe LR with my Centurion Commando for lolz... What? All I spec'd into was GAL suits and what am I going to do, not use a free Quafe weapon? I have some interesting free weapons, too, but none of them are BPOs. I've used them from time to time just to see what they're like, but unless they're BPOs I can't get used to them or my use of my normal weapons will suffer. Take for example, using an AR I got from a box - I get used to the lightning quick fire of it even compared with the ARR which still requires charge is still not immediate, and then I go back to my ARR or worse, RR, and I'm dead. If I had BPOs of these weapons it might be different, and I might even grow to like mixing it up, but without BPOs, I just can't afford to, at least not if I have to go back to the ARR and RR...
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 255	Posted - 2016.01.15 05:40:00 - [16] - Quote SereneJedi wrote: Alena Asakura wrote: Cesar Geronimo wrote: I use a Quafe CR and a Quafe LR with my Centurion Commando for lolz... What? All I spec'd into was GAL suits and what am I going to do, not use a free Quafe weapon? I have some interesting free weapons, too, but none of them are BPOs. I've used them from time to time just to see what they're like, but unless they're BPOs I can't get used to them or my use of my normal weapons will suffer. Take for example, using an AR I got from a box - I get used to the lightning quick fire of it even compared with the ARR which still requires charge is still not immediate, and then I go back to my ARR or worse, RR, and I'm dead. If I had BPOs of these weapons it might be different, and I might even grow to like mixing it up, but without BPOs, I just can't afford to, at least not if I have to go back to the ARR and RR... Want a MLT AR BPO? No, not really. I could do with an ARR BPO but from what I've read here, trading is basicly scammer heaven, so haven't looked at it. If I really get serious about it, I might buy an ARR BPO with aurum, but otherwise, I'll just stick with the BPO fits I have.
Alena Asakura Caldari Logistics Reserve 255	Posted - 2016.01.15 05:50:00 - [17] - Quote maybe deadcatz wrote: Nope. And you never looked at this from an economical point of veiw. An apex is a free suit. A bpo And what do you get out of strongboxes? Aurum gear. Suppose that redberry got some of those kill switch geks that have got you so butthurt and threw them onto his handy dandy apex suit? Maybe he's trying to save isk for some reason. I dunno. Pay for his hamster to have surgery or something? Because if I remember correctly it costs nothing to slap on some free guns on to your free bpo. Ok.... So what are you saying, that it costs me nothing to put a Killswitch GEK on my Rasetsu, or Hawk? True it costs nothing ISK or AUR wise, but it costs me skillwise to use a better weapon than the RR or ARR I have on the current BPO suit. I will eventually run out of Killswitches, or AUR versions of the SL-4 ARR, for that matter. Then I have to go back to whatever came on the suit. I don't see this as an economy thing. If I don't use the AUR weapons I've collected, it doesn't cost me anything. If I do use them, it costs me both the AUR weapons and the skills I lose. I don't care what they use, let them use anything they like. Me, I use what's on the BPO suit, so I learn to use it as best I can and don't fall for the temptation to upgrade it in the endless quest for the better suit and/or weapon. If this was a real Militia and I were fighting for real, I would be issued with the equivalent of the Frontline-CA or Medic-CA suit and just have to learn to use it. Right now, I'm finding those suits better than either my BPO Rasetsu or Hawk, because of the RR.