They reduced the lock on range to 100 meters I believe. Anyway look, infantry kinda need swarms to be able to defend themselves from aircraft. Most people aren't good enough to hit a ds with one of the other av weapons. Sorry, but they are your counter. There will always be a big back and fourth about swarms being op because the home in on targets. Personally I think they are in a good place. Personally I also believe they are harder to use than most piolets give credit for, just because they are the most common anti air threat.

They reduced the lock on range to 100 meters I believe. Anyway look, infantry kinda need swarms to be able to defend themselves from aircraft. Most people aren't good enough to hit a ds with one of the other av weapons. Sorry, but they are your counter. There will always be a big back and fourth about swarms being op because the home in on targets. Personally I think they are in a good place. Personally I also believe they are harder to use than most piolets give credit for, just because they are the most common anti air threat.

I tag Dropships all day with my PLC. I get its hard but its not impossible. Swarms are an ok weapon to have in the game, but damn do they kill fast.

I'm just saying a single Swarm can effectively deny almost all vehicles if they are in the right position. And if you compare the investment of ADS and necessary skills to level 5 swarms, its not even close.

Of course air needs a counter, but as a new pilot I find I extremely frustrating to have a 200+k isk ADS cancelled out by a single Swarm costing a quarter of the price. Not to mention flying an ADS takes skill and the Swarm is a lock on, basically opposites.

Maybe you just suck at being a dropship pilot? Ever think of that? Maybe its you sucking thats the problem rather than the swarms being op?

As a new ADS pilot I find proto swarms terribly overpowered. Sure my DS isn't fully leveled out and I don't have upgraded mods, but I still have 4500+ehp and if my hardner isn't up I get 2 shot from proto Swarm launchers.

Even if I see the first shot and take off like a madman, the second round will seek me no matter how far I fly. It's incredibly frustrating to try and practice your Dropships skills just to have 1 swarm Launcher hard counter you. The price difference, skill investment difference and time to learn doesn't even compare!!

I could understand plasma cannons being extra effective against Dropships because of the skill involved to hit them, but simply locking on and spamming 2 shots is idiotic.

I know they just changed swarms, what did they change? Cause as a starter DS pilot swarms are op as ****! It sucks.

/rant over

As a new ADS pilot I find proto swarms terribly overpowered. Sure my DS isn't fully leveled out and I don't have upgraded mods, but I still have 4500+ehp and if my hardner isn't up I get 2 shot from proto Swarm launchers.

Even if I see the first shot and take off like a madman, the second round will seek me no matter how far I fly. It's incredibly frustrating to try and practice your Dropships skills just to have 1 swarm Launcher hard counter you. The price difference, skill investment difference and time to learn doesn't even compare!!

I could understand plasma cannons being extra effective against Dropships because of the skill involved to hit them, but simply locking on and spamming 2 shots is idiotic.

I know they just changed swarms, what did they change? Cause as a starter DS pilot swarms are op as ****! It sucks.

/rant over

Swarm lock-on range was reduced from 175 to 150m.

This biggest issue with Swarms vs DSs is the amount of effort involved in each side: DSs require a lot of effort to get competent in; Swarms are incredibly easy and simply to operate while offering a lot of rewards (read: WP) vs DSs (though HAVs are a different story.)

Which is why Swarms need to be separated into anti-HAV and anti-DS/LAV variants. That would be one step in the right direction with regards balance.

Except it wouldn't, at least not if what your actual goal is to resolve your percived problem.

That proposal only creates a seperate variant of the SL which can only kill LAVs and DSs, without changing any mechanincs of the SL, leaving it the same "fire and forget" (or whatever buzzword people use now) weapon.

If you're trying to imply that surviving in an ads is in any way an easy thing then you've never flown one. Also if you read the thread, OP is pretty new at it. Take your canned HTFU attitude and apply it where it's useful.

I don't fly because I suck at it, I know I suck at it so I don't fly, I don't cry on the forums about how it should be easier for me.

Good pilots have blown my ass away whilst I've been av'ing them with swarms/fg's/plc's. Sucky pilots usually die in flames.

though i fully understand the sentiment of your post, you are not being killed in 2 swarm hits.

My dogfighting fit has no plate, or an afterburner. With hardener down it takes three shots. It may take three shots with the hardener up anyway, but the hardner is for deflecting small rail, buying time against a large rail or forge that i can make miss, and various fire, not for attacking a strong position. Its built for intercepting roof campers, speed, and fire power.

My ground attack fit (or roof top attack fit) has a plate, rep and hardener, and that one can tank 4 shots, but just barely. Tiny sliver of health. If I am not out of dodge or the swaner dead, then i'm dead. Natuarlly, i value my 300+ k droship over that 100 k swamer (if even that considering all the LP gear, aurum proto AV, i still have 80+ haywire swarms from boxes) so i dont want to push it to the 4 hits. If he gets a second volley in the air and i am gone.

I'm a now retired ads, and sds pilot. It doesn't matter. You can do flips, stall in midair, use the inertia from free fall to catapult under a bridge with mere inches of clearance, doesn't matter, they will follow you to hell and back. Yes, you can outfly a volley with a ab, hell if you are nose down and flying out of hell you can occasionally escape. Make swarms capable of being dodged, turn radius if they pass a Ds reduced to 0. If I do a flip and I'm flying at top speed it shouldn't turn as fast as it does. Hell, give Ds a flare module at the very least. We currently have to rely on something (hardeners) which should be removed from the game. Give us flares instead!

I feel your pain brother as an ADS pilot myself swarms are my biggest problem. It is not the range that is the problem as you woukd need to be in 150meters of the guy it's the swarms maneuverability, the fact along that u need a fuel injector to out run these damn things should say enough but the fact that they are IMPOSSIBLE to out maneuver is just overkill for Ds. That combined with an ADS very limited fitting space and to thew model slots is what leads to many ships going down

all vehicles r op if proto out. but the skill of driving or flying is the most imporatant thing.

UPDATE: Some people stated theres no way I could have died to just 2 swarm rounds. Well I flew a bit last night and only lost a few ships, two deaths in particular were so fast I could barely activate my hardner and afterburner before dying. Despite getting very far away in one, both deaths were because I stayed in the DS to see the damage from the swarms.

I was blown away at how much damage was being put out per round. My ADS at current levels has 900shp and 2700ahp, heres the screens of my deaths to what was 2 solid swarm hit impacts. If there were 3 rounds fired one did not impact like the rest. This happened twice yesterday so I took screens of both incidents.

http://imgur.com/X50EVqo

And

http://imgur.com/nmRHSyd

Not even on Cal commandos. (They get the swarm bonus right?)

As a new ADS pilot I find proto swarms terribly overpowered. Sure my DS isn't fully leveled out and I don't have upgraded mods, but I still have 4500+ehp and if my hardner isn't up I get 2 shot from proto Swarm launchers.

Even if I see the first shot and take off like a madman, the second round will seek me no matter how far I fly. It's incredibly frustrating to try and practice your Dropships skills just to have 1 swarm Launcher hard counter you. The price difference, skill investment difference and time to learn doesn't even compare!!

I could understand plasma cannons being extra effective against Dropships because of the skill involved to hit them, but simply locking on and spamming 2 shots is idiotic.

I know they just changed swarms, what did they change? Cause as a starter DS pilot swarms are op as ****! It sucks.

/rant over

UPDATE: Some people stated theres no way I could have died to just 2 swarm rounds. Well I flew a bit last night and only lost a few ships, two deaths in particular were so fast I could barely activate my hardner and afterburner before dying. Despite getting very far away in one, both deaths were because I stayed in the DS to see the damage from the swarms.

I was blown away at how much damage was being put out per round. My ADS at current levels has 900shp and 2700ahp, heres the screens of my deaths to what was 2 solid swarm hit impacts. If there were 3 rounds fired one did not impact like the rest. This happened twice yesterday so I took screens of both incidents.

http://imgur.com/X50EVqo

And

http://imgur.com/nmRHSyd

Not even on Cal commandos. (They get the swarm bonus right?)