In a proper competitive match scouts don't need their own radar because they have dedicated active scanners helping them as it is. Damps are where they find their strength. Due to this, gal scouts are the most viable. Cal scouts are viable up until focused scanners on gal logis come out, or if the opposing team brings out a logibros which can passively scan up to 50 meters at 17db. Min scouts are suicide fast hackers and they do this role well.


In short, the "scout" doesn't have issues if you refer to the scout simply as the gal scout. The other ones, yes, have problems.


I would disagree about the assault thing. In terms of purely selfish rockstar play, there is nothing better. In the end the goal is to kill the other team and no other suit does it better.

Speed + stealth + powerful passive scanning all together was considered OP. Speed + stealth + moderate passive scanning would be fine.

Supporting a team with scanning is a role more suited to logis.

If you already have access to it from multiple sources, clearly you don't need it built into your suit.

The only real exception to this would be the amarr scout which has a deeper potential scan, but a dinky radius. He's a problem child, but weak enough that I believe deserves the extra range.


Now if you're going to lobby that active scanners should be removed from the game entirely, feel free. That's a totally different angle which I can respect.

If it were up to me, uplinks wouldn't exist either. But this isn't really a thread about equipment design, it's a thread about role viability in regards to killing. Currently the scout is viable due to the before mentioned reasons. You may not like those reasons, but it does not render them untrue.

If you already have access to it [scans] from multiple sources, clearly you don't need it built into your suit.

The only real exception to this would be the amarr scout which has a deeper potential scan, but a dinky radius. He's a problem child, but weak enough that I believe deserves the extra range.

Also, please remember the title -- Kill interaction.

This other secondary mechanical role stuff is good to talk about, but it's not really where I'm coming from with the message I'm trying to get across about viability. I'm specifically talking about kill interaction and combat viability.

If the scans are coming from somewhere then the only question of relevance to me is whether or not the suit is capable of using that intel to kill people in a competitive environment. And currently, yes. It can. That's all it means to this particular discussion.

Shotty-go-bang can get off his ass and address me himself.

"... feedback that people present constructively ..."

I think this is a good response to Adipem Nothi's suggestion to Nerf Assaults to counter power creep. If the other suits are relatively balanced combat wise against the Assault suit, then it makes seance to balance Sentinels against Assaults at their current level.

Speed is the fotm right now.

Hit detection is at it's badest with speed tanked suits.


"So no more nerfs to plates, since they are not used that much anyway."

I thought Rattati wanted a scout-only penalty but couldn't do it so implemented the strafe penalty for all plated suits. It was just hoped that scouts would suffer more from a strafe penalty than other suits.

As it turns out this is wrong. Strafe is useful on all suits and the strafe penalty just makes plates a poor option on anything. Balance-wise this was good for scout balance. Plates on scouts was OP, so nerfing them effectively nerfed scout's ability to fit like an assault, as intended. But served to make the modules poor on other suits too.

Unless I'm wrong and it is a scout-only penalty. I'll try to find out. This uncertainty just highlights a reason why it was a bad idea though, as there is no in-game description of extra strafing penalties. So no way for players to know about it other than finding old forum posts.

I don't want to heavily armour scout suits. I just don't like a rather strange and obscure mechanic like double plate strafe penalties.

I'll try to help find the Dev post.

Hotfix echo
I've found it.

You will see that where it says strafe penalty on plate is doubled, the bit that says "on scouts" is crossed out. Implying the strafe penalty is on all suits.

Just do it the same way you do cloaks tbh. Big fitting cost, big fitting reduction skill built-in.