Systematic executions in the Bataclan.
I have difficulty understanding how people can be capable of such an act. What twisted resolve drives these monsters?

This is Europe... we do not have an arms tradition like in the US.

We do not have an arms lobby group like the nra, and we have a strict regulation on arms. (speaking about Belgium)

Due to these reasons we do not have shootings like in the US...

But with these events... one might consider...

I cant believe im seeing this on the Dust 514 forums.

Thats the point. Lets say ISIS has 100k (i think they do actually) send in 20mil UN and boom, done.
OR
Gas all of ISIS held land with sleeping gas strong enough to knock out anyone for days. Then drop Paratroops with gas masks and boom, done.

Also, heres a weird question, if conscription was returned, would women be drafted?

lol feminists be like,"equality, equality, eq...conscription of women? we'll pass on that"

We can amred ourselves but it is not easy like in US.
We can have just semiautomatic arms and we basicaly cannot take them outside without reall reasson.
For this we have leagly stated army.

I understand what you mean, but take it from other side of coin.
If we will have possibilities like you boyos have for example in Vegas.
It will be propably bigger masacre.

I just hope it will be better, i don want war near my friends and family.

It s ok for me and my family thx postapo
(i live 6 km from this place )

be glad you live in a safe area

versus

hmmmm the daily sound of a military helicopter doing a flyby and the daily question of is it the all clear or does it mean another Cartel gunbattle in a few moments

That's partially true in my opinion.

We in Italy have at least 2-3 boats of irregular immigrants everyday. But still, at least for what I know, none of the irregular immigrants has been involved in any of the recent attacks in Europe.

The problem are the people who were born and raised in Europe/US. That's why you can't really say who is the terrorist and who's not. Also, France has always had the strongest presence of immigrants from middle east, and many of them are even 3rd/4th generation French. It is not so easy.

In a "traditional" war you already know who is the enemy. Now, you don't know who they are. They don't have a specific nationality, nor they can be easily recognized. You can decide to attack IS in their "home" but the problem is not IS itself.

As someone before me said, the problem here is religion and its interpretation.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not even atheist, but religion, may be (and has certainly been) strumentalised in order to manipulate the (ignorant) masses. And when you manipulate people from the second largest religion, the problem becomes huge.

That's why EU can't do nothing. We have seen way too many wars because of religion to let this happen again.

what is boyo mean??

Yet, 7/7 over here they were mostly born and raised over here, but with the boats coming in they can easily be sleepers and just bide there time really and let 6months pass and then strike again when everyone is looking somewhere else.

I do agree the religion and its interpretation is the main problem but this has been happening for years now and they believe it to the core and the fact that there is over 1 billion muslims just means that if 10% believe that is a big problem and that is not including those who do agree with them but say nothing, even christians crusaded at a point but eventually stopped and calmed down but muslims have been at it for centuries in some form or another and do not look like stopping.

It also doesn't help that the west have gone into the middle east for whatever reason (oil) and consistantly likes to stir **** up which then gives IS a excuse to **** about and go jihad somewhere, look at syria to get rid of assad they armed what we found out later was IS and now it is back to bombing the middle east and creating the cycle all again for the next generation to jihad against the west.

It seems to be the standard cycle, west interferes/bombs and a terrorist group pops up bombs the west and the cycle repeats.

War is here already.

texas and mexico border is kinda calm compared to where i live in Tamaulipas, Victoria.
eeh on the plus side its easy to make a chess set just from bullet caseings that drop in the streets.

The idea of an oppressive group attempting to crush your civil liberties, insurgency and plain criminally minded bastards are the reason we have that arms tradition that some people hate and others take to idiotic absurdness.

Most people who genuinely fear the act stripping them of their civil liberties assume the government will do so. But we have a massive buffer of two oceans between us and extremist states and groups.

Government has traditionally been the oppressor historically. What we have now is terror tactics used to inspire otherwise liberty-minded (to a greater or lesser degree) governments to enforce islamic law upon non-islamic majority to protect that majority from violence.

But that is the goal of any terrorist organization. It's never just to kill people. It's to push the government to crack down on it's own people oppressively by law for security until the population rebels or they accept the rule of law demanded by the terrorists.

If the populace of a country does not have the will to endure and fight back, it will happen. Insurgency and terrorism are the new war faced by governments. The question is, what will be the breaking point, and do we want to see what happens when the first nation loses it's collective sh*t and decides to just turn the generals loose without civilians putting their fingers into the pie?

It's going to happen. Question is where the pot boils over first.

God help us when we find out.

Boykos boykos

The survivors told:"They had flawless french."
Ergo they were in France already, possibly even studied there.
Even the police told this is work of someone who knows area and made long time observation.

Ergo

That was not work of someone who just arived to EU.

There was actually one really sad story.
There was one doctor, he is originaly tunisian chirurg who lives with wife and daughter in France many years.
After his family heard gunshots they looked from ablcony and saw injured people.
His wife told him:"You must go outside and help them."
Do you know what he told her?
"I dont want, im tunisian and i basicaly dont have any batch or ID to prove im doctor."
Honestly i will be scared too, it is really thin line.
People can have respect from you but they can lynch you too.
And we all know what we can do when we are scared, angry etc.

Just one had syrian passport and honestly it is not mean anything.
He can be one of the few last waves, but he can be even just on syrian who arived long long time ago.
I want be objective here, honestly i do not believe that someone who just arive will have perfect location knowledge.
I see biggest possibilty these mongrels were already for some time in the France.
I dont advocate them, but when i will know i will know.
And what i know right now is that was just hideous act of cowardice, because if they have issue with army forces attacking their nonsence, they should attack army not inocent people.

I was really out of this problem, but after this attack my first thing in mind was basicaly "nuke them".
Honestly i know there is still people in place where are they, but if you ask me i will be for carpet attacks, supported by surgical strikes 24/7.
This is enough.
Im for people, for equality etc.
But enought is enough.

F*ck religious comparisons.

This is murder, an act forbidden by law.

Further, it is mass murder carried out in military fashion with intent to attack the fundamental rights and privileges enjoyed by the french.

In other times this would be declared an act of war.

It may have been done ostensibly for religious reasons. It may be the west is "reaping what it has sown."

These insurgent bastards are murderers. They are undeclared, un-uniformed enemy combatants on french soil. Screw the religious connotations, justifications and the bs.

An attack is an attack is an attack. Now the question is, will the french be the first to bring this sh*t to a screeching halt and actually take off the kid gloves?

All smartass jokes about the french at war aside, the french aren't lightweights when they don't have a sudden bumrush of ten tank divisions bombing across the country from a (theoretically) non-hostile neighbor.

If the french government acts, this isn't going to be a debate about christians versus muslims. It's going to be a sovereign nation retaliating against a rogue would-be nation fostering insurgency and murder within her borders.

It may be religious to the terrorists, but to the regular soldiers, it's just another fu**ing meatgrinder. It won't matter who the bad guys pray to at the end of the day.

Question remains: who says "screw it, no more playing nice" first?

Please, educate yourself on Islam. The history and nature of the Quran. Stop ignorantly dismissing the issue with a generic catch-all arguement. If you don't want to believe then don't, but don't try and argue a over a subject that you reject and are more than happy to be dismissive about. It leads nowhere.


Again, old testament taken from Jewish history and belief the interpretation by misguided people using Christianity as a basis for oppression is not justified by Jesus nor many Christians. Remember, Christians are supposed to only follow Jesus. There is a good reason for that. Case in point, your statement.

Muslims, regardless of attitude about conquest and oppression are commanded by their belief to do so. It is simply a matter of them wanting to concern themselves with it. Remember, Islam is not just he Quran, but the Hadith and the will and history as example of the historical person of Mohammad. He was a killer and conquerer.

Because if you know and you see, you must act.

Just some interesting photos:

Afganistan

Iran

Yeah we saw how that went with Nixon in Vietnam... "We're going to bomb them to the stone age"

That was in a jungle. The middle east is pretty much a field with cities. Easier to aim. Also this is 40ish years later. Better tech.

We can but we won't... I don't see that happening anytime soon, especially with the backlash the U.S got for bombing that hospital of Doctors Without Borders. Imagine now purposely bombing all of ISIS/Extremist held ground in the Middle East... They may be bad but there are still humans in that occupied area who can't get out. If we start releasing mass amounts of nukes in that area we will have more blood in our hands than they ever had. Congratulations you eliminated a terrorist organization and killed millions, another one will rise again with even more hatred.

Doctors without borders was a goddamn travesty.

However, I guarantee you that while the nerds immediately responsible for that show of cataclysmic stupid will probably burn, there will be no such concern should ISIS continue it's flagrant "war with the entire world" BS. I do not believe for an instant that ISIS would have treated the doctors in that camp any more gently than the shells that should not have hit them.

But realistically, nukes are not on the table. There are too many reasons not to do that. The only way that happens is if ISIS has one and they use it, or if any other rogue state has one and uses it. The consequences otherwise would be too dire for anyone to seriously consider.

I consider it far more likely that various governments might set the troops loose, and to the generals say "Don't tell us how you did it. Make them stop. now."

I believe a century of domination and violence outweighs a couple of hundred french people.

Further, France already declared war by bombing DAESH, so blowback is to be expected is it not?

Where was your outrage and forum posting for the 60 people DAESH killed in Lebanon 3 days ago?

This false sanctimony on display is part of the reason why people dislike Westerners. The media has deeply conditioned your responses to events.

This complete willful ignorance of history, even when that history is extremely short term, is toxic to real understanding.

Your friend who died is worth just as much as a Lebanese or any other type of civilian. Not more though.

Beyond that, control yourself, and your emotions. We all lose people. It is nothing new. Handle yourself appropriately, instead of calling for nuclear war because you don't know how to deal with unpleasant feelings.

As long as this blatant double standard exists where Western lives are somehow more valuable, then more of this stuff will keep going on.

Although considering that DAESH only exists because of the Iraqi war, this is kind of a you break it, you bought it type of situation. Not that anyone will be thinking that way right now in all the patriotic fervour, but it is factually correct.

I really pity the thousands more middle eastern civilians who are going to die because of the escalation this will bring.

Some of the arguments here are like stupid.

It's like Japanese people seeking for revenge because of WWII facts-

I guess we're not safe here in Italy then: I heard people are raising an army in Tunisia because, you know, we destroyed Carthage a "while" back and never gave them the status of "cives". Today's people must be very angry for that reason.

French fighter bombers already dropped cca 20 bombs on Raqqa
(it is funny how someone told here yesterday how france will do nothing)

US will do something, they just do not want be in hurry like before.
They waiting for full support of GB and France

Did you serve in Iraq or Afghanistan by any chance?

hmmm... ok. I'm only asking because I'm trying to understand where you would be in a situation where you would have Muslim men ask for your marriage (most likely jokingly) AND also see so many radicals that you would be unable (or unwilling) to know the difference between radicals and everyone else.

anecdotal evidence is really only that. anecdotal. I'm sorry that you've had a bad experience. Hopefully one day you'll be able to move past that. To show you how a person's viewpoint can be completely relative, my own experiences with Muslim men have been really good so far. I have only known 1 jerk, and only one situation where I would say I was uncomfortable with the topic of conversation (he was telling me how nice it was to have wide hips because it's good for child-birth). But that is by far the exception. One of the nicest men I have ever met (a good father and family man) was Muslim and I loved talking to him and felt safe knowing he was a Security Guard where I worked.

On another note, I have felt more hatred and racism from White men, but it would be really ignorant of me to assume that all White men are like this (or that all White men are like Americans, or Germans, or French etc).

I feel really heartbroken for France. But the evil people behind this attack are not "Muslims", it is Isis and they are an incredibly dangerous, incredibly delusional splinter group using Islam and rage to fool people into fighting for them. Isis claim to be Muslim but they don't care. They kill Muslims, Christians, Jews, and everyone else, all for their own agenda.

Also, I hope your ptsd eventually gets treated or at least becomes manageable. That's something that's really hard to live with, and even harder to explain to other people. I'm sorry.

Nuclear is not even needed, it would be overkill but would send a strong message and make lots of glass.

All you need is cruise missiles and just level every single city they have, once the country becomes a parking lot then it is over since you do not just hammer them mentally you also take away any economic potential they had so live is **** for everyone.

Think of what the allies did to dresdan but times it by a 1000 and then some just for the few actions of a small group, non stop bombing until there is nothing left.

I dont balme the french for deciding to bomb the **** out of them, they did bring it on themselves and so be it, reactions and consequences just like the french dude in the matrix said but while this immigration thing is still ongoing most of the EU is at risk to more of these attacks, maybe get austrailia in to sink the boats.

Maybe not trying to dominate them?

Maybe letting them manage their own resources and choose their own governments.

The West has never tried a method that didn't involve violence or corruption.

You act like we were sitting on this side of the Atlantic minding our own business and Arabs just decided it was time to kick some ass. It's just ridiculous.

Same book

Doesn't help that the vast majority of silent muslims actually agree with the extremists

Muslims tarnish there own reputation when they come over to a new country say the UK then demand sharia law or start up **** gangs which only attack white girls which has happened far too much and nothing is said yet again because of the fear of being called racist.

If we reject muslims then attacks like this cannot happen because attacks like this are carried out by muslims so if no muslims then no attacks, the west is far too welcoming you wont get saudi arabia opening there arms to christians, they dont even allow churches to be built yet in the west we keep opening mosques like supermarkets.

While you will say its only a small % of the muslim population there is over 1 billion of them, 10% which openly agree with ISIS is 100 million let alone how mnay silently agree with them.

It is only going to get worse if you ignore the problem

Well of course ignorant racists are going to agree.

Pretty sure you would find yourself in solid agreement with Klansman and Neonazis as well on this one.

@General 'Admission' Skeeter - Let's parachute your @ss into ISIL lands and let you do some reasoning with your peeps.

Put that money where your mouth is. =ƒûò

They were ransacking settlements well before the christian crusades even took place does that mean we have an open goal in which to hit them?

We can play this game time and again of who shot who, the west have taken an intrest in the ME because of oil or to defned isreal etc but if your gonna play that game expect to get hit, france got hit now thjey gonna rain hell on whoever for retaliation.

Both sides are at fault no matter what but really the west should not bother and keep out and give the final ultimatium 'if you attack in any shape or form us or our allies we will turn you into rubble using any means nessasary'

Meddling in the ME has brought nothing but problems all for oil, take the oil away from the ME and they become irrelevent.

Both sides have reasons, i can go back before the crusades when muslims attacked christians etc just how far back do you want to go?

Exactly! That's why I won't unless the US Marines, French "Old Guard" and Jean Morin's Foreign Legionnaires are with me.

We just shoot them here stateside. Beheadings not so much. Remember we're civilized. We even give them a pillow to rest their head for a proper Moslem burial.

@Mort- If your a Military Veteran (not gaming Vet LOL) I would advise against it.

The Mullahs will be very unforgiving to YOU, if arrested. Remember, it's a Theocracy.

Ever heard of the christian Inquisition in the middle ages ? These christian were killing and torturing every people they judged infidel. Where does the bible say that killing and torturing is part of the religion??? And still they did!

It's EXACTLY the same thing here. In order to get more power, leaders of IS used the muslim religion to build an Inquisition-like order. Punishing those who don't think the same as them.

Were all the christian inquistor? No. Are all the muslims terrorists? Of course not.

How couldn't you understand my point ?

Actually Muslims were less cruel during the medieval age than in contemporary times.

The Jews were originally the most violent in antiquity, then the Christians during the medieval age and now the Muslims are finally having their radical chapter. It actually only sprang up recently during the Soviet War of Afghanistan. Ironically enough Osama Bin Laden was our ally at the time. The U.S invested a lot of money, intelligence and training into the Mujahideen.

So it's not really ancient practices that are failing to leave, but actually new ideologies emerging. Early Muslims didn't actually force people to convert, and actually preferred to tax people of other religions in order to fund their territorial expansion. The persecution of non Muslims is relatively new.

Oh don't be too quick on that. The mainstream may be out of the business but every group has extremist morons in the mix.

And let's be bluntly real, very clear here.

Most of the crusades were, from start to finish, concocted and executed to give landless noble sons the opportunity to sieze and conquer land. The ignorant peasants making up the foot soldiery were the ones duped into buying into that "holy war" BS.

The exception being the children's crusade, which was a tragedy of delusion and outright fanatic idiocy.

But the crusades had very little to do with God and everything to do with co nquest. Same as ISIS, same as any other murderous extremist group, God is how you get the ignorant plebes in line. It was always about control.

I'm american.
Also, AP is:
Advanced Placement (AP) is a program in the United States and Canada, created by the College Board, which offers college-level curricula and examinations to high school students. American colleges and universities often grant placement and course credit to students who obtain high scores on the examinations.