el OPERATOR wrote:
Yeah, happened to tune in and just saw that. I'm not sure which one I find funnier, the irony of the source or the soundbite clip that took me down memory lane. There's memories and/or footage of everybody losing maybe even losing hard at some point. CAP worked to achieve, SOG has worked to achieve, that's a given. Quality work produces quality results tho and I guess, really, thats the only difference between your interpretation or mine. Although even then we are both cognizant and respectful of the relative time frames (which is always a factor) since, as any craftsman can attest, timing is always a factor in achieving quality. Just as circumstance is always a factor when evaluating results.
In many ways that post Rogue Wedding period is arguably a more challenging period to have risen to the top in since a huge piece of that already experienced playerbase quit. Leaving the playing field a little more even and success more reliant on skill with tactics and strategies versus simple SP domination. Not to discredit the beta groups but there can't be much denial about that SP and what it meant in matches between pre-Uprising combatants and post-Uprising combatants. That's just that RPG thing: play more, skill more, be/do more.
Just as the argument about success in the full decline period. There's just significantly fewer players total. Very significantly fewer total. After a certain point the effect of that change in circumstance can't be neglected.
Which may be part of Shep's point about the standard-bearers who subsist. Built of the remains of one or a thousand, does the banner mean any less to those who'll still carry it? And should it mean any less to those who see it from afar? I could be totally wrong, Shepherd's a bigboy, he can explain himself. But as far as historical records go, so long as the timeframes are there for the results evaluations and the results themselves are accurate all the history really needs is accurate transposition. Accuracy of internal dramatics included.
Rereading the last couple pages on this I don't think we're really in much disagreement about conclusions. Just which sets of parameters are framing and defining them. Molden Heath/PC and what the corps who've been there and what those leaderships and players did while they were there speak for themselves.
Two things.....now if timeline doesn't matter and one agrees wholeheartedly with Shep's point about those "still carrying the banner", then it doesn't end. And S.O.G., for what it's worth should get their just due. There was a moment where everyone was nervous (some even scared) about facing S.O.G. But imo, it doesn't matter cause corps picked up what was left when others retired.
Secondly, sp gap wasn't the issue either. From the start of pc, everyone was here and most were floating around the same amount of sp. CRONOS, EoN, ROFL, LOI, NF, STB, Zion, etc. The first exodus began with the Imps and PFBHz. But mostly everyone was still here. EoN became the first dominant force in pc on a massive scale. Then after the FEC war, EoN left minus a few guys. PC wasn't what it was but it was still alive as AE became the powerhouse. Sp still wasn't an issue because pc still consisted of vets. There were small corps trying to get in but it was a skill issue and not an sp issue. Anyone that came in when the game was released would have had enough sp to be competitive.
People were starting to fade out but it wasn't until fanfest '14 where you saw the huge exodus from the game. People left the game cold turkey. After that there was no real competition left. I believe this is when OH rose to dominance but there was no real opposition. All of the players that were in the dominant corps that stayed had to find a new home. So corps that started to get some success, acheived it because the bad boys left and not moreso because they "caught up in sp".
A lot of the corps that came up later and achieved some sort of pc success want to put it all on sp and I can appreciate that. But it wasn't the case. The game was out for more than a year and they would have had enough time to catch up in sp.