DUST Search - amarr peeps are rioting in EVE

Aeon Amadi wrote:

Jadek Menaheim wrote:

Aeon Amadi wrote:

knight guard fury wrote:

honestly its no different then character trading so i dont see why there so up[est about it

As a nine year Eve veteran, it is different than character trading. Character trading has permanent investments of skills that creates a specialized path for the character, be it a Super pilot, trader, etc. This whole SP Transfer conundrum is nebulous, vague, and boils over with issues for abuse. There is nothing to stop a player from throwing money at their problems and buying SP Transfers with which to apply to their main character.

Eve Online is all about the decisions and choices we make having an impact. The butterfly effect. The minute little change that causes giant changes in the future. If you have a player that creates a character, throws however much money at CCP, and then can suddenly fly Titans, it fundamnetally devalues those choices and decisions (if any). Further more, it takes away almost completely the core concept of specialization. If you can just buy SP Transfer packs and fly whatever you want, is that specialization or generalization? Is there even a point to having skills for any reason other than to be a barrier between paying players and non-paying players?

Aeon lay off the doom and gloom scare tactics. SP is still being treated as a scarce player created resource and has diminishing returns when extracted and applied to high and high sp characters. When that stops being the case, then we can freak out. Until then, you are standing in the way of positive progress.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/156e2QWHKguiwQod9FAl1IpBEqcF8hwPC_msCFYK-WUA/edit

Kind of a bias (and a little rude) assertion, don't you think? Positive progress is subjective, always is and always will be. Your idea of positive progress is probably along the lines that it helps new players reach the point of veterans and can compete. My idea of positive progress is not allowing players who are rich IRL gain a competitive edge over players who may barely afford to pay the base subscription fee.

Pay-to-Win is a nebulous term with no clear definition that always seems to change and shift to fit new ideals that come along. Sometimes they get the community's support and sometimes, like what is going on with Eve Online currently, it starts a riot. When you have a greater majority of the community and the CSM saying, "No, this should not happen", it can generally be assumed that the feature is not in the interests of "positive progress" by the game's standard. I'd argue that if this were in the interests of positive progress, it would have been implemented the last two times that CCP tried it. Or at the very least, somewhere along the line of the decade-long span of time that Eve Online has been around.


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deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP Evil Syndicate Alliance. 3	Posted - 2015.10.18 02:20:00 - [1] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Jadek Menaheim wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: knight guard fury wrote: honestly its no different then character trading so i dont see why there so up[est about it As a nine year Eve veteran, it is different than character trading. Character trading has permanent investments of skills that creates a specialized path for the character, be it a Super pilot, trader, etc. This whole SP Transfer conundrum is nebulous, vague, and boils over with issues for abuse. There is nothing to stop a player from throwing money at their problems and buying SP Transfers with which to apply to their main character. Eve Online is all about the decisions and choices we make having an impact. The butterfly effect. The minute little change that causes giant changes in the future. If you have a player that creates a character, throws however much money at CCP, and then can suddenly fly Titans, it fundamnetally devalues those choices and decisions (if any). Further more, it takes away almost completely the core concept of specialization. If you can just buy SP Transfer packs and fly whatever you want, is that specialization or generalization? Is there even a point to having skills for any reason other than to be a barrier between paying players and non-paying players? Aeon lay off the doom and gloom scare tactics. SP is still being treated as a scarce player created resource and has diminishing returns when extracted and applied to high and high sp characters. When that stops being the case, then we can freak out. Until then, you are standing in the way of positive progress. https://docs.google.com/document/d/156e2QWHKguiwQod9FAl1IpBEqcF8hwPC_msCFYK-WUA/edit Kind of a bias (and a little rude) assertion, don't you think? Positive progress is subjective, always is and always will be. Your idea of positive progress is probably along the lines that it helps new players reach the point of veterans and can compete. My idea of positive progress is not allowing players who are rich IRL gain a competitive edge over players who may barely afford to pay the base subscription fee. Pay-to-Win is a nebulous term with no clear definition that always seems to change and shift to fit new ideals that come along. Sometimes they get the community's support and sometimes, like what is going on with Eve Online currently, it starts a riot. When you have a greater majority of the community and the CSM saying, "No, this should not happen", it can generally be assumed that the feature is not in the interests of "positive progress" by the game's standard. I'd argue that if this were in the interests of positive progress, it would have been implemented the last two times that CCP tried it. Or at the very least, somewhere along the line of the decade-long span of time that Eve Online has been around. The massive alliances that make billions and billions of ISK will have the upper hand by far as they can just pump up all the alts they want to. Mining corps will be pumping up newbies into high output miners flooding the market with more ore and bringing the price of everything down a bit. Everyone will be able to hop over to that fun new ship for a massive chunk of ISK increasing overall participation in almost every area of the game. Bored miners are likely to respec into PvPers and go get popped generating some awesome kill mails. Finally pirates will have to think twice before jumping that "newbie" with a two week age hoping to troll them out before their trial is over. The list can really go on but I feel I would be wasting my time. Tell me again where the pay to win destruction of the game is? This all sounds absolutely amazing too me. CCP can not apply this fast enough.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP Evil Syndicate Alliance. 3	Posted - 2015.10.18 02:38:00 - [2] - Quote Holy crap I just realized something else on this. How many vets will forego a secondary training queue and instead perfectly spec their second and / or third slots for different roles to have a possible total of 3 perfect characters while only plexing 1 account?
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP Evil Syndicate Alliance. 3	Posted - 2015.10.18 02:45:00 - [3] - Quote Jadek Menaheim wrote: deezy dabest wrote: Holy crap I just realized something else on this. How many vets will forego a secondary training queue and instead perfectly spec their second and / or third slots for different roles to have a possible total of 3 perfect characters while only plexing 1 account? "You can have multiple accounts logged in at the same time, but not multiple characters from the same account, so if your alt is on the same account you would need to create a new account and then transfer your alt to that account." There's still value in multiple client play with manual input. Yes I understand. I was thinking more in terms of hauler characters, PI characters, wormhole holders, possibly even market trader characters, and surely some thing I am missing which do not require being multi logged. I fore see some alliances having quite a few shiny new Titan characters sitting around.