DUST Search - [Vehicles] - Tanks: Real Talk

Press Attache wrote:

Tebu Gan wrote:

Press Attache wrote:

Shield tanks are great against infantry now, still not capable of taking on a Maddie in a fight. You can't carry enough tank to be able to tangle with a dual damage modded rail and break them. Running pure gank leaves you vulnerable to not getting away without throwing a hull away.

Paired gank sicas aren't bad for what they are, but there isn't a Gunny fit involving a rail or missiles that can go toe to toe with a similarly turreted Maddy.

Never will if a maddie can run full tank plus turret augmentation.

A gunny on the other hand either splits tank with turret mods or just runs full tank (which still isn't comparable to a maddies tank) in all slots. I just don't understand how they thought adjusting recharge rates would somehow magically improve a gunnys game compared to a maddie. As it's obvious that was the least of their problems.

Oh well, I've tried and tried again to beat sense or reason into their heads. They just don't want to listen.

]

Low slot heat sinks would solve that, or only giving the Maddie two highs and admitting no racial place holders are coming. The Maddy with three highs will always win as long as there are no meaningful low slot options for a tank fight.


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Tebu Gan Capital Acquisitions LLC 1	Posted - 2015.10.14 15:23:00 - [1] - Quote Somebody give it to me straight. Strolling through the forums I find little mention of the recent changes to tanks and how it might have affected their game play. I myself have not delved into this new hotfix, but what little feedback I find has been utter crap. I find most of it is from people too caught up in the pub mentality (being pubs will ALWAYS be unbalanced) or inexperienced low SP players trying their hand at tanks and getting blown up in the process. I'm more interested in how things play out in a more balanced and competitive environment (compared to a pub match that is), PC. I'm well aware that I can go into a pub match and stomp every living thing into biomass or have the same done to me depending on what and who was put on my team. So is the gunnie still under performing in comparison to the maddie (I assume yes)? How has the meta shifted with AV and Vehicles? Before many maps didn't allow or need the heavy use of HAV's. Those that did though were often shut down by enemy AV or at least denied many area's of the map. Not always the case of course but a strong team tended to field infantry AV in the face of enemy armor to much greater effect on the overall match outcome. I'm also interested in some pub stuff like what's your average KD/R with tanks and how much of a contribution do you feel you made to the game overall. Compare that to how well you would do in a suit and how much of a contribution you make in said suit over your vehicle. Do you feel you are better off in a vehicle most times or a suit? Consider the win, if you lose by a large margin and you spent most of your time in a tank you were probably needed on the ground not in that vehicle. And please, AV users chip in here and tell me how you feel now taking on tanks as opposed to taking on tanks pre hotfix. This is how you go about making constructive feedback btw, enough with the crying. I'm more interested in how things are actually going out there and it requires a little thought. I'll respond to these questions soon myself.
Tebu Gan Capital Acquisitions LLC 1	Posted - 2015.10.14 16:15:00 - [2] - Quote Harbingerof War wrote: Well I'm mainly anti av and for taking tanks on that are standard or below driven by a new driver It's easier to take them on as the weak spots is bigger. For people that know what they are doing in advanced and proto it's a little more patience to take them out. They will constantly move and only stop if there is no av. So it's a blessing and pain at the same time. Shield tanks are also a little more durable now and a little harder to take out unless their modules are on cool down. Weakspots should be exactly the same size. If anything the gunnies is much easier to hit as it sticks out and off to the right where the maddie is squished into the tank, kinda hidden.
Tebu Gan Capital Acquisitions LLC 1	Posted - 2015.10.14 17:25:00 - [3] - Quote Press Attache wrote: Shield tanks are great against infantry now, still not capable of taking on a Maddie in a fight. You can't carry enough tank to be able to tangle with a dual damage modded rail and break them. Running pure gank leaves you vulnerable to not getting away without throwing a hull away. Paired gank sicas aren't bad for what they are, but there isn't a Gunny fit involving a rail or missiles that can go toe to toe with a similarly turreted Maddy. Never will if a maddie can run full tank plus turret augmentation. A gunny on the other hand either splits tank with turret mods or just runs full tank (which still isn't comparable to a maddies tank) in all slots. I just don't understand how they thought adjusting recharge rates would somehow magically improve a gunnys game compared to a maddie. As it's obvious that was the least of their problems. Oh well, I've tried and tried again to beat sense or reason into their heads. They just don't want to listen.
Tebu Gan Capital Acquisitions LLC 1	Posted - 2015.10.14 17:29:00 - [4] - Quote ID G4f wrote: I have to say there is more av options against you, i have had core granades thrown at me, massdrivers, flaylock. You definitely have to keep on the move more. These days i usually only pull out the hav to kill other hav's. I'd rather be on the ground. (Or flying, not to be effective, but cuz it is fun) I've felt the same way with before the changes, better off running infantry over vehicles. Do you feel with the extra AV options around that you are less effective on the field than before. I don't like the fact that many of these new AV options are actually designed to target infantry. So often you don't have to limit your ability to fight infantry as well. I suspect that while those guys running around with mass drivers and cores won't kill a tank outright, they do have the ability to drive one off and never need to sacrifice their chances against fellow infantry players.
Tebu Gan Capital Acquisitions LLC 1	Posted - 2015.10.14 18:02:00 - [5] - Quote Press Attache wrote: Tebu Gan wrote: Press Attache wrote: Shield tanks are great against infantry now, still not capable of taking on a Maddie in a fight. You can't carry enough tank to be able to tangle with a dual damage modded rail and break them. Running pure gank leaves you vulnerable to not getting away without throwing a hull away. Paired gank sicas aren't bad for what they are, but there isn't a Gunny fit involving a rail or missiles that can go toe to toe with a similarly turreted Maddy. Never will if a maddie can run full tank plus turret augmentation. A gunny on the other hand either splits tank with turret mods or just runs full tank (which still isn't comparable to a maddies tank) in all slots. I just don't understand how they thought adjusting recharge rates would somehow magically improve a gunnys game compared to a maddie. As it's obvious that was the least of their problems. Oh well, I've tried and tried again to beat sense or reason into their heads. They just don't want to listen. ] Low slot heat sinks would solve that, or only giving the Maddie two highs and admitting no racial place holders are coming. The Maddy with three highs will always win as long as there are no meaningful low slot options for a tank fight. Not to mention the disparity between CPU/PG usage of modules between the 2 types. Even if you moved heatsinks to low slots, you would still need to sacrifice your highs or a low to properly fit one. Where my maddie sacrifices very little and nothing at all fit with a blaster.
Tebu Gan Capital Acquisitions LLC 1	Posted - 2015.10.14 19:53:00 - [6] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: I'm not too good with tanks but I will say I appreciate the shield rep buff for Gunnlogis. Definitely in a better place now. I still feel like there's nothing I can do, either as a vehicle pilot or infantry, against an armor tank except use another armor tank. Either I get killed (very easy in a shield tank), the tank speeds off with a nitro (tank or infantry), or I'm completely ineffective (ADS). On that last point, small rails need a buff, but only for ADSs and LAVs as a way to counter tanks with vehicles other than tanks. Increasing the RoF bonus for the Incubus and creating LAV variants with turret bonuses and better hp would help this, along with changing heavy reps to have longer intervals between rep cycles (while maintaining current hp/s). Question that hasn't really been addressed by anyone as of yet. Those armor tanks, do you feel they are making your life miserable. IE, holding the point down, slaying out infantry, ect. Or do you feel like you could sort of ignore it and still effectively go about your business. I get the feeling with "the tank speeds off with a nitro", the main focus is killing the tank. As all modes involving tanks are objective based, a fleeing tank is just as good as a dead tank. One that allows for you to focus on the objective for a time. Many people seem so focused on killing the tank. Personally, if I see a tank I generally just work around it. If it somehow does magically impact me negatively in my goal, I'll pull AV and keep it drove off. If that doesn't work as well as I think I'll go to the last resort and blow the freakin thing up with a tank of my own or keep it occupied most of the match. But it was rare for it to ever come to that.
Tebu Gan Capital Acquisitions LLC 1	Posted - 2015.10.14 20:04:00 - [7] - Quote Tread Loudly 2 wrote: The gunnie is no longer under performing from my experience at least. If you make proper use of the regulator, booster n hardener it works rather well in surviving vs both tanks and AV unless you get nailed by a couple PLC's which is expected. AV to Vehicles still sit heavily on the AV side of things 1 PLC and 3 AV nades or a FG and PLC shot to an un-hardened tank and gg. As far as Pubs go I haven't lost any Cv.0's that I've bought from tankers to test out. However I have lost 2-3 GV.0's due to in-active hardeners. Running a suit is far more viable to play for a win vehicles don't have a well established role on the field right now other than a distraction from my experience. And as a current AV user I feel that tanks are even easier to kill after the hotfix and they shouldn't be built like wet paper sacks but we can't change that. You know the gunnie didn't do bad surviving against a maddie before the hotfix. It was more an issue that that's all you could really ever do against one, survive. There wasn't much chance at actually killing one. And I suspected the gunnie would do well mostly against enemy AV. Those shields are tough for everything but the PLC to break. But how in the world are you losing more maddies! Turn those hardeners on well before a fight, they last forever. And I forgot for a moment there you don't tank anymore so yeah they won't last nearly as long. And as far as the suit experience, I honestly preferred it greatly. I like actually running around and making a contribution to the match at hand. Most maps you can't really do much to help guard a point with a tank or even block off points of entry. Infantry just run right past you and get into cover never needing to leave. Why people deemed it necessary to destroy tanks outright I'll never know. They are the most expensive asset in the game and the least effective. But they are invulnerable to small arms fire they say! I'm invulnerable to small arms fire sitting in the redline too! Which is basically something you can do instead of tanking as you really aren't trying for a win if you want to pull a tank.
Tebu Gan Capital Acquisitions LLC 1	Posted - 2015.10.14 20:06:00 - [8] - Quote Press Attache wrote: My shield fits don't allow infantry any space to breathe. Provided the map allows me to affect hacks, there is no working around it, and no single suit is going to give me too much trouble. Not many maps allow for that. PLC to the sweet spot though would get you moving quite quickly I think though.