Looking at http://eve-offline.net/ you usually see anywhere from 100 to 400 new characters created per hour for Dust514 alone.

The thing is, they aren't in the game. At least not for long. The new player experience as is stands is pretty much 2-5 rounds in the Academy", then they are thrown into deep end against Proto stomping veterans.

One thing is a game being tough, that is a must as it'll be boring otherwise. But what Dust provides isn't a tough game for new characters, but rather an exercise in futility. And that is just not fun at all, especially not when combined with the rest of the Dust gameplay and progress system being what it is.

The question is, how can CCP and Dust keep new players around for long enough to make them feel like that actually can have fun playing?
Getting slaughtered repeatedly, while trying to figure out how to actually play the game certainly seems to have proven to be the wrong track.

The odd part is, that CCP already have a system in place that seem to work most of the time., and EVE have had that since the very beginning.
Players start in highsec space, and can venture into low and nulsec right away if they feel suicidal, however most stay in high sec to get at least the basics down, and get some SP into their character to at least get out of the "militia" level ship and fittings. (called "Civilian" modules)

Dust can't have PvE though, making that track somewhat difficult to just copy. However Dust could, and should allow lower tier players to choose if they want to go into matches in low sec, or stick to high sec with limits on gear and perhaps even player SP.

I proposed something similar some time ago, and the answer from other players was that there wouldn't be enough players around to fill matches. I've thought about that and I beg to differ. If there are 200+ new characters created every hour, there should be enough players to keep those lower tier matches full, while allowing the players to gain experience and SP as well as actually having fun.

The fact is, Dust is running out of players, as those that leave for various reasons aren't being replaced with new characters.

Looking at http://eve-offline.net/ you usually see anywhere from 100 to 400 new characters created per hour for Dust514 alone.

The thing is, they aren't in the game. At least not for long. The new player experience as is stands is pretty much 2-5 rounds in the Academy", then they are thrown into deep end against Proto stomping veterans.

One thing is a game being tough, that is a must as it'll be boring otherwise. But what Dust provides isn't a tough game for new characters, but rather an exercise in futility. And that is just not fun at all, especially not when combined with the rest of the Dust gameplay and progress system being what it is.

The question is, how can CCP and Dust keep new players around for long enough to make them feel like that actually can have fun playing?
Getting slaughtered repeatedly, while trying to figure out how to actually play the game certainly seems to have proven to be the wrong track.

The odd part is, that CCP already have a system in place that seem to work most of the time., and EVE have had that since the very beginning.
Players start in highsec space, and can venture into low and nulsec right away if they feel suicidal, however most stay in high sec to get at least the basics down, and get some SP into their character to at least get out of the "militia" level ship and fittings. (called "Civilian" modules)

Dust can't have PvE though, making that track somewhat difficult to just copy. However Dust could, and should allow lower tier players to choose if they want to go into matches in low sec, or stick to high sec with limits on gear and perhaps even player SP.

I proposed something similar some time ago, and the answer from other players was that there wouldn't be enough players around to fill matches. I've thought about that and I beg to differ. If there are 200+ new characters created every hour, there should be enough players to keep those lower tier matches full, while allowing the players to gain experience and SP as well as actually having fun.

The fact is, Dust is running out of players, as those that leave for various reasons aren't being replaced with new characters.

No PvE, no protected space for new people to play without being assrammed by full proto killing machines, until one of these two things is fixed, NPE will always be a disaster.

No PvE, no protected space for new people to play without being assrammed by full proto killing machines, until one of these two things is fixed, NPE will always be a disaster.

SP separation won't be a solid fix. My main is 17mil and I'm pretty terrible. But also I generally don't mind facing stompers, as to me even causing them to hesitate or retreat feels like a small victory. LoL has a good system set up. Bases a personal ranking on win/loss and how tough the opposition was. But CCP could also use KDR. So now it based on teamwork AND personal skill measured against the opposition. Squads would have a multiplier, as they tend to have better communication and teamwork.

I have made this risky suggestion before, but I'd like to make it again here. I think it is very applicable:

The Matchmaking Engine HAS improved the game substantially, (though it will NEVER be able to do what players are expecting and demanding be done---NO artificial software script can predict a human player's combined performance and motivation in the next match, and pair her up against an "equal" combi-performance-n-motivation human player). Scotty HAS raised itself to a level where the word "matchmaker" is falling into our subconscious while we're in the gameplay, instead of being up front in our minds all the time (maybe in another year, it will be as forgotten in the background as Aim Assist).

So with a certain amount of comfort and elbow room put into our matches now, there is also room to restore some of the "Progression Difficulty" Dust used to have for new players.

What I mean is, hold new players back longer (MUCH longer) in Battle Academy. Get the WP threshold back up to a level where 15 year old addicts that spend 16 + hours a day at their fav games, can't burn through and unlock their Academy diploma too fast to really understand anything about the game.

A certain percentage of "new players" will always be the passerby type---they don't sit on a game that lasts longer than 9 hours to beat; they want to have fun mixing it up on a new title every few weeks--and kudos for them. If that type of player is properly quarantined in Battle Academy long enough, she will have her 3 weeks of fun and leave, without stepping into post-Academy and accidentally derailing our FW or Dom gameplay.

Simultaneously, players looking to stay in Dust longterm would also have the chance to benefit from a much longer, tougher semester in Battle Academy phase, until they've exploited the HECK out of every Militia item around, memorized how they work by heart due to the much longer repetition of use, learned the subtle differences of advanced gear mixed with their Militia suits, and start understanding the value of networking with older players via mail and forum, so they can prepare for the deep end of the pool BEFORE they're under the water.

Battle Academy needs to be deeply lengthened back to where it used to be, OR further. The "new" kids playing starting this game rack WPs at a rate that doesn't give them any honest Academy time.

Bit you also don't want it set so an alt or new profile can remain indefinitely

Bit you also don't want it set so an alt or new profile can remain indefinitely

I think alts already skip the academy. In April Rattati said he rolled a new account to experience the academy and he saw lots of the same names going 20/0 then being recycled to get back in. Pretty sure he put a stop to that shortly after. He also indicated that an unusually high KD is a trigger to automatically graduate.

Sorry for the wall of text, this is a subject that I'm especially passionate about.

Looking at http://eve-offline.net/ you usually see anywhere from 100 to 400 new characters created per hour for Dust514 alone.

The thing is, they aren't in the game. At least not for long. The new player experience as is stands is pretty much 2-5 rounds in the Academy", then they are thrown into deep end against Proto stomping veterans.

One thing is a game being tough, that is a must as it'll be boring otherwise. But what Dust provides isn't a tough game for new characters, but rather an exercise in futility. And that is just not fun at all, especially not when combined with the rest of the Dust gameplay and progress system being what it is.

The question is, how can CCP and Dust keep new players around for long enough to make them feel like that actually can have fun playing?
Getting slaughtered repeatedly, while trying to figure out how to actually play the game certainly seems to have proven to be the wrong track.

The odd part is, that CCP already have a system in place that seem to work most of the time., and EVE have had that since the very beginning.
Players start in highsec space, and can venture into low and nulsec right away if they feel suicidal, however most stay in high sec to get at least the basics down, and get some SP into their character to at least get out of the "militia" level ship and fittings. (called "Civilian" modules)

Dust can't have PvE though, making that track somewhat difficult to just copy. However Dust could, and should allow lower tier players to choose if they want to go into matches in low sec, or stick to high sec with limits on gear and perhaps even player SP.

I proposed something similar some time ago, and the answer from other players was that there wouldn't be enough players around to fill matches. I've thought about that and I beg to differ. If there are 200+ new characters created every hour, there should be enough players to keep those lower tier matches full, while allowing the players to gain experience and SP as well as actually having fun.

The fact is, Dust is running out of players, as those that leave for various reasons aren't being replaced with new characters.

If CCP chooses not to "teach" new players what the game is about with a deep wordy tutorial, then the only other way to get them to become helpful players efficiently (not counting those players who just have a knack for learning this stuff on their own--kudos for them!)... is to "herd" them like cattle or mice into the desired 'good co-op' behavior.

New players does not exist.
Only alts.

There is roughly 2 new players per 100 new characters. The rest are indeed alts.

There is roughly 2 new players per 100 new characters. The rest are indeed alts.