MINA Longstrike
Kirjuun Heiian
3
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Posted - 2015.08.16 11:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
Just skimming at the moment, but I cant help but feel that if you're using an assault as the 'benchmark' for plasma cannons... they'll be ABSOLUTELY insane when a commando gets a hold of them. Yes they're hard to use but if you've got a kubo's now you can kill a gunnlogi in 3 shots (provided you hit them all).
Same problem with swarm launchers. The reload speed (and potentially damage bonuses) do throw TTK out of whack.
That said, breach forge IS one of my favorite forge guns (when not doing CFW I tend to play in smaller squads, and it's usually myself and a buddy attempting to take on the world and deal with all the problems that blueberries wont. Two breach forges can do horrible things to vehicles).
Final edit: I'm not seeing much actual discussion of vehicles or time to kill values... found the spreadsheets. I'm not on board with a lot of your ideas... these numbers are approached from a 'single aver vs single tank' angle and while I feel that yes a single aver should be able to destroy a vehicle in a semi-reasonable timeframe, vehicles either leave (which leads to frustration on the aver's part) or there's multiple avers and that leads to unbelievably short TTK's on vehicle users part (which leads to frustration because they just lost more than they're likely to make in the match). Overall there are a lot of problems with this AND i'm not particularly pleased with the requests for new weapons though heavies certainly deserve some.
In particular I dislike the "zealot" type weapon, and the anti-material rifle. AV sniper rifles opens a huge bad can of worms for vehicles (pilots have been complaining about high burst damage instakilling their expensive vehicles and rendering glitches like invisible swarms for FOREVER).
One of the biggest problems with vehicle design currently is that they are typically ONLY 'fun' or interesting for a single part in an engagement (if that at all) and they need a metric boatload more work on more nuanced play and counterplay. Swarms are a perfect example of the problem, they're an incredibly low player skill 'point at target' mechanic, it's mindless on the part of the person shooting them and it's frustrating on the part of the vehicle user because they often CANNOT do anything about swarms (usually in escaping but sometimes in engaging). On the infantry end the current 'meta' tank fits are nigh indestructible, rep insane amounts incredibly quickly and simply zoom off once their cooldowns come into play.
I think we should probably just write 'waves of opportunity' off as an entirely failed design concept and start over again. Cheap moderate hp vehicles, all infantry primary weapons (aside from purpose built av weapons and some sidearm exceptions) able to do 10-20% damage to vehicle, some efficiency tweaking on plasma cannons (75%), swarm launchers losing lock-on (and instead becoming something similar to plasma cannon but with a small av-grenade like seek range), some forge tweaking (and breach forge rework) are just initial points on my mind. I think we'd end up in a much healthier place for vehicles.
Now... all that said. Change is bad and I hate it, maybe its nostalgia goggles but it seems like vehicles vs av balance has gotten worse every ****ing time it's been attempted. I no longer pull out vehicles unless I absolutely have to, because I've simply lost all passion for them - they are not fun, they are not engaging. They are frustrating to encounter because two or three tanks (or a dropship on TEH HIGH SPAHT!) will prettymuch ruin a match unless it's on a socket that they cannot access and unless you play like a ****ing coward you will go deeply isk negative because a 20 second (or less) engagement resulting from a single mistake or quite simply being surprised will kill you (and your fun). Dropships and LAV's are ****ing coffins that are used either to get places fast or to get onto high spots. There is so very little that remains interesting about vehicles in this game anymore. They lack any meaningful roles beyond "get place faster" or "drive around and kill everything" and it seems like nearly everything is stacked against people attempting to be useful with them. If anything makes me quit dust, it will be the unsatisfactory vehicle (and anti-vehicle) gameplay... I was initially interested in dust because I went "whoa you can drive a tank ALL THE TIME? thats AWESOME!", and then upon playing I found out that vehicles are murderously expensive and ruinously stupid to play because dust is hilariously infantry centric.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.
I have a few alts.
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